Large Scale Central

Scratch-building rolling stock

Hello,

I am hoping I can gain some insight on doing some scratch building. I have searched for SPng equipment and it seems like the kits and RTR rolling stock pieces are few and far between.

What are some good manufacturers for different materials such as scale lumber, scribed siding, hardware, and trucks?

Or on that matter, possibly some kits that won’t completely empty my wallet?

Any and all help will greatly be appreciated,

Matt

Your best bet is to get some plans. You get most of the Garden Railway plans from here http://www.sidestreetbannerworks.com/railways/plans.html

Also check out the modeling forum and the articles section. A lot of the guys here have some great build logs you can use. If you have a table saw you can cut your own scale wood. You can get scale wood from micromark, Ozark miniatures, ebay most hobby stores and craft stores. For hardware trackside details has brass parts and Ozark Miniatures for white metal details. I like to use micro fasteners for hex bolts etc… For kits its going to hard to find anything cheap. Most will cost you but they are nice kits.

Hey Shawn I appreciate the info, and I will look deeper into the build logs. I think I am just looking for something super specific that many people haven’t done too much of.

When you’ve ripped your own lumber for rolling stock, are you using hardwoods like oak or a softer lumber? Nothing will stay in the elements so I am curious as what works best for the builds?

I have built a few of Phil’s kits, and I may go back that route again for some box cars. I really enjoy building them and am very pleased with their outcome. Are there any Southern Pacific narrow gauge kits that may be out there that I don’t know of?

Thanks

Matt

Hi Matt It would seem you have taken the next step in this most excellent hobby anad you are not happy with what is available. There are many guys on this forum that build excellent models and Shawn V. is one of them. It looks like he has branched out to napkins now but trust me he builds nice things.

Your best bet is to rip your own wood on a table saw with a zero tolerance throat for safety. I use mahogany for my trestles and some bridges and cedar for the rest. My buildings are more or less glorified plywood boxes with a cedar cladding that is glued, pin nailed and painted to protect it.

Rolling stock can be built from Styrene, wood, brass etc… but if you are just starting out it is easier to start with someting that is already made like a flat car from USATrains or Aristo.

My firefighting car started as a USAT flat. (http://freightsheds.largescalecentral.com/users/capecodtodd/_forumfiles/FireFightingTrainCar.jpg)I say build your own stuff, scavenge or adapt like a real narrow gauge RR would have back in the day. It is fun.

Happy RRing

Hi Mat,
Check out Hartford kits which are now part of Ozark Miniatures. Hartford had a full kit of a SP boxcar and SP trucks, I don’t know if Ozark plans to continue the kit. You might want to check with them.

Chuck

Matt,

Sounds like you’re ready for scratch building! A few kits from Phil is how I started as well. Scratch building isn’t very cheap, but it is very rewarding. You also get to make something exactly the way you want it.

I don’t think that there are a lot of kits out there, for any line. So, you start searching for drawings.

I like “Slim Gauge Cars” and “A Century + Ten of D&RGW Narrow Gauge Freight Cars”; both provide some nice drawings for narrow gauge rolling stock. Some of the modeling magazines also have drawings. “Narrow Gauge and Shortline Gazette” is a good source.

For wood that you are going to cut to size, I like basswood sheets - I used that for my hopper build. You can also get wood cut to size from HobbyLinc, or MicroMark, among others.

You don’t have to limit yourself to wood. Evergreen makes scribed siding that looks great on a model. I used it for this car:

For arch bar trucks, I started with Aristo-Delton, but have since swithed over to Rodney’s all metal sprung trucks - they give much needed weight to my models and roll very freely.

Of course Phil also sells lots of nice brass parts - I prefer using brass over white metal; it makes for a sturdier model.

You can make your own parts with brass from K&S shapes (also available at Hobbylinc).

There’s a LOT here on the site - don’t neglect the articles section for some good tips.

If you’re like me, you’ll try something and get more information or tips from a build log. I’ve learned a lot here.

Matt,

You mention the “Slim Princess” as the prototype you want to build from, here are a couple of resources that you may not be aware of.

First Rick Blanchards Urbaneagle web site here http://www.urbaneagle.com/slim/

A couple of excellent books with equipment drawings are, “Slim Rails through the Sand” by George Turner and “Southern Pacific narrow gauge locomotives and equipment” by Robert Bader.

There is a lot of information out there on the “Slim Princess” but virtually no RTR or kits to work with, I would guess that almost everything would have to be scratch built or kit bashed, in the case of 10 wheelers.

Good luck.

Rick

Good luck with your projects Matt and we LOVE pictures here when you make progress.

Matt - Welcome aboard!

I have used the Hartford Products trucks and they are quite good as well. Hartford makes a good bit of SP stuff, detail parts and such. As Bruce said they are white metal, but very good detail.

Bachmann makes some good products, despite what might be said. I use their Spectrum couplers and have had very good luck with them. Their wheel sets are as inexpensive as you can find, and many here use them. They currently list three wheel diameters - 24.5mm, 31mm and 32.5mm, so you have some flexibility. There are other manufacturers of wheel sets as well, Gary Raymond and Sierra Valley and others. USA Trains makes an arch bar truck (less wheel sets) that re inexpensive and work well.

As for construction materials, I use whatever leftover lumber I have from projects around the house. Mostly it is ‘white pine’, with some oak or other ‘hard wood’ thrown in for whatever reason. I use Gorilla glue, Tite Bond and Elmers Carpenters glue (the yellow stuff). Paints are Krylon/Rustoleum or regular house type paint, depending on what the project is.

If you can’t tell, I am far from a rivet counter. Somewhere on this site is a build log on some D&RGW 6000 series flat cars I need to finish, but it will give you a good idea of my modeling style. Hope this has been of some help.

I was not able to find the links to Bob Sorenson’s excellent threads on cutting scale lumber on both a table saw and band saw on the My Large Scale forums, but I have posted a copy of the threads on my web site here:

http://www.gscalejunkie.com/Articles/MillingScaleLumberRev-01.pdf

I created this PDF for my own use, but now see it might be a great resource for everyone.

Bob C.

Guys,

Thank you all so much for the input. I feel like I have a great start now and to be honest, there are materials I would have never thought of, such as the styrene siding.

For a “great” price, I was fortunate enough to purchase a copy of Mallory Hope Ferrels, “Southern Pacific Narrow Gauge” a few weeks ago and it too, is a great resource for rolling stock plans and information. I will definitely be using that for some plans and ideas of rolling stock. Maybe even do a little mixing of roads as they transitioned between owners.

I will have to look more into the websites along with the other books listed as additional resources. I would have to say, thus far, this forum has been one of the best I have dealt with. An endless amount of info. And the builds and skill possessed here are truly awesome.

I have a small start to my SPng collection right now, including the live steam 10-wheeler along with a kit-bashed Annie for the motive power. But i really have no “true to form” SP rolling stock.

I have a stack of oak flooring rotting away in my garage, and I am beginning to think that it would make a great candidate for lumber. I do have a table saw and a chop saw, has anyone else found any other tools to be valuable for scaling down the lumber?

Does anyone go past using glue to build their rolling stock? Any specific hardware used?

I do like the idea of scratch building structures as well. This hobby has truly endless opportunity!

Thanks again

Matt

Matt,

Check with the library at the California State Railroad Museum in Sacramento. Quite a few years back, a friend of mine was able to get some scans of old drawings of SP narrow gauge rolling stock and equipment. I don’t remember how much he paid for the scans, but it wasn’t a lot. Because of the budget cuts in California, they not be able to do it now. But it would be worth a call or email to them.

Years ago I picked up a used 14" sears construction grade band saw. It’s a great time saver, I have a 10" and an 8" table saws, but once roughed out I go to the band saw. I don’t fear it’s blade, while my table saws have reached out to touch me… the band saw merely stays put. My fingers can touch the sides of the blade with no fear. I always plan my approach to my table saws…

I salvaged a pecky cedar roof from a home remodel, it’s all planks 2 1/2" thick, first my chain saw cuts a section of plank I can handle say 6’x14"x2 1/2", then the 10" slices off boards, the 8" makes rough cut scale lumber and the band saw makes scale lumber. It’s easy to tilt the table for angle cuts and my back likes being vertical.

I usually use the rough cut for building and scale only when it can be seen, scale doesn’t wear well here. I use Tite-bond3 and a pin nailer.

John

Hi Mat,

Carstens last issue of Slim Gauge Cars has 14 different S P car plans in it.

Chuck

Matt be sure to either buy or make a zero tolerance plate for your table saw and use a fine tooth blade. If you don’t and cut small scale lumber a piece will slip or fall into the opening and cause a kick back. I made a plate for my table saw. I took a piece of thick styrene, trimmed it to fit the inlay on the table , turned on the power and brought the blade up through it.

I have a 12" chop mitre saw and I also have a small 2" blade chop saw I bought cheap from Harbor Freight but I use the 12" most of the time.

For really small pieces I use a scissor like cutter that has a long razor blade in it.

Of course using a pneaumaatic 18 gauge brad nailer really helps out and my favorite is my 23 gauge pin nailer. A dab of tightbond 3 glue and a pin or 2 allows me to keep building without having to wait for glue to dry.

Cutting scale lumber creates A LOT of sawdust so either wear a mask, use a vacuum on your saw or do like I do and cut outdoors.

happy RRing

A lot of the guys here value their 23 gauge pneumatic pin nailers. Agreeing with Todd, I recommend one to you. You’ll need a compressor, of course, but that’s a very useful item in its own right.

I find ordinary pine etc to be ok for rolling stock, as the wood is not in contact with the ground. If I were using oak I’d want to select very fine-grained wood. I love cedar, but again, choice pieces with a fine straight grain. I avoid adhesives for models that will live outdoors year 'round, and many of mine do just that. I don’t trust any adhesive outdoors here in the great lakes region. There are contrary opinions and recommendations for outdoor adhesives, however, but I have a lot of difficulty buying in. I rely on mechanical connections and joints exclusively - wood joinery, screws, nails, pins, custom crimped wire joiners etc.

Good luck.

I got all the parts needed to make my band saw like new from these folks. Right now they have a neat 10" band saw on sale which looks like a handy bench top unit…

Oh I have absolutely no affiliation to said company…
http://www.highlandwoodworking.com/

John

Matt,

For scratching cars I like the Poplar planks sold at Lowe’s/ H Depot, they are 1/4 inch thick and come in 2 through 6 inch widths and in 2-4 foot lengths. Poplar is a good soft, fine grained, Hardwood and being 1/4 I only have to rip in on direction for sills etc. For decking I like Cedar, generally I can find fence boards that are knot free enough to use, just have to let them dry first. Cedar takes stains and washes much better than Pine does, in my opinion. For boxcars etc, I just buy the pre-scribed siding from a supplier.

have fun

Rick

Once again, thank you for all of the input.

It looks as if I’ve got some modifications to make to the table saw, and a band saw to get. It’s funny that as soon as I started digging in the garage how much extra lumber I was able to find- in varieties of oak, pine, and poplar. Next step for me will be to order up the detail parts, get some more wheel-sets, pick out the car siding. and get to building. (Pictures included, of course)

I am looking forward to a pin nailer now, considering I would like to venture out into some trestle building and scratch building of structures as well. Seems like that would DEFINITELY speed up the process.

Another real quick question and I hope i didn’t miss it above, when cutting the scribed siding, is a band saw a better option or will a table saw cut without splintering the entire piece?

Matt

"Another real quick question and I hope i didn’t miss it above, when cutting the scribed siding, is a band saw a better option or will a table saw cut without splintering the entire piece? "

I use an X-Acto or razor knife

I have a 4" sanding machine, I cut close and sand to the line. I use cut down 6" self sticking sanding discs and fine grade.

John