Assuming the USA Trains lubricant includes antioxidant properties, perhaps it’s better to re-identify it as:
“Conductively Conducive Lubricant”
-Ted
Thanks Ted for answering my question, Bill
As a spoiler, in the case of the USAT locos, one of the power pickups is the metal eyelet in the journal. if you used real conductive grease there, I could see how it might help, but since the weight of the loco is carried on these journals, the pressure seems to be sufficient for good electrical contact without going to an electrically conductive grease. The fact that these journals pick up dirt and grit easily and get really messy would worry me some that the grease could get in some other area, albeit in this case, that is a fair distance away.
Michael Kirrene said:
Just took a gander at my USA Trains EMD GP-9 and NW-2 owners manuals. Here’s what they say:
Lubrication:
The locomotive has three lubrication points. Sideframe Journal Box: The axel ends fit into brash bushings which bring power to the locomotive should periodically be cleaned out and lubricated with a small amount of USA Trains electrically conductive lubricant (USA Trains p/n R50002). Use only our conductive lubricant to avoid loss of electrical contact which could cause your locomotive to loose power or run erratically. Frequency of lubrication depends on operating conditions. Axel lubrication: Two drops of oil (recommended Hob-E-Lube #HL653) placed on all four contact points where the axel enters the gear box. Gear box lubrication: Should not have to be lubricated, but after 100 hours of operation, apply Hob-E-Lube Moly Grease to the gears on the axel only. Do not apply grease to the electrical contacts inside the gear box or you may hinder the electrical contacts required for smooth operation.
Are there not wires on the side frames to conduct electricity into the main board? What is a “brash bushing” and do they conduct electricity ? Perhaps I’m missing something or perhaps this is a just bitch rant that is not needed with declining manufacturers?
brash = brass. We all understood, and the rest of us are not forum spelling police.
I called it a “metal eyelet” because it has a lip that holds the ring terminal, but I guess I call it that since Aristo does the same thing on many of it’s power pickups. (so as not to confuse anyone, this is the power pickup from the end of the axle)
The hob-e-lube part number is their ultra-light oil, and I disagree, I use the heavy oil, their “gear oil” because there is a lot of clearance between the axle bearing and the axle. I like the hob-e-lube moly grease, although the “gel grease” that is sold by various manufacturers is less messy and really clings to the gears, does not get thrown off (it is thixatropic).
Greg
Greg Elmassian said:
brash = brass. We all understood, and the rest of us are not forum spelling police.
Clearly, I did not understand so when you stated “WE all understood” I suppose you are disregarding me? I’m thankful that the rest that understood unlike me are not forum spelling police “which has no relation to the original posters question” as you strive for Greg.
Yeah, Joker, you thought it was cute to bring my misspelling out in the open. Everybody else pretty much got the jist of the post. And with exception to the misspelling, everything else was taken word for word from the USA Trains owner’s manual. So take your beef up with Charlie Ro, eh? Yeah, you obviously missed something - it wasn’t a bitch rant at all; not even close. “Not needed with declining manufacturers?” Last I heard USA Trains was doing just fine and is not in decline.
Greg Elmassian said:
Yes it is… we are assuming they mean electrically and not thermally or optically (https://www.largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-wink.gif)
EXACTLY !! …However it is still considered Conductive grease.
Wow! The discussion way back when it was Aristocraft’s Conductive grease was almost this fun!
A word of caution, they went under!(https://www.largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-surprised.gif)
Watch out Charlie!(https://www.largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-tongue-out.gif)(https://www.largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-laughing.gif)(https://www.largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-money-mouth.gif)
Even that grease was inconsistent. Ted had a bottle that was NOT conductive, but it cracked plastic. I was sent a bottle for evaluation (unsolicited) from Lewis Polk and it was indeed conductive, but mildly, as I remember about 18-22k for somewhere around 1/8" (stuff intended as conductive is usually ~100-150 ohms per centimeter)…
In any case, my bottle of ElectraLube actually ate through it’s original bottle. I picked it up from the shelf one day, and the bottom fell off in a pile of grey goo. It was hilarious (after I cleaned up the mess).
Greg
Greg Elmassian said:
Even that grease was inconsistent. Ted had a bottle that was NOT conductive, but it cracked plastic. I was sent a bottle for evaluation (unsolicited) from Lewis Polk and it was indeed conductive, but mildly, as I remember about 18-22k for somewhere around 1/8" (stuff intended as conductive is usually ~100-150 ohms per centimeter)…
In any case, my bottle of ElectraLube actually ate through it’s original bottle. I picked it up from the shelf one day, and the bottom fell off in a pile of grey goo. It was hilarious (after I cleaned up the mess).
Greg
Greg,
Very timely topic. You probably remember the nice headlight “jewelry” I added to my Baldwin electrics.
I have a small issue with the chrome plated reflector. The door that holds the glass lens applies pressure to that reflector against the edge of the headlight body. It is a pretty snug fit and makes a good electrical connection. Could I use a conductive grease to put between the surfaces of the body and the reflector to “guarantee” a more positive connection? Thanks for any input :).
Sure, just be careful not to get it to the “center contact”… usually the biggest problem with true conductive grease is getting it where you DON’T want it!
I would submit a thin coat of any automotive wheel bearing grease would probably do as well, as I would assume this is not a high amperage situation.
Also, the contact between the bulb and reflector might be considered, but now you are getting near the other contact.
Clearly the chrome is not oxidizing, but what is the body/mating surface made of?
Greg
Greg Elmassian said:
Sure, just be careful not to get it to the “center contact”… usually the biggest problem with true conductive grease is getting it where you DON’T want it!
I would submit a thin coat of any automotive wheel bearing grease would probably do as well, as I would assume this is not a high amperage situation.
Also, the contact between the bulb and reflector might be considered, but now you are getting near the other contact.
Clearly the chrome is not oxidizing, but what is the body/mating surface made of?
Greg
The reflector is chrome plated copper that has been shaped by spinning and a forming mandrel. The body is brass.
Thanks Greg for the tips.
Interesting, since it’s rare to put chrome right on copper, normally a thin plating of nickel is done first, often referred to as a “nickel strike”…
Apparently plating chrome on copper is very similar to plating on steel… often steel is copper plated, then buffed to a very smooth finish (since copper is so soft this is easy), then a nickel strike and a final plating of chromium.
But in any case the “bare” brass would be where you would get oxidation, but sounds like there’s a lot of contact area, just keep from oxidizing.
Greg
Greg Elmassian said:
Interesting, since it’s rare to put chrome right on copper, normally a thin plating of nickel is done first, often referred to as a “nickel strike”…
Apparently plating chrome on copper is very similar to plating on steel… often steel is copper plated, then buffed to a very smooth finish (since copper is so soft this is easy), then a nickel strike and a final plating of chromium.
But in any case the “bare” brass would be where you would get oxidation, but sounds like there’s a lot of contact area, just keep from oxidizing.
Greg
Greg, The man who made these lamps has informed me that they are indeed nickel plated (I phoned him after reading your comment). My bad :).
Thanks for the help with this, BTW, I had an issue with a couple of the large mechanical relays in the electronics of both engines. Seems that moisture has caused some of the contacts to become non-conductive due to corrosion (?). Guy who built the electronics has purchased a spray terminal cleaner for me to use on all the mechanical relay contacts as a general maintenance “thing”. Everything working well now.
Look for a “terminal cleaner” that leaves a light anti-corrosion film behind. DeOxit will work great and not gum anything up, been using for 40 years.
Greg
Greg Elmassian said:
Look for a “terminal cleaner” that leaves a light anti-corrosion film behind. DeOxit will work great and not gum anything up, been using for 40 years.
Greg
Thanks again…Caig Laboratories Deoxit? Available on Amazon@$18.
Yep, great stuff, get the DeOxit 5 I think, don’t get the tuner cleaner (but good for volume controls) and don’t get the “gold” version.
Great for any electrical contacts, usb plugs, memory cards, headphone jacks (spray on plug, not into the electronics)… carrier is naptha, evaporates pretty quickly but does not harm plastic.
It leaves a very thing anti-oxidation film that also lubricates a bit… when you spray it on a usb plug, you will notice a lower insertion force. This leads to less wear over time, good on laptops.
Greg
Ok, I gotta ax the question, what’s the purpose of “conductive grease,” if it doesn’t conduct trons?
Steve Featherkile said:
Ok, I gotta ax the question, what’s the purpose of “conductive grease,” if it doesn’t conduct trons?
If the lubricant includes antioxidant properties, it would be conducive to electrical conduction - perhaps analogous to a catalyst in a chemical reaction.
-Ted