Well , that used to be the punishmebt for predicting the future .
What brought this about is Dave’s accurate prediction that there was gonna be trouble over Lithium Cells .
It’s the next to top talking point in the news over here . Dell have issued a recall because of exploding Laptops–fortunately so far not on anyone’s lap . The thought makes me tighten my legs somewhat .
So , Dave , any more predictions ?
Or do they still burn witches over there ?
Mike
The news is blasting Dell for the batterys when Sony is the manufacturer.
Sony should get as much negative credit as Dell.
Just my 2 cent comment.
Put em together and what have you got?
Bibbity, Bobbity BOOO!!!
I am still keeping an open mind and it pains me to admit this, but I kinda feel for those LS manufacturers who jumped in heavily with a “new” chemistry.
They may get burned. So to speak.
I heard a little of this, but not much detail. Is this, once again, lithium hydride batteies exploding while being charged?
No , Ric . In the press ,there is a pair of photos of one on a conference table in Japan showing it just after catching fire in use and a few seconds later as the table catches fire too .
Just to be helpful , the media mention that these things are carried onto aircraft .
So that should frighten the terrorists off then .
The recall is for a million and a quarter computers and batteries from a particular set of batches . They know of four which have caught fire sat in storage . All Lithium .
So , if you can find the post that Dave did , you will know which locos to remove them from .
Mike
I wonder if the one on the Japanese conference table was hooked up to an electrical circuit? My wife’s laptop charges while being hooked up to the 110 volt electrical current. Just curiousity.
Let me relate a true story.
Several years ago we had a couple of nasty train wrecks around here.
One a multiple-fatality head-on.
Seems the crews had been complaining about the signalling for quite some time, like a “green” with track speed of 60, followed by a “red”, with no intervening “yellow” and no way to stop.
The Railroad and the Feds did a full investigation and blamed the dead crew (I can’t recall, but all or most had 30+ years on the railroad).
Talked to some signal maintainers later, and what they told me was amazing.
The railroad and the Feds will never admit to a signal error, unless it can be laid at a worker or vandalism, as if they do, the minute they do, they call into question every signal on every line in the US and possibly North America.
Now.
You have Lithium Batteries blowing up.
Again.
Every time, and this is by no means the first, it’s either “defective cells” or “counterfeit”.
The fact that you can’t tell by looking which ones have a problem and which ones do not, nor when one is going to “go off”, makes the calling of this, in a massive recall, “defective cells” is really all they can do.
I have seen the FAA proposal, and I’d bet after all this with Lithium Batteries, we are gonna see a stop to carry-on or even checked laptops.
And cell phones.
There were no wires on the photos , Ric . But the laptop was in use .
Interesting that Sony are being blamed–the batteries are made by several companies ,not just Sony . And therein lies a problem . Who designed and licensed them ? How far is this going to intrude into our lives ?
Listen to the wicked witch , and learn .
Mike
This has also happened before.
Scorpion.
Torpedo batteries, Silver-Iodine or Silver-Iodide, when a while later they had an incident in port, they found three manufacturers made them.
Exide, Gould, and another.
It ws the other that had problems.
They recalled them all (serialized), and got all but 3, I think.
Checking records, those three are still on Scorpion.
So, whichever manufacturer is at fault, to protect the supply, we’ll probably never know “who”.
If you believe in conspiracy theories, this one is ripe for the picking…
Now quit it.
One of the oldest locomotives in history was powered this way.
Else, why would they have called it
The Sturbridge Li-ion?
The habit of testing stuff on the public is becoming more widespread–usually resulting in someone getting hurt in the broadest sense of the word . Recalls of products are becoming more frequent, in some cases even that is not done in the hope that “they” will get away with it
We may all dislike Ralph Nader and similar figures , but you have to admit , if the battery industry got a faceful of Naderisms , they would conduct themselves differently .
Beta issues of software are just as bad --let the great unwashed public test them for us–so if a few computers crash , why worry ? (As quoted from A.E.Neumann )
We have decided not to trust the Lithium cell in the laptops , they are only used near a power socket anyway , so the battery can be removed and the computer is that bit less likely to do a flame job .
We have Sony machines , their local rep could only agree that this was the only way to be sure that the computer would not suffer damage from Lithium cells .
It is a pity , these cells claim to run for many,many hours between charges , and we were finding this to be the case .
Why do they not make a separate power pack until the problem is solved ? And provide power sockets on aircraft too ? Nah , costs money .
The local news mentioned Sony as the supplier for the batteries to Dell.
Now for the $64 question?
How many other types of battery packs (Nickle Cadiulm, Nickle Metal Hydroyte, Gel Cell) have similar problems with fire and did not make the news.
I wonder how much money the PR departments spend keeping this out of the public news?
I have seen Nickle Cadiums get so hot (with an internal short), thay they would melt the plastic cases.
With the popularity of portable equipment, maybe the manufacturese of batteries are pushing the assembly lines to fast trying to keep up with the demand.
Hi Dennis.
I have no axe to grind one way or the other with batteries.
Personally I have never had any experience with any battery getting so hot it was dangerous.
Whilst I don’t doubt that NiCd batteries have done what you describe yours is the only incident I have ever heard of where it was spontaneous and not caused by an outside force.
I have heard of NiMh doing it when abused. As in incorrectly charged. i.e. at too high a rate or for too long making them overheat which will severly curtail the life of NiMh cells. Especially “AA” size. Low cost smart chargers have largely addressed the overcharging problem in NiMh.
The most you are supposed to draw from “AA’s” is about ½ amp. Any more and they don’t like it. Sure they will still work OK, but they won’t last very long.
The problem with Li-Ion for me is I am hearing these horror stories all the time. Not just an odd isolated incident. All the time.
For me the best value for money is still NiCd chemistry. They last longer, as in the number of times they can be recharged. twice as long as NimH at their best. Plus, the memory problem is only a problem if they are incorrectly charged. The problem is they are toxic and creat toxic landfill if incorrectly disposed of and will sooner or later be banned.
Sooner than you think.
Grab em whilst you can.
And I’m saving newspaper clippings.
Cel Phones, laptops, GPS units, even some guy’s shed over on another forum.
Good for you Dave , keep us in the picture if you find more , I’ll do the same .
I have two concerns with these things .
At nearly £100 a throw , I would expect not to have wory about them .That’s 180 dollars roughly for a laptop battery from Sony . They have a theoretical 500 hour life .
They have yet to be banned on aircraft .
By the way , ever wondered about what would happen if one in the middle of a stored pile of them caught fire spontaneously ? In a container on a ship or the back of a truck ?
Who invented them , al qaeda ?
Mike
I shall have to sleep on that link you posted . They don’t give much encouragement , do they ? It seems like a bit of bet hedging is going on .
I still won’t use them if I can help it . I got frightened by NiMh ones when I was younger . We had a couple of SARBE beacons go up in store . It would have kept the aircrew warm in the water .
Mike
And the wicked witch’s predictions strike true again!!!
One million recalled in the USA and 750,000 in Europe . Today’s and yesterdays news 25/26 Aug 06 .
No sign of airlines banning laptops with the things fitted .
They do run very hot , the ones in the laptops .
The ones you use , Tony , any sign of more than normal heat there ? If not , who makes them ? I know you said you don’t like them , which is why I ask–you probably got put off by experience .
Mike M
Mike Morgan said:What on Earth does that mean?
............SNIP .....They do run very hot , the ones in the laptops . The ones you use , Tony , any sign of more than normal heat there ? If not , who makes them ? I know you said you don't like them , which is why I ask--you probably got put off by experience . Mike M
What batteries don’t I like?
I obviously misunderstood your post .
Mike