Large Scale Central

New Bachmann Turnout and ground throw released

Track and Trestles
#1

Bachmann has released two new large scale products that may interest users of this forum

The first is a pair of R1 (4’ diameter) brass flange bearing turnouts which seem to have a US retail price of around $30

These differ in their design from others in the market in how they are designed to avoid derailments to the maximum extent possible.

The second is a new switch ground throw that can be used with most turnouts in the market which seems to have a US retail of around $10

The internals of this ground throw follow the design concepts of a standard prototype ground throw and offer a positive throw in each direction.

I consulted on the design of each and am very pleased with the final products. While the turnout is to small to be used on the SJR&P, We intend over the next year to standardize on this ground throw for our manual turnouts.

Stan

#2

Stan

Couldn’t see the pics??

#3

I see a four ft radius switch listed, but no #4.

Is this the ground throw?

#4

Looking at the Bachmann web site the switch looks very similar to my Aristo switches except that plastic check rails are of a differing appearance and the frog looks shorter in length… This 4’ dia release is far to small for my railroad so I will await the larger sizes. Bachmann have been a while getting around to producing switches.

I do like the look of the switch stand. A quite bold appearance. I wonder what the prototype is?

UK readers may note that Bachmann UK states May/June stockholding for these items.

#5

Steve Featherkile said:

I see a four ft radius switch listed, but no #4.

Is this the ground throw?

Steve

Ops 4’ diameter (R1) [post corrected above]

Yes that is the ground throw. It allows two different throw distances and three different distances from the turnout.

The prototype is based on one from Chama and one from the B&M which is sitting in our back yard. To make it work well for our non scale hands it had to be made larger.

Stan

#6

Stan, when will they be available? When will larger radius, or numbered turnouts become available?

#7

Steve Featherkile said:

Stan, when will they be available? When will larger radius, or numbered turnouts become available?

Steve

The R1 turnouts and manual ground throws are available now.

Larger radius or numbered turnouts would be a great addition and I hope they produce them. I suspect they are looking to see how well these sell before expanding the line. There has been a lot of discussion of late on both the lack of new products and the high cost of Large Scale, especially track.

A retail price of $30 for one of the best R1 brass turnouts in the market will hopefully spur some growth which in turn will drive future new products.

Stan

#8

Stan,

Do the ground throws allow trains to spring through the switches when converging in the opposite route of the throw?

#9

Rockwall Canyon Jeff said:

Stan,

Do the ground throws allow trains to spring through the switches when converging in the opposite route of the throw?

Jeff

The turnouts have a spring built into the throwbaw similar in concept to the HO Peco turnouts. This allows a train converging in the opposite route to properly set the orientation of the turnout and keeps the points set once thrown.

The ground throws are a positive throw device and will not allow the turnout to change orientation.

Many Large Scale manual throws have a spring in them which does allow a spring turnout. The problem is that outside this type of mechanism tends not to have the pressure to maintain a positive throw which can lead to derailments.

The Bachmann ground throw will allow the points to easily move even if there is dirt around the throwbar but does not allow a spring action or any other movement of the points till the direction of the ground throw is manually altered.

Stan

#10

So in other words, the turnouts already have a built-in spring, which would allow a train to "flip-through.". (With the ground throw installed you cannot do this anymore).

 

 

On my railroad, I've been focusing a bit on operational reliability lately. I find that having Peco-style flip springs on my mainline switches helps prevent a lot of derailments caused by operator errors.  I would think the ground throws will be great to use on yard and industrial tracks where operations are slower/deliberate, and details are better appreciated.  Great work, Stan, I look forward to adding a few of the ground throws in the future.  

#11

Like the throw. If $10 is in fact the price it may replace the Tenemiles I currently use.

#12

Rockwall Canyon Jeff said:

So in other words, the turnouts already have a built-in spring, which would allow a train to “flip-through.”. (With the ground throw installed you cannot do this anymore).

On my railroad, I’ve been focusing a bit on operational reliability lately. I find that having Peco-style flip springs on my mainline switches helps prevent a lot of derailments caused by operator errors. I would think the ground throws will be great to use on yard and industrial tracks where operations are slower/deliberate, and details are better appreciated. Great work, Stan, I look forward to adding a few of the ground throws in the future.

Jeff

Yes that is correct.

If you are using R1 turnouts (to tight for our railroad) you will find that the new Bachmann turnouts significantly reduce derailments and can be used straight out of the box.

A lot of work was done in observing how trains pass through our turnouts. While it would be nice if all models followed the wheel standards precisely, such is not the case. For example existing products have back to back wheels ranging from 1.5" to 1.6".

A real problem in existing turnouts is that the flanges hit the entry part of the guard rails which can cause derailments. The Bachmann turnouts have guardrails that are wider on the entry and exit so that the wheels glide in. This is a real improvement.

Likewise flange depths vary a great deal as well from 0.068" to 0.15". Bachmann chose a mid range and uses ramps to guide the wheels through the frog area which prevent the wheel bouncing when it hits the point of the frog.

Hopefully other manufacturers will adopt some of the innovations in these turnouts.

Stan

#13

The throws seem to be $17 on the Bachmann web site

Jerry

#14

I can’t say about Bachmann Stateside prices Jerry, but very few UK retailers ever seem to charge the Bachmann list price. That is a far as large scale is concerned.

Anyway looking at the UK price list suggests a competitive price compared with PIKO and LGB similar products.

#15

That’s a nice looking throw. Is it compatible with other turnouts, or Bachmann only?

#16

Stan Ames said:

The second is a new switch ground throw that can be used with most turnouts in the market which seems to have a US retail of around $10.

Stan addressed this question in his initial post.

#17

Nice looking but will they fit other brands of turnouts such as Train-LI? Would be nice also to come out with SS switch. Later RJD

#18

Michael Moradzadeh said:

That’s a nice looking throw. Is it compatible with other turnouts, or Bachmann only?

Michael

The Bachmann ground throw was designed to work with most turnouts in the market.

There are two important characteristics to achieve compatibility The first is the distance between the two ties on either side of the throwbar.

LGB set this distance many years ago and most manufacturers have followed this with their turnouts.

The second is the distance the throwbar moves. There is no uniform distance here and some brands of the same turnout have changed this distance over the years.

To address this the Bachmann ground throw has two throw distances of approximately 6mm and 9mm. Most turnouts will work with one or the other.

When you screw in the ground throw you may have to enlarge one or both screw holes slightly to center the points.

Hope that helps

Stan

#19

I wouldn’t mind trying some of these if I could find them for $10. Any ideas?

#20

So far the Bachmann brass range has been limited. It would be nice to have them expand the range as their products are available in the UK. It would be an ideal UK replacement for Aristo.

I don’t see stailess steel on the horizon RJ, as mentioned above their brass range needs more expansion. But you never know… (http://largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-laughing.gif)