Large Scale Central

The American Form of Government

General Discussion
#41
Ric Golding said:
HJ,

Not to stir the pot, but your statement -

"In short: please deliver verified proof (proof that is acceptable as official, verified documentation by your US authorities) that your statement has any merit. "

I think that is all anyone is asking for. Proof “that is acceptable as Official” that BHO is qualified to even be a dog catcher.


Ric,

Let me be charitable:

I believe many things can happen in the USA, but I don’t believe for one second that the authorities at the highest level (remember who was in charge during the November election and all the primaries at state level prior to that!) would not check, re-check and then check umpteen times more the credentials of the candidates for President.

T.W. would call your exercise “grasping at straws”.

BTW Kenya is as much an Arab country as Indonesia or Pakistan.

#42

There are as of my last checking, 16 separate lawsuits to lower state and federal courts in the USA asking for such proof of eligibility.

Much documented proofs that are available of BHO’s birth outside of the USA and subsequent Indonesian citizenship. The only “proof” shown to date is a scanned (proven) forged document, Certificate Of Live Birth from the state of Hawaii. This document, if authentic, is not the same as a Long Form Birth Certificate, such as issued to other citizens born in Hawaii in 1961.

#43
Quote:
A significant and understandable fuss has been made about Obama becoming the first African-American President. Obama is arguably not, however, “African-American.” His father, Barack Obama, Sr., is allegedly one-eighth African (on his mother’s side, from the Luo tribe in Kenya) and his father’s remaining ancestry is purported to be Arabic. Candidate Obama is thus more accurately referred to as “Arab-American.” Obama is not (like many black Americans) the descendant of African slaves owned by white American slave-owners. Having Arab ancestors, Obama is, in fact, most likely a descendant of slave owners, because Arabs have for many centuries traditionally owned slaves and been active slave traders. Further, the names Barack and Hussein are of Arab origin. (There is insufficient publicly-available evidence to state with certainty the percentages of Obama’s national ancestries.)http://www.colony14.net/id41.html
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/front/6145787.html
#44

HJ,

If you want to be charitable - send money or trains.

Chicago politics have never let a rule or a law slow them down and they certainly wouldn’t start now.

“T.W. would call your exercise “grasping at straws”.”

What’s a T. W.?

“BTW Kenya is as much an Arab country as Indonesia or Pakistan.”

I didn’t say anything about this but all I know is that it doesn’t automatically make you a US citizen.

As I said, I really wasn’t wanting to get in your daily arguments by stirring the pot, but I did want to draw attention to having you re-read what you wrote.

50% of this Country do not like the current leaders anymore than the other 50% didn’t like the last leaders. I believe the stock market is still showing a vote of confidence as to what most people feel about the current gang of thieves.

You and the other guys can go ahead and continue beating your heads against the wall without me. Enjoy :wink:

#45
David Hill said:
There are as of my last checking, 16 separate lawsuits to lower state and federal courts in the USA asking for such proof of eligibility.

Much documented proofs that are available of BHO’s birth outside of the USA and subsequent Indonesian citizenship. The only “proof” shown to date is a scanned (proven) forged document, Certificate Of Live Birth from the state of Hawaii. This document, if authentic, is not the same as a Long Form Birth Certificate, such as issued to other citizens born in Hawaii in 1961.


Come on David,

Show us the proof, not some speculation either on your or some other disgruntled wingnut’s part!

#46

Ric,

T.W. refers to our esteemed Tony Walsham, horns and all! :wink: :slight_smile:

#47
Brian Donovan said:
Isn't it amazing how this crap comes out when a black democrat is elected President and nothing over the past 8 years when Bush/Cheney were busy consolidating as much power as they could in the executive branch?

-Brian


Brian,

What does BHO being black have to do with anything? Are you a racist?

It is axiomatic that only the left is concerned about things like race.

#48

HJ,

Thank you. THat “TW” thing would have bothered me all day. :wink:

#49

HJ, I can provide links to the lawsuits if you like. The legal documents that are not being produced by Obama are a matter of public record as are Obama’s school records showing his citizenship as Indonesian. An Indonesian citizen can not be President of the united States.

Also missing are Obama’s college admission records, which may provide answers to how HE registered his citizenship and was able to pay for the high tuition rates. Both colleges offered scholarships to exchange students, including those from Indonesia. (Only a speculation.)

In a situation this important, producing these legal documents to provide proof would, I am sure you would agree since you demand proof of most other things, be of the utmost priority.

#50
David Hill said:
HJ, I can provide links to the lawsuits if you like. The legal documents that are not being produced by Obama are a matter of public record as are Obama's school records showing his citizenship as Indonesian. An Indonesian citizen can not be President of the united States.

Also missing are Obama’s college admission records, which may provide answers to how HE registered his citizenship and was able to pay for the high tuition rates. Both colleges offered scholarships to exchange students, including those from Indonesia. (Only a speculation.)

In a situation this important, producing these legal documents to provide proof would, I am sure you would agree since you demand proof of most other things, be of the utmost priority.


He’s got you by the short and curlies there, HJ. :lol: Remember, attention to detail.

#51

I have absolutely no idea as to where Obama was born. It seems that no one else has any idea either.

There are numerous places such as passport applications that require or accept a “Certified birth certificate issued by the city, county or state” as positive identification. The U.S. Passport Office rules say “A certified birth certificate has a registrar’s raised, embossed, impressed or multicolored seal, registrar’s signature, and the date the certificate was filed with the registrar’s office, which must be within 1 year of your birth. Please note, some short (abstract) versions of birth certificates may not be acceptable for passport purposes.”

When required, I simply get and present said certified birth certificate, thus settling any questions as to my nationality or origin. Is that too much to ask of our President, who’s Constitutionally mandated job qualifications state “No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President; neither shall any person be eligible to that office who shall not have attained to the age of thirty-five years, and been fourteen years a resident within the United States.” (Age and Citizenship requirements - US Constitution, Article II, Section 1.)

Having that documentation available would completely derail any criticsm. Not producing it gives rise to all kinds of divisive arguments which sully the office and the person occupying it.

Happy RRing,

Jerry

#52
Steve Featherkile said:
David Hill said:
HJ, I can provide links to the lawsuits if you like. The legal documents that are not being produced by Obama are a matter of public record as are Obama's school records showing his citizenship as Indonesian. An Indonesian citizen can not be President of the united States.

Also missing are Obama’s college admission records, which may provide answers to how HE registered his citizenship and was able to pay for the high tuition rates. Both colleges offered scholarships to exchange students, including those from Indonesia. (Only a speculation.)

In a situation this important, producing these legal documents to provide proof would, I am sure you would agree since you demand proof of most other things, be of the utmost priority.


He’s got you by the short and curlies there, HJ. :lol: Remember, attention to detail.

Steve,

In all your wisdom(?) are you trying to tell me that all of this has not been checked, rechecked and then checked again for umpteen times by those who are responsible? As I said before, I believe there are many things that happen in the USA but this one is an absolute crank scenario. I guess you read all the papers at the grocery check out, too, do you?

BTW so far not one iota of verifiable proof from David, but that’s exactly as expected. Or will the next excuse be that all the evidence has been sealed pending the hearings before which ever court? :lol: :lol: As my good Canadian, German and Swiss friends would say: “Not even the Americans can be that stupid!”

PS Not withstanding all we get to read here, going by the posts there must be only morons elected to office in the USA - doesn’t matter which level, from town to county and on up the ladder. Which of course would have any rational person asking: “Who elects all these morons?” :wink: :slight_smile: :wink:

#53

You don’t think it can happen, HJ? I’m not saying it did, but I’m not dismissing it, either.

By your logic, there are no innocent men in prison, and no guilty ones walking around free.

Attention to details, my friend, is what you said.

#54

Steve,

Attention to detail is what I count on!

#55

HJ
Sen. Alan Keyes, whom just happens to be black, has filed a lawsuit demanding that BHO produce his birth certificate. Sen. Keyes also ran for the WH and is not playing a sore looser. He has very serious doubts about where the man was born. If it is discovered that he is not a “Natural Born” and the Supreme Court does not do anything about it, then we are very broken. Our Constitution by which we have lived for the past 200 plus years just becomes so much scrap paper. His being BLACK has NOTHING to do with the issue. Arnold Schwarzenegger IS NOT ELIGLIBLE to be the President of the United States because he was born in Austria. Re you question " Not even Americans can be that stupid?" Sadly they sure as hell are! You should read some of the on the street interviews with voters as to why they voted for BHO, McCain,Huckabee, etc. Stupid is not a strong enough word, sad to say. Reflects on our broken education system. In addition, as far as I can tell from reading many words on this,ABSOUTELY NOTHING was checked out as to his eligibility. Roadblocks were being thrown up very early in the campaign. McCain was checked out and found to be eligible even though he was born in the U,S, Canal (Panama) Zone. Note U.S. If he had been born anywhere else his father was stationed with the US Navy, then he probably would not have been eligible. Many children born in Germany, Japan and else where to US Servicemen and women (being PC here) are not because they were born on foreign territory and have birth certificates from that country. They also had to become Naturalized Citizens upon returning to CONUS. They are, by the Constitution, not Natural Born Citizens. You would think that BOH would be proud to show his birth certificate, college records etc if he were legit. After all he is now public property and is responsible to the American public voters and non voters alike.
Noel

#56

Noel,

I feel for you!

Should it turn out that Obama isn’t eligible, the whole of the USofA will be laughing stock of the world. The little 2000 fiasco with the “hanging chads” and all that good stuff will be just a snicker.

I took the time and read some of the sources that pop up when one googles “Lawsuit regarding Obama’s eligibility”; it would be absolutely hilarious, were it not for the fact that it indicates just how “weird” things are in the USA!
I would also be interested to read the reasoning of the verdict in all the cases that have so far been dimissed.

Of course there is another “minor wrinkle” on this matter, this has been on the bubble since August of last year, plenty of time to assure and re-assure that facts are facts - as opposed to wanko fiction - and yet … and yet! Who exactly are these people and what drives them?

#57
Hans-Joerg Mueller said:
Noel,

I feel for you!

Should it turn out that Obama isn’t eligible, the whole of the USofA will be laughing stock of the world. The little 2000 fiasco with the “hanging chads” and all that good stuff will be just a snicker.

I took the time and read some of the sources that pop up when one googles “Lawsuit regarding Obama’s eligibility”; it would be absolutely hilarious, were it not for the fact that it indicates just how “weird” things are in the USA!
I would also be interested to read the reasoning of the verdict in all the cases that have so far been dimissed.

Of course there is another “minor wrinkle” on this matter, this has been on the bubble since August of last year, plenty of time to assure and re-assure that facts are facts - as opposed to wanko fiction - and yet … and yet! Who exactly are these people and what drives them?


Some of the suits that have been dismissed were because the courts said “the plaintiff had no standing”, meaning he was not harmed by the possible illegal action.

There is a suit now before the court by a retired US Army Colonel stating he does have standing because he could be called up by Presidential Orders.

Others simply request the proof of citizenship, which only makes sense. The defendants are Barrack Hussein Obama II a.k.a. Barry Soreto, a.k.a. Barry Dunham a.k.a. Barrack Dunham, the US Congress, the Democratic National Committee, former Vice-President Cheney (as president of the Senate).

#58

HJ,
You are right. Laughing stock. When Gore conceded to Bush in '00 that should have been the end of it, but we (citizens) were drug through the mud too. Don’t you think we weren’t laughing at the guy with his glasses on his head looking cross-eyed at a hanging shad??? What idiocy. What is really sad here now it that a honest, middle income individual cannot afford to run for higher office because it take millions of US D’s just to get in the running. We will never see a common sense, reasonable, intelligent , deeply honest individual in the White House in my life time and if we should last long enough, neither will my grandchildren. Just too costly. That is until the next revolution as Jefferson recommended should happen now and then. We have had peaceful change of government for the past 230 plus year but that may come to a grinding halt because the common man is getting very fed up with this whole bit of nonsense. We can only hope for a completely new political party emerging in the next couple of decades which has occurred more than once in our brief history.
As to the Supreme Court dismissing these very legitimate lawsuits as to eligibility, I would like to know why the Court met with the man behind closed doors. Very unusual and unprecedented and ethically questionable. I may be wrong, but I do not believe this has ever happened before.
I think what is driving all of this is BHO’s refusal to produce a genuine birth certificate and other records. What concerns me more is who is controlling him. We all know Bush was controlled by Cheney ( another dog’s hind leg) and others of daddy’s cabinet. Notice that his cabinet was a mirror image of Bush I ? Chicago political mob comes to mind and being from the Midwest that frightens me. Illinois and Chicago in particular is crooked as a dog’s hind leg when it comes to politics. More so than anywhere else. I had a college room mate whose father worked directly for Mayor Daley. The first Daley. Very scary to say the least. We farm boys just didn’t know how dirty it really was. He told us stories we thought to be total fabrication until presented with the evidence. He put himself through school painting bridges over the Chicago River, which never were finished and started over every summer. Graft, corruption, murder, ballot stuffing, the whole nine yards.
I think Blagojevich has shown that very clearly. Yes, things are weird here in the lower 50 and will get a lot weirder. God Help Us because no one else will.
Noel

#59

Yeah, yeah David, I read all that, along with a slew of the other funny stuff. This all reminds me of the “any diversion to keep people’s minds of what is really going on” tactic.

For instance real problems: what happens when the bonds fall due that have been underwritten by the Chinese? What happens when this whole economic mess - I’m sure you’re familiar with the L-shaped recession scenario - keeps on going and going and going? Etc. etc.

Substance of Government will then trump Form of Government, you can bet whatever money you have left on that!

#60
Noel Crawford said:
................

As to the Supreme Court dismissing these very legitimate lawsuits as to eligibility, I would like to know why the Court met with the man behind closed doors. Very unusual and unprecedented and ethically questionable. I may be wrong, but I do not believe this has ever happened before.

…


Noel,

It was just as unprecedented that the Supreme Court “crowned” a President. BTW the hanging chad fiasco along with the “coronation” was absolutely peanuts when compared to all the goodwill - around the globe - that was pissed away by the last two administrations.