Large Scale Central

Newbie to Live Steam but not model trains

Electronics Live Steam
#1

Hello everyone. I have searched and searched the internet for live steam and information on running them with remote control. I have a few questions but first alittle about me. I have been in RC for years and still have my gas plane and a gas boat. I also run an electric tug. I have both steering wheel remotes and stick airplane remotes. I have been into HO Model trains for a couple years and was hot and heavy into DCC. I recently stepped out of the hobby and I was thinking on going live steam. Here are my questions since I cannot seem to find answer in one location:

  1. What is the best locomotive or company if not a best locomotive to get started into live steam? Something that is easy to fire and run. example Ruby

  2. What gauge do most of you prefer or what gauge is the best in terms of getting rolling stock and accessories?

  3. What company or companies produce aftermarket linkages to accommodate RC remotes to control the locomotives?

  4. What accessories does one need to operate a live steamer with an RC unit?

  5. Does anyone have a good guide that shows everything working and how to set a live steam train up this way?

  6. What track do you recommend? Namebrand.

  7. Do most of you run live steam plus DCC on your outside layouts and if so how do you have it setup? What can controllers do you use and what decoders for the motor, sound and lights?

Sorry for all the questions but I’m seriously thinking of going this route and I cannot find many people in my area running live steam to ask these questions. Thanks for any help or recommendations.

#2

William,

Welcome to LSC,

I don’t personally use live steam yet, but have read others experiences.

Starting with live steam it is recommended to buy a basic locomotive like a Accucraft Ruby and the Roundhouse Basic series are highly regarded, there are others and hopefully someone else will mention.

The gauge depends on what scale you want, if you like the Ruby you will want narrow gauge about 1:20.3 and 1:22 should be roughly compatible (scale wise). The Ruby is 45mm only- lots of stuff for this gauge and scale.

If you want O gauge 32mm narrow gauge, this is mainly English stuff, less stuff in the US.
If you want standard gauge there is 1:29 and 1:32 scale, both are 45mm, the Ruby is not these scales, lots of products for these scales too.

For R/C here is a thread by Shawn about how he added R/C to his narrow gauge Accucraft Forney http://www.largescalecentral.com/LSCForums/viewtopic.php?pid=162558

For track you will want you decide what scale you want, as the tie spacing is different. I advice you to look at code 250/215 track as it looks much better than code 332- just make sure your track is on firm ground e.g tamped crushed fines at least.

I run battery control for my trains, I can get some of the features of DCC e.g lights, sounds. If you want track power, check if your live steamers have insulated axles and watch out for oil on the rails, if the wheels are not insulated- switch off the power!

Hopefully, others will fill you in on what they recommend
Alec

#3

Hi William & Welcome to LSC. Alec has provided a few good answers to which I’ll add my take. I am a minimally experienced Live Steam operator and also had some background in RC cars. I received an Accucraft 2 Cyl Shay as a gift a few years back. It is similar to the Ruby and Forney in how it works and was pretty easy for this beginner to learn to fire and run. I have have added RC to it and documented my work on my website at http://www.cvsry.com/ShayRC-P1.html - Since the website article was written I have upgraded the radio system to a Spektrum 2.4 GHz.

William said:
1. What is the best locomotive or company if not a best locomotive to get started into live steam? Something that is easy to fire and run. example Ruby
This question is subject to a lot of opinions. My friends steered me to the Accucraft 2 Cyl Shay and Shawn had good beginner's luck with the Accucraft Forney. The Ruby kit will teach you an awful lot about how things work but might require expert help to get in tune.
William said:
2. What gauge do most of you prefer or what gauge is the best in terms of getting rolling stock and accessories?
In "Large Scale" there is a bit of discrepancy between Gauge and Scale. You will find #1 or 45mm gauge (commonly called G) is the most common with folks on this website. In the live steam arena, larger gauges are also popular. Once you get into the realm of 7.5" gauge, the trains become rideable :) There is plenty of rolling stock available for 45mm gauge in scales of 1.20:3 (3 foot narrow gauge) 1:22.5 (Meter narrow gauge) 1:24 (42" Narrow Gauge) 1:29 (Representing standard gauge) and 1:32 (correct scale for Standard gauge).
William said:
3. What company or companies produce aftermarket linkages to accommodate RC remotes to control the locomotives?
I'm only familiar with Accucraft. They make levers to replace the knobs on their engine controls. Linkage is the same as a car, boat or plane. In my case I made my own from brass rod and flat stock.
William said:
4. What accessories does one need to operate a live steamer with an RC unit?
This question needs to be broken down. To run a steamer, with or without R/C you need a few things like fuel, distilled water, steam oil and lubrication oil. There is a great first-timer video just posted on Youtube by LSC member Charlie Z:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1KvMqRUOmME[/youtube]

To add RC you need a radio and receiver. Most folks use a 2-stick radio and a mini receiver like the Spektrum park flyer radios and other less expensive set-ups. You will also a need a source of receiver/servo power - 4 AA batteries will do, and lastly you need a servo or two. Mini servos are usually used and due to the heat of the steamer metal gears might give longer life.

William said:
5. Does anyone have a good guide that shows everything working and how to set a live steam train up this way?
I've never seen one. Once you have it all figured out why don't you write it :)
William said:
6. What track do you recommend? Namebrand.
Again, there are lots of correct answers here. If you never plan on running powered trains then aluminum rail will cost the least. For powered trains outdoors I'm a believer in the stainless steel track. I run Aristocraft. Many of our members think that the ode 332 track (LGB, AristoCraft, USA Trains etc.) looks too big and they go for a smaller code rail like 250. Search here on LSC for track and you will probably find at least one person recommends every brand out there.
William said:
7. Do most of you run live steam plus DCC on your outside layouts and if so how do you have it setup? What can controllers do you use and what decoders for the motor, sound and lights?
As Alec mentioned, most Live Steam locomotives are an electrical dead short through the axles. This makes them generally incompatible with track power of any type (analog or DCC). You can, and many do, run live steam and battery powered trains on the same track at the same time. I have track power and just make sure it is off when the steamer is on the rails. I can't answer the DCC questions.
William said:
Sorry for all the questions but I'm seriously thinking of going this route and I cannot find many people in my area running live steam to ask these questions. Thanks for any help or recommendations.
No need to apologize. Glad to be able to help.
#4

I think everyone gave you great advice so far. My questions would be how much are you willing to pay for a live steamer. If money is not an issue then I would go with the accucraft shay. If money is an issue then you cant really beat the accucraft Forney or the Ruby#5 with the larger cylinder. I would add RC to it so you can control them better on grades ect… unless you are on a flat elevated layout. Roundhouse engines are also nice and run very well.
I would get G gauge rather then O. There is more available in US engines plus the larger size makes it easier to work with. As for what scale in G you can get anything from 1:20 in narrow guage to 1:32 standard guage. All run on the same size track. It depends what you like.

#5

Thank you guys so far for the heads up and the replies. Where is the best place to order or buy from when it comes to live steam? Hobby shops and online please.

#6
William said:
Thank you guys so far for the heads up and the replies. Where is the best place to order or buy from when it comes to live steam? Hobby shops and online please.
Quisenberry http://www.quisenberrystation.com/ RLD http://rldhobbies.com/livesteam.aspx This site is good for dealer and suppliers http://www.nmia.com/~vrbass/steam/steammfr.htm
#7
Alec Escolme said:
If you want O gauge 32mm narrow gauge, this is mainly English stuff, less stuff in the US. Alec
Ahem, Alec - make that 'mainly WELSH', not 'mainly English'.

tac, ig & The Coos Bay boys
Ottawa Valley GRS

#8
Shawn said:
I would get G gauge rather then O. There is more available in US engines plus the larger size makes it easier to work with.
Shawn, don't get 0 gauge live-steam narrow gauge stuff mixed up with 0 gauge/scale standard gauge. The vast majority of Welsh/British live steam outline stuff running on 0 gauge track - called 16mm scale - is pretty big - remember that it nominally to 1/19th scale. AccuCraft's rather large Beyer-Garratt is actually designed to run on 0 gauge track for a true representation of gauge and scale, - at 2.5 feet long and weighing in at almost 40 pounds ready to go, that baby is quite big.

Check out Roundhouse - 99.9% of which is 16mm scale - all but the basic series are not only insulated but ca ngauge change too. Same for AccuCraft.

tac
Ottawa Valley GRS

#9

William - if you go down the AccuCraft Shay route then have look at Tom LaPointe’s excellent vids on YT - how to run an AccuCraft Shay - great stuff!

Also have a look at tac’s trains - 107 or so videos of live steam [and a few guns]. :slight_smile:

Best

tac
Ottawa Valley GRS

#10
tac said:
Alec Escolme said:
If you want O gauge 32mm narrow gauge, this is mainly English stuff, less stuff in the US. Alec
Ahem, Alec - make that 'mainly WELSH', not 'mainly English'.
Tac, You are right for the prototypes, but isn't most of the 1:19 stuff made in England?

Alec

#11
Alec Escolme said:
tac said:
Alec Escolme said:
If you want O gauge 32mm narrow gauge, this is mainly English stuff, less stuff in the US. Alec
Ahem, Alec - make that 'mainly WELSH', not 'mainly English'.
Tac, You are right for the prototypes, but isn't most of the 1:19 stuff made in England?

Alec


Sir - Roundhouse Engineering is based in Doncaster, South Yorkshire, and is definitely English. Many of the smaller builders in this scale - Tolshurst Model Engineering, Wrightscale and the likes of Peter Angus [all high-end models] are English, but I’d say that around 50% of all the stuff you see futzing around the tracks over here is AccuCraft [UK], and although the [UK] company is based in Church Stretton, the products are all made in China.

If you go to any of the shows here in UK you’ll be able to check them out for yourself - the next one I’ll be going to is at Peterborough Showground. Look out for me - I’ll be wearing either my Train Mountain sweater [blue] or my Canadian red one.

tac, ig and The gold Beach Boys
Ottawa Valley GRS

#12

I like the Accucraft Forney

(http://freightsheds.largescalecentral.com/users/paps101line/_forumfiles/PICT0207.JPG)

or something in that size maybe the Ruby I would go to a show and buy from a seller that can give you a lesson on operating your loco. That would give you a chance to get hands on training like the stand below.

(http://freightsheds.largescalecentral.com/users/paps101line/_forumfiles/PICT0170.JPG)

#13
Quote:
Does anyone have a good guide that shows everything working and how to set a live steam train up this way?
William and all,

There is a magazine for live steamers, “Steam in the Garden” (commonly known as SitG) with a website www.steamup.com. The magazine regularly publishes articles on ‘how-to’ add r/c to a live steamer - I know because they’ve published two of mine with a 3rd on the way this summer. [I can email you .PDFs if you send me a message.]

I think it is fair to say that most Acccuraft locos are not set up for r/c, and all require slightly different installations. That being said - all mine look remarkably similar. You can buy a Roundhouse loco with r/c installed. My second live steamer was an “Argyll” with r/c, and it helped me learn the pros and cons.

There is also a ‘small scale live steam’ email group, at http://www.45mm.com/sslivesteam_guide.html where a bunch of friendly experts will answer questions.

#14

Pete - many AccuCraft locos not only have holes for servo’s, but bolt-holes for fixing them down - but, as you suggest, the rest of it is up to you. Shawn here has recently r/c’d a Ruby, BTW. Here in UK, one major dealer - Trackshack on the Isle of Man - sells the malready converted at a great price [for UK, that is].

AccuCraft also sell the operating arms - $6 each - I’ve recently bought a few to do two of my own AccuCraft models.

tac
Ottawa Valley GRS

#15

PDF’s would be great although the site will not met me message anybody. It says I’m too new of a user.

Thank you for all the replies. Keep em coming.

#16
Quote:
many AccuCraft locos not only have holes for servo's, but bolt-holes for fixing them down
Tac - must be a UK special. None of the US prototypes are known to have servo mounting provisions. Maybe the competition from Roundhouse?
Quote:
the site will not met me message anybody
William - I sent you an email with my address.
#17

Pete,I replied to your email.

#18

William, I love the Honey Badger icon.

#19

Pete - you are correct. I just spoke to main dealer John on the Isle of Man - ‘Trackshack’.

Sorry.

tac
Ottawa Valley GRS

#20

William - look up the page to ‘firing up the Ruby’ posts.

tac
Ottawa Valley GRS