anyone know is the grease conductive or just a dielectric
Real (electrically) conductive grease really has no place on our railroads. It will spread and short something out, like insulated wheels to axles. It has happened. The “conductive” comes from inhibiting oxidation, thus helping keep conductivity. Actually misleading.
There is no info, but I would be willing to bet a paycheck the USAT stuff is not electrically conductive, just like LGB conductive grease is not conductive.
One train manufacturer did make a conductive grease, which was mildly conductive, but it destroyed plastic! That company is long gone.
The lubricant that USA Trains sells is advertised as a conductive lubricant.
Yes it is… we are assuming they mean electrically and not thermally or optically (https://www.largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-wink.gif)
This is a common question, had a bit of fun with LGB over it too.
A couple of years ago, a guy who’s used various lubricants in the past told me that the stuff USA and RLD sells is more of a conductive paste that you would use for a better electrical connection - not lubrication. He advised me to buy the following lubrication and this is what I use now:
I won’t argue with you, get an ohmmeter and check the conductivity and you will see they are dielectrics not conductive.
Interesting what was recommended is an oil, and personally I have found that greases and oils each have unique properties and applications. For example oil better on connecting rods on steamers and grease better on gear teeth.
Greg
Well that is why I was asking as didn’t want to purchase some if it was not and didn’t have any to test, Bill
Illustrated below is an example measurement of USA Trains “Conductive Lubricant”
-Ted
Well then, should the people at USA Trains and RLD Hobbies and Reindeer Pass be called on their misleading advertising of “conductive lubricant” then? All three have been selling the same lubricant for a long time.
In my opinion it is indeed misleading, since there ARE actual conductive lubricants, and the USAT product and the LGB product are not conductive.
Greg
Just took a gander at my USA Trains EMD GP-9 and NW-2 owners manuals. Here’s what they say:
Lubrication:
The locomotive has three lubrication points. Sideframe Journal Box: The axel ends fit into brash bushings which bring power to the locomotive should periodically be cleaned out and lubricated with a small amount of USA Trains electrically conductive lubricant (USA Trains p/n R50002). Use only our conductive lubricant to avoid loss of electrical contact which could cause your locomotive to loose power or run erratically. Frequency of lubrication depends on operating conditions. Axel lubrication: Two drops of oil (recommended Hob-E-Lube #HL653) placed on all four contact points where the axel enters the gear box. Gear box lubrication: Should not have to be lubricated, but after 100 hours of operation, apply Hob-E-Lube Moly Grease to the gears on the axel only. Do not apply grease to the electrical contacts inside the gear box or you may hinder the electrical contacts required for smooth operation.
The “conductive” lube isn’t actually conductive, ah, yea, I had the same oddity back in the old days on analog copiers. The contact brushes for the drum heaters were to be lubricated with “conductive” grease, but I saw the same thing (an open) when I put my ohm meter into the grease. But, I think, that the “conductive” grease is there to reduce the wear on the sliding contacts, without insulating the contacts. How that works when the conductive grease isn’t actually conductive, I dunno. I guess its PFM.
My thinking is …… it covers the metal parts so the weather can’t stop the conductivity of the two parts…
Assuming the USA Trains lubricant includes antioxidant properties, perhaps it’s better to re-identify it as:
“Conductively Conducive Lubricant”
-Ted
Thanks Ted for answering my question, Bill
As a spoiler, in the case of the USAT locos, one of the power pickups is the metal eyelet in the journal. if you used real conductive grease there, I could see how it might help, but since the weight of the loco is carried on these journals, the pressure seems to be sufficient for good electrical contact without going to an electrically conductive grease. The fact that these journals pick up dirt and grit easily and get really messy would worry me some that the grease could get in some other area, albeit in this case, that is a fair distance away.
Michael Kirrene said:
Just took a gander at my USA Trains EMD GP-9 and NW-2 owners manuals. Here’s what they say:
Lubrication:
The locomotive has three lubrication points. Sideframe Journal Box: The axel ends fit into brash bushings which bring power to the locomotive should periodically be cleaned out and lubricated with a small amount of USA Trains electrically conductive lubricant (USA Trains p/n R50002). Use only our conductive lubricant to avoid loss of electrical contact which could cause your locomotive to loose power or run erratically. Frequency of lubrication depends on operating conditions. Axel lubrication: Two drops of oil (recommended Hob-E-Lube #HL653) placed on all four contact points where the axel enters the gear box. Gear box lubrication: Should not have to be lubricated, but after 100 hours of operation, apply Hob-E-Lube Moly Grease to the gears on the axel only. Do not apply grease to the electrical contacts inside the gear box or you may hinder the electrical contacts required for smooth operation.
Are there not wires on the side frames to conduct electricity into the main board? What is a “brash bushing” and do they conduct electricity ? Perhaps I’m missing something or perhaps this is a just bitch rant that is not needed with declining manufacturers?
brash = brass. We all understood, and the rest of us are not forum spelling police.
I called it a “metal eyelet” because it has a lip that holds the ring terminal, but I guess I call it that since Aristo does the same thing on many of it’s power pickups. (so as not to confuse anyone, this is the power pickup from the end of the axle)
The hob-e-lube part number is their ultra-light oil, and I disagree, I use the heavy oil, their “gear oil” because there is a lot of clearance between the axle bearing and the axle. I like the hob-e-lube moly grease, although the “gel grease” that is sold by various manufacturers is less messy and really clings to the gears, does not get thrown off (it is thixatropic).
Greg
Greg Elmassian said:
brash = brass. We all understood, and the rest of us are not forum spelling police.
Clearly, I did not understand so when you stated “WE all understood” I suppose you are disregarding me? I’m thankful that the rest that understood unlike me are not forum spelling police “which has no relation to the original posters question” as you strive for Greg.
Yeah, Joker, you thought it was cute to bring my misspelling out in the open. Everybody else pretty much got the jist of the post. And with exception to the misspelling, everything else was taken word for word from the USA Trains owner’s manual. So take your beef up with Charlie Ro, eh? Yeah, you obviously missed something - it wasn’t a bitch rant at all; not even close. “Not needed with declining manufacturers?” Last I heard USA Trains was doing just fine and is not in decline.