Greg Elmassian said:
Yes it is… we are assuming they mean electrically and not thermally or optically (https://www.largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-wink.gif)
EXACTLY !! …However it is still considered Conductive grease.
Wow! The discussion way back when it was Aristocraft’s Conductive grease was almost this fun!
A word of caution, they went under!(https://www.largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-surprised.gif)
Watch out Charlie!(https://www.largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-tongue-out.gif)(https://www.largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-laughing.gif)(https://www.largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-money-mouth.gif)
Even that grease was inconsistent. Ted had a bottle that was NOT conductive, but it cracked plastic. I was sent a bottle for evaluation (unsolicited) from Lewis Polk and it was indeed conductive, but mildly, as I remember about 18-22k for somewhere around 1/8" (stuff intended as conductive is usually ~100-150 ohms per centimeter)…
In any case, my bottle of ElectraLube actually ate through it’s original bottle. I picked it up from the shelf one day, and the bottom fell off in a pile of grey goo. It was hilarious (after I cleaned up the mess).
Greg
Greg Elmassian said:
Even that grease was inconsistent. Ted had a bottle that was NOT conductive, but it cracked plastic. I was sent a bottle for evaluation (unsolicited) from Lewis Polk and it was indeed conductive, but mildly, as I remember about 18-22k for somewhere around 1/8" (stuff intended as conductive is usually ~100-150 ohms per centimeter)…
In any case, my bottle of ElectraLube actually ate through it’s original bottle. I picked it up from the shelf one day, and the bottom fell off in a pile of grey goo. It was hilarious (after I cleaned up the mess).
Greg
Greg,
Very timely topic. You probably remember the nice headlight “jewelry” I added to my Baldwin electrics.
I have a small issue with the chrome plated reflector. The door that holds the glass lens applies pressure to that reflector against the edge of the headlight body. It is a pretty snug fit and makes a good electrical connection. Could I use a conductive grease to put between the surfaces of the body and the reflector to “guarantee” a more positive connection? Thanks for any input :).
Sure, just be careful not to get it to the “center contact”… usually the biggest problem with true conductive grease is getting it where you DON’T want it!
I would submit a thin coat of any automotive wheel bearing grease would probably do as well, as I would assume this is not a high amperage situation.
Also, the contact between the bulb and reflector might be considered, but now you are getting near the other contact.
Clearly the chrome is not oxidizing, but what is the body/mating surface made of?
Greg
Greg Elmassian said:
Sure, just be careful not to get it to the “center contact”… usually the biggest problem with true conductive grease is getting it where you DON’T want it!
I would submit a thin coat of any automotive wheel bearing grease would probably do as well, as I would assume this is not a high amperage situation.
Also, the contact between the bulb and reflector might be considered, but now you are getting near the other contact.
Clearly the chrome is not oxidizing, but what is the body/mating surface made of?
Greg
The reflector is chrome plated copper that has been shaped by spinning and a forming mandrel. The body is brass.
Thanks Greg for the tips.
Interesting, since it’s rare to put chrome right on copper, normally a thin plating of nickel is done first, often referred to as a “nickel strike”…
Apparently plating chrome on copper is very similar to plating on steel… often steel is copper plated, then buffed to a very smooth finish (since copper is so soft this is easy), then a nickel strike and a final plating of chromium.
But in any case the “bare” brass would be where you would get oxidation, but sounds like there’s a lot of contact area, just keep from oxidizing.
Greg
Greg Elmassian said:
Interesting, since it’s rare to put chrome right on copper, normally a thin plating of nickel is done first, often referred to as a “nickel strike”…
Apparently plating chrome on copper is very similar to plating on steel… often steel is copper plated, then buffed to a very smooth finish (since copper is so soft this is easy), then a nickel strike and a final plating of chromium.
But in any case the “bare” brass would be where you would get oxidation, but sounds like there’s a lot of contact area, just keep from oxidizing.
Greg
Greg, The man who made these lamps has informed me that they are indeed nickel plated (I phoned him after reading your comment). My bad :).
Thanks for the help with this, BTW, I had an issue with a couple of the large mechanical relays in the electronics of both engines. Seems that moisture has caused some of the contacts to become non-conductive due to corrosion (?). Guy who built the electronics has purchased a spray terminal cleaner for me to use on all the mechanical relay contacts as a general maintenance “thing”. Everything working well now.
Look for a “terminal cleaner” that leaves a light anti-corrosion film behind. DeOxit will work great and not gum anything up, been using for 40 years.
Greg
Greg Elmassian said:
Look for a “terminal cleaner” that leaves a light anti-corrosion film behind. DeOxit will work great and not gum anything up, been using for 40 years.
Greg
Thanks again…Caig Laboratories Deoxit? Available on Amazon@$18.
Yep, great stuff, get the DeOxit 5 I think, don’t get the tuner cleaner (but good for volume controls) and don’t get the “gold” version.
Great for any electrical contacts, usb plugs, memory cards, headphone jacks (spray on plug, not into the electronics)… carrier is naptha, evaporates pretty quickly but does not harm plastic.
It leaves a very thing anti-oxidation film that also lubricates a bit… when you spray it on a usb plug, you will notice a lower insertion force. This leads to less wear over time, good on laptops.
Greg
Ok, I gotta ax the question, what’s the purpose of “conductive grease,” if it doesn’t conduct trons?
Steve Featherkile said:
Ok, I gotta ax the question, what’s the purpose of “conductive grease,” if it doesn’t conduct trons?
If the lubricant includes antioxidant properties, it would be conducive to electrical conduction - perhaps analogous to a catalyst in a chemical reaction.
-Ted
Steve, exactly what is stated by USA Trains, in Michael’s post of the 26th, and specifically the italicized sentence.
keeping oxidation down promotes conductivity.
it does not need to conduct electrons itself, it helps preserve electron flow.
Greg
I use automotive-grade CRC Dielectric Grease on my track joints especially outdoors…states that it seals, lubricates, protects, and insulates electrical contacts.
Anyone want to hammer away at this product?
Even have it in a aerosol can which makes it super easy to install just a squirt in the rail joiner used it for years, great stuff
Thomas White said:
I use automotive-grade CRC Dielectric Grease on my track joints especially outdoors…states that it seals, lubricates, protects, and insulates electrical contacts.
Anyone want to hammer away at this product?
When you say it insulates (as it indeed is not conductive, also the definition of dielectric) it keeps bringing forth comments like Steve’s, if it is an insulator, how does electricity flow, for example a rail joiner filled with grease/oil/dielectric grease/chicken fat/etc.
The reality is that the pressure of the contact allows metal to metal contact in enough areas to conduct. The grease is thing enough to squeeze out so the metal touches. Electricity in reality only needs a small path to conduct.
Here’s a good short article: https://www.w8ji.com/dielectric_grease_vs_conductive_grease.htm
A few good quotes:
“The most frequent Internet complaint is that dielectric grease insulates connections, making connections less conductive. Some call pure silicone grease an “insulating grease”. The general basis for this claim is in the word “dielectric” used in the name. The word dielectric is assumed to mean the connection will have future problems because “dielectrics” are insulators. Generally, authors predict greases with powdered metal (in slang “conductive greases”) will improve or maintain connection quality over time while dielectric greases will isolate connections because “that is what dielectrics do”.”
“Internet forums thrive on myths. Forums often claim dielectric grease thermally insulates connections. Forums also claim dielectric grease electrically insulates connections, such as in connectors and on battery posts. Neither is true.”
“The important physical characteristic is that any grease must have low enough viscosity to push out of the way at contact points, be water or liquid resistant, and be stable enough to remain in place as a protectant against moisture and air for a long time. It will not do any good to apply a grease that does not do required functions of excluding air and moisture, and lubricating the interface to prevent galling or fretting, for extended periods of time.”
“Contrary to Internet rumors, advertisements, and articles low viscosity silicone dielectric grease will NOT insulate pressure connections. Silicone dielectric grease will prolong connection life as well as, and have just as good conduction performance, as a properly selected metallic powder grease (conductive grease). On the other hand, and improperly selected “conductive” grease can actually cause connection problems.”
“One incorrect logic is the “dielectric” in “dielectric grease” means the grease should only be used to insulate. All greases work by the low viscosity allowing the grease to completely push out of areas with metal-to-metal contact. Dielectric grease is just better at holding off high voltages over long paths.”
Parts Express has a two day sale on DeoxIT D5.
They also have the original can with the more common tube spray.
Seems like a good price.
Tom
