Curmudgeon mcneely said:
One of the goals of reporting issues (and often fixes) is not to bash, denigrate, or any of that.
It’s to get the manufacturer on board to get the issues fixed, to educate the manufacturer so it won’t happen again.
None of which relates directly to the topic of whether not AC is going out of business. That’s not an “issue” that can be fixed by posting speculation/gossip/rumors or even alleged facts on some forum.
Ralph Berg said:
Warranty, parts and repairs, Ray. That’s why it matters if a company is still around tomorrow.
Especially if you have a Revo, multiple receivers and the transmitter takes a dump
True, it does affect warranty issues, but frankly I don’t really but a lot of faith in warranties on toys anyway. And that’s what hobby products are, toys. Maybe “big boy’s toys” but still toys.
If a company is still in business but doesn’t honor their warranties, that’s one thing. But if they go out of business and you have a warranty issue with some hobby item, well, it’s not the end of the world.
Ray Dunakin said:
And that’s what hobby products are, toys. Maybe “big boy’s toys” but still toys.
Very true Ray.
That’s why I never make a hobby a business.
Or invest so much money or time that I take it too serious 
Most of us have hobbies to relax and escape from every day problems.
Others take the hobby more serious.
There’s room for everyone.
Participate in the aspects you enjoy…and leave the rest for others to pontificate 
Ralph
But Ray if you only have one or two locos from Brand X then maybe it is no big deal. But what if you have THOUSANDS of dollars sunk into Brand X? I don’t have any Mallets or Dash-9s but I have quite alot of drive brick under my bashes that I now might not be able to replace. And I am on the easy end of this because I don’t have a ton of money wrapped up in expensive collections of the things but many here have quite extensive and expensive collections that now face the prospect of becoming unsupported if AC goes under and takes 3 years to get sorted out.
Thats a pretty big deal to alot of folks, thats also why we are trying to discuss the situation so if something happens its not a shock.
Ray Dunakin said:
Curmudgeon mcneely said:
One of the goals of reporting issues (and often fixes) is not to bash, denigrate, or any of that.
It’s to get the manufacturer on board to get the issues fixed, to educate the manufacturer so it won’t happen again.
None of which relates directly to the topic of whether not AC is going out of business. That’s not an “issue” that can be fixed by posting speculation/gossip/rumors or even alleged facts on some forum.
No, but it relates specifically to your comment.
Directly:
“Protect you from what??? In what was does all this blather protect anyone from anything???”
I would suggest you remember what you write so you can understand responses.
Unbelievable.
Ray, likewise, my post of 7:02 pm is in direct response to your “challenge” in your post of 5:41 pm, the “protect you from what”…
Ray, I know you, you have about 4 locos I believe and have bashed and modified them.
I have about 40 or 50… reliability and what to look out for, and knowing what problems I will encounter makes a big difference to me.
My web site is dedicated to help others make informed purchasing decisions and to help correct problems.
I think your arguments and comments have become a moving target, but when your responses are in print for all to see, it’s pretty hard to deny you asked a question and then gave people grief for answering it.
Take a deep breath and look at the facts and history. If you don’t know the history, you can read about it in many places, or take the word of people who have been through it.
Greg
Greg Elmassian said:
I think your arguments and comments have become a moving target, but when your responses are in print for all to see, it’s pretty hard to deny you asked a question and then gave people grief for answering it.
Take a deep breath and look at the facts and history. If you don’t know the history, you can read about it in many places, or take the word of people who have been through it.
Greg
My question was how does this blather protect anyone from anything. I guess I should have been more specific, and said “this blather about AC going out of business”. The answers I got were about past issues with products and had nothing to do with this speculation about AC’s financial position.
As for owning a lot of AC products, I don’t see how that relates. If I remember correctly the warranty on their products is only for a year, at most. Surely you guys didn’t buy all your AC products within the past year.
In any case, since you already OWN the products, it’s too late to “protect” yourself by not buying them. The only possible way you could protect your ability to receive parts or service in the future is to have AC survive, and the only way that you, as an individual consumer, might have an effect is by encouraging others to buy AC products. Trying to scare people away from AC’s products has the opposite effect.
If anyone has any of the old Aristo 27Mh onboard receivers, and wants to get rid of them; I’ll be glad to have them. I’d even like any of the 27Mh transmitters.
I’ll pay postage…
Fred
Ray Dunakin said:
My question was how does this blather protect anyone from anything. I guess I should have been more specific, and said “this blather about AC going out of business”. The answers I got were about past issues with products and had nothing to do with this speculation about AC’s financial position.
As for owning a lot of AC products, I don’t see how that relates. If I remember correctly the warranty on their products is only for a year, at most. Surely you guys didn’t buy all your AC products within the past year.
In any case, since you already OWN the products, it’s too late to “protect” yourself by not buying them. The only possible way you could protect your ability to receive parts or service in the future is to have AC survive, and the only way that you, as an individual consumer, might have an effect is by encouraging others to buy AC products. Trying to scare people away from AC’s products has the opposite effect.
Yes…being more specific probably would have helped. Protecting yourself depends on knowing what can happen, how to fix it…and not necessarily with “factory” parts.
I personally do not believe the brand is going to disappear.
I firmly believe that the brand will continue.
Once you own the product, you need to know how to fix them.
Look at the poor folks who own LGB. Gone, Simba Dickie not making US prototype (for now), Walthers isn’t interested in parts or service…
Yet, folks like Axel Tillman and others have sourced parts.
To revert, just remember, denying any issues with locomotives exists does not cosmically make them disappear.
Using websites or forums to figure out what to do are very helpful.
I used to be quite helpful, but the continual “bashing” comments really soured the process.
If that is the goal, to “bash” those who would help into silence, then those who achieve their goals will find when their items fail, there is no one to help.
I hope your equipment stays fully functional.
Really.
TOC
Ray, there is a 5 year warranty on Aristo locos, and I do intend to buy more, so I don’t intend to just saran wrap myself from reality and stop time and hope for the best.
Plus, as I stated, I have a 500 page web site mostly devoted to helping others.
And indeed, I am taking steps to buy things based on the uncertainty of Aristo. That is an intelligent response to the facts, as opposed to maybe sticking my head in the sand and doing nothing and hoping for the best.
I really think you are looking at all of this from your own personal point of view, not intending to buy a lot more, or that you have very little product impacted by the scarcity of parts and products.
That’s fine for you, but putting that “perspective” on everyone else, especially first time buyers or newbies is a bit of a self-centered perspective.
Again, maybe my perspective is self-centered too, I need more product from Aristo and also was hoping many of the promises would be kept. Nick and I both have almost $2,000 worth of hardware that was promised to be fixed/replaced and this has not happened, and the person promising this has a last name of Polk. We both have strong interest in Aristo NOT going under.
so, perhaps your perspective might be different if you were in someone else’s shoes.
Based on all the Aristo products I own, I’d be a fool to want to facilitate Aristo’s demise, let alone enjoy it, but I also need to protect my investment and keep my locos running.
Regards, Greg
Hmmmmm, I wonder what the page count will be when all is said and nothing done?
Back to the garden, shoveling dirt in the shade.
If nothing is accomplished but to make a distinction between bashing and factual observations
OR
Even one person gets it straight about what has really been said as opposed to exaggerations, then I’m happy.
Greg
Like Greg stated,no one wants AC to go under.
We all have warrantee work that has not been honored, even when replacements have been available. I have sent back a Revo transmitter which was DOA twice. Both times shipped back unreparird. Scott said they would replace it when a new order came in. Last order had only packaged kits with receiver and smoke. So it was not replaced.
But not only do we as consumers have a stake, but so do retailers. I have over 20 AC locomotives that were donated to the handicap facilities I help support by repairing them. They mostly came from retailers who ended up eating them as AC had no parts to repair them nor was AC willing to take them back after a few months. This not only pissed off the retailers, but the customer left the store unhappy. Most likely not to return. Does it turn off many potential customers from the hobby causing injury to their product?
So yes, Ray, Many people have a stake in the outcome consumers, retailers and other manufacturers.
Like Ralph(a strong AC insider) stated" So is Lewis supposed to base his decision based upon what is best for the hobby? It does not matter if Lewis sucked millions out of the company to retire?" I think Ralph’s comment says it all.
Hopefully, these discussions will convince Lewis to replenish some of the funds or be willing to entertain offers from another company that wishes to revive the AC line.
Ray said, (Quote: “In any case, since you already OWN the products, it’s too late to “protect” yourself by not buying them. The only possible way you could protect your ability to receive parts or service in the future is to have AC survive, and the only way that you, as an individual consumer, might have an effect is by encouraging others to buy AC products. Trying to scare people away from AC’s products has the opposite effect.” (end quote)
Ray,
to begin with, if you already own an Aristo product then at some point in time you will most likely require repair/replacement parts so discussion IS important.Secondly, if you actually read rather than skimmed the post responses in this thread and the now LOCKED thread, it has been stated that people did encourage others to purchase Aristo products, but SUPPLY was the issue. No point encouraging others to purchase what is NOT available.
I would have purchased hundreds of dollars of stainless rail, but it seems to have gone the way of the Dodo bird, killed off to extinction. A manufacturer has a RESPONSIBILITY to his consumer base. He produced the item and is responsible to support the market he created.
Maybe if Aristo put more money into product supply and not endless research for products that never got to market then Lewis could have enjoyed his retirement in Florida. His company, HIS responsibility.
thomas prevost said:
Like Ralph(a strong AC insider) stated" So is Lewis supposed to base his decision based upon what is best for the hobby? It does not matter if Lewis sucked millions out of the company to retire?" I think Ralph’s comment says it all.
Hopefully, these discussions will convince Lewis to replenish some of the funds or be willing to entertain offers from another company that wishes to revive the AC line.
If you’re going to quote me, please use the “quote” button so that it is accurate.
I’m not an “insider” anywhere. I’m generally on the outside looking in
You obviously have me confused with someone else
The point being…it’s his business to do with as he wishes.
We can grumble all we want, but in the end it accomplishes very little
Ralph
Greg Elmassian said:
If nothing is accomplished but to make a distinction between bashing and factual observations
Greg
If you don’t like the product then don’t buy it? I personally bash it in a different way.
Looks like some people really need to get a life and an additonal hobby or two or maybe even three!
Hans-Joerg Mueller said:
Looks like some people really need to get a life and an additonal hobby or two or maybe even three!
No kidding ! Nothing but an ego thread now.
I AGREE!!!