Large Scale Central

M&K Sugar Mill

Modeling
#61

Update:

I actually made some progress! I was going to start to cut the base for my roof, but something wasn’t quite right…It turned out, I had not centered the peak and, to make things worse, mounted the two end walls such that the peaks did not even align!

Measure 57 times, cut once, and screw it up anyway… I called for OD (some good from this remote schooling stuff!), and we worked together to use a hotknife to cut off the peak at the left. We have found that the knife bends pretty easily, so she worked the handle while I pushed the blade gently on the other side. Off it came, a couple of skewer bits and some glue later, and all was well.

Today, there was progress on multiple fronts. Kid-zilla and I caulked up all the seams. I am sure this is unnecessary, but it seems like a good idea to me n terms of weatherproofing.

He then assisted me in taking some of the curl out of our beverage cans. We ran them back and forth over his table until the were OK:

I did try to get him to wear gloves. He refused, and I guess we got lucky. I’ll start annealing the metal in the oven over the next several days as CINCHOUSE permits. Yes, this is tedious…

For reasons I no longer remember, I had resolved upon making the loading deck from plastic sheet. We have a shattered sheet of plexiglass we’ve been slowly cutting up for projects, and one shard was a near perfect fit. After shaping it, I followed Ancient Wisdom, scribed it, stressed it with and old saw, painted it, and gave it a wash. The result, prior to some clear flat paint, is below next to my usual tools of the trade:

Never mind that some of those lines are only parallel in a non-Euclidean sense, I thought it looked pretty good. OD even asked, “Where’d you get that?” Score one for me! I know this is not a new technique, but I had never used it before. OD suggested we actually make the rest of the loading shed in a similar way. Since we have to make doors and stuff, why not? The irregular shards of this plastic are insufficient for the job - and I’ve no idea what glue will work or desire to experiment - but sheet styrene is available locally. May as well reinforce success.

The last bit of work today involved sketching on the windows. Naturally, as the picture shows, I loused this up:

I’ll cut out the holes and fit the egg crate (Thanks for the suggestion, Bill!) during the next surge. While not authentic to any mills of which I am aware, this style and placement is similar to the contemporaneous buildings still standing in Pearl Harbor Naval Shipyard, making it authentic to time and place. The black areas is where can would be offloaded onto a conveyor and hauled into the building. OD didn’t think trying to cut a depression in the wall to increase the illusion would be worth the effort. Then she said something to the effect of, “Of course, if this were my project, I’d have build a detailed conveyor! But, you know, this one is yours, Dad.” Smart aleck.

I’ve some MOW work and loco maintenance on my “to do” list, but the project is beginning to resolve into bite sized sub-elements of things I can do with 10-20 minutes here and there. Oh, and we are back on a “stay-at-home” order. Darn the luck…

Updates as warranted, and, GAP, thanks again for the tip on the adhesive!

Eric

#62

Eric that is coming together nicely and am awaiting the window look, keep up the good work, Bill

#63

Bill,

Thanks. I fitted the first window today. Per your suggestions, I used egg-crate. I filed and sanded things smooth, then hit it with flat black primer.

I’ll need to hit some of the interior with black latex paint, but this should look really, really good when I get the metal sheets emplace around it. I’ll get the other two windows emplaced over the coming days.

I am waiting for things to cool down before starting to anneal the cans. The stuff under the blue tape is the stucco I am using to represent the concrete foundation of the mill. It needs some touch up work and, in time, some darkening. I also want to draft the whole complex out to the RR to see how much and deeply you can see into the loader shed. I am wondering if I can get away with scribing and painting the interior instead of lining it. At a minimum, I think I’ll need to frame the “opening” where the conveyor would enter as well as the interior of the door to the loading dock. I also need to deck where tracks would pass over the conveyor, to help further the impression that the tracks pass over something. Oh, and I am still working on how to implement Tim’s idea regarding the roof!

Updates as required!

Eric

#64

Eric, that looks great

#65

Eric, that looks great

#66

Bill,

Thanks! Kid-zilla has been my building buddy as we go through another stay-at-home order. We have been addressing some MOW issues in the morning then retreating to the shade of the lanai to work on this project. Over the course of the week, he helped me apply another coat of stucco for the “concrete” foundation and blacken the window frames:

It is really starting to come together, which makes progress easier. Here is what it looks like:

I am trying to knock out as much stuff as a I can with material on hand. It is still too hot to anneal the beverage cans, so I have focused on the loader shed. The entrance and exit are just big enough that some level of detail needs to be implied, even from the likely viewing angles simulated below. I made a portal to accentate the impression of an open building, and scribed that scrap plastic to look like a deck. The barndoor contraption seen above will be a simulated drawbridge that would drop to allow workers to transport sugar to the loading dock:

In reality, cane would come in one side and sugar would come out another, but I don’t have the luxury of space of 1880-s Oahu! I need to at least show a plausible work flow, and it will give just a hint of detail for folks that get low and lean in.

On the opposite side, I am going to have to make / imply the a door to the loading dock:

I considered cutting a hole and framing a door with scrap lumber on hand, but I found from the windows large holes leave the foam structurally compromised. The door will have to be closed, and I will have to make one for the front and one for inside the shed. Because of the thickness of the foam, I would not use it as a core for a simulated wooden frame building with train-sized pass throughs again! Given the relative ease - and fun! - or working with salvaged plastic and my bag of random styrene, I might choose that material for a future project. But I am getting ahead of myself!

I am satisfied I can simulate the wood on the interior by scribing lines with my hot knife. I’ll try to do that today. If it looks good, I may see if I can transform foam into plausible “wood” on the outside, too, so that can proceed. If not, I’ll wait until after the lockdown and get the proper styrene to cut, scribe, and fit to the exterior. I’ll get a nice PVC pipe for the stack and the proper adhesive for the metal siding at that time, too.

Updates as required!

Eric

#67

Update:

Using Tim’s suggestion, I made a “plug” for the roof and it just slides right into the frame. For reasons unknown, I had a real mental road block on this step. In the end, I used a 30-60-90 triangle, fashioned some inserts, grabbed the trusty TiteBond III, and - pau (finished)!

I added some bracing and glued the whole lot together (not shown). It works great, thanks, Tim! Once I locate some scrap PVC that will become a chimney in 1:24-ish PLAYMOBIL scale, I’ll drive a hole in the roof and fashion some sort of “plug” to the base for the chimney. That should effectively secure the roof against almost all but the worst weather.

Oldest son helped me apply a finish to the loader shed interior. I had bucket of “corodvan brown” form the hardware store’s “dent and ding” rack that matches my natural lava rocks. While a bit “purpley” for exterior use otherwise, it worked out fine for the interior of the shed. I first scribed some lines to imply boards, then we painted it, applied a wash of India ink, and dry brushed on some burnt sienna. Once I mount some interior doors, it’ll be just fine, with enough detail to suggest a functioning shed.

I disabused myself of the notion of trying to make the exterior look like wood, though, at least for this project! Once the lock-down ends, its off to the hobby shop for styrene for scribing and stressing for the “wood” exterior.

Today, I found the adhesive GAP recommended. I am running out of excuses to hold off annealing, cutting, and crimping all those cans! In truth, it has been pretty warn here! Still, it is the only step for which I currently have all materials on hand, so I may beg CINCHOUSE or use of her oven.

Yesterday, we observed Labor Day by playing on the RR and brining it to “full dress Wild West” for our “Little People on the Railroad Day.” No progress on the Mill, but a good reminder this is all supposed to be fun! In other great news, our neighbors re-roofed late last week, so no second story will soon block the view just beyond our sight plane!

If you must have a stay-at-home order, having an outdoor hobby and this view makes it much, much easier to endure! We are blessed that sunsets like this will continue to grace the Triple O for the foreseeable future!

Stay will!

Updates as required!

Eric

#68

Let the annealing…BEGIN!

We ran out of the materials we need to make a ramp, the doors, and the stairs an they city extended the stay-at-home order which means styrene will not be forthcoming. This also means I ran out of excuses to continue converting beverage cans into siding. Using a process described in the June 2013 GR, I’ve got a dozen split upon, semi-flattened cans backing at 480 F in CINCHOUSE’s oven. At this rate, it’ll take 9 days to anneal the lot. I can cut, crimp, and glue as we go, as long as I am careful to not glue over areas marked for doors and the stack.

Speaking of stack, I only had 1" diameter PVC at home, which was visually too skinny. I have to source some 2" scrap of about 2’-3’. Always something! I also need to come the garden for a broken epee blade / current plant stake to serve as the roof topper. Don’t tell OD! (http://largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-wink.gif)

Updates are progress dictates!

Eric

#69

Your project has inspired me to buy a sheet of foam to build a manufacturing building on my layout. I am working over the size requirements right now looking at yours for ideas. Look forward tot he progress.

#70

Pete,

Glad to be a provider of inspiration for a change! I really, really like foam. It is very forgiving, which, for me, is important. Because I am using it as a core, it is easy to shim and shape to get it all to work. It takes TiteBond III well, and the stucco stuck easily. Its only real disadvantage has been that it is so thick, I would be loathe to use it for a building with a visible interior. For our bakery, it worked as a semi-shadow box in a display window. I am toying with a fuller exploration of a shadowbox concept in a to-be-determined future project!

The annealed cans, by the way, are much, much easier to work with than their “raw” counterparts. It finished the flattening, and, after running them through the crimper, it is pretty easy to re-flatten them. I first tried to cut them to shape using a template, but found it easier to simply scribe the lines using a dental tool or awl, cut them, and crimp them. I improved upon the process by letting Oldest Son cut them:

You can see the sheets in the foreground. I have to get a can of primer to color and dull them up. As I approach this phase of the project, I am trying to make sure I apply sheets of metal in ways that make sense, minimize waste, and improve drainage. I don’t want, for instance, the “wood” sheet on the loader shed to look like it is nailed to the metal on the mill proper.

I am tinkering on the drawbridge for the shed that will imply an ability to get sugar from the mill to the loading dock, and I am applying some washes to the “concrete” (stucco) foundation. I’ll add some earth tones later. I have three doors I put together from styrene ready for dull coat. It occurred to me I need a way to get workers up to the doors, and I am debating a ramp (easy and practical) vs. a stairwell (less easy). I think there are logical reasons for both approaches, so I am leaning towards a ramp, using a foam core covered in concrete patch and scribed like stones. May as well tinker with yet another technique while I am at it!

Finally, and only because it is funny, I include a picture of Kid-zilla modeling my only piece of scrap PVC pipe"

That pipe won’t do!

Updates to follow as progress dictates!

Eric

#71

Eric here is a picture of "Lisa 'o’s window display I printed it on card stock from the computer and then laminated it and formed the shadow box glued it in the window leaving the top open so it building light could shin it at it worked great, hope this helps, building is looking great

Lisa O night time

#72

And we’re annealing, and cutting, and crimping, and painting, and repeating… Since the adhesive comes in a tube for glue guns, I want to build up a lot of siding material to try and use the glue up in one shot. I’ve found these glues do not store for long once opened.

In other news, I did locate the scrap pipe I needed for the stack at the hardware store, and I have puttered around with my doors and such. for the doors, I am debating the following course of action:

  1. Glue them over a piece of siding. Easy, but the extremely curious might notice this “cheat.” The mill sits quite a bit in from the garden, so this should not be too much of a problem.
  2. Cut a hole in a piece of siding and mount the door behind it. With a little extra effort, it avoids the issues above. If I screw it up, it’s back to annealing, cutting, crimping, and painting…
  3. Glue the door to the mill and place scrap siding around it. This “saves” a piece of siding, makes use of my scrap material, and should look OK. It might be fidgety.

We remain on a lock-down, so I still have to get the styrene for the exterior of the shed.

No pictures today!

Have a great weekend!

Eric

#73

‘Door frame.’ Glue door to the foam. Use scrap wood or whatnot to make a frame around the door. Then, run the siding to the edge of the frame. Or, alternatively run the siding to the edge of the door, then glue the frame atop the siding.

#74

Tim,

Option “B” above sounds like a winner! Of course, first, anneal, scribe, cut, crimp, paint, repeat…

Eric

#75

Update:

Anneal, scribe, cut, crimp, paint, repeat… There being only so much of that I can take, I twidgeted away on one of the loading sheds nominal details, the drawbridge that runs from the mill, crossed the track, and allows the sacks of refined sugar and workers to cross over to the loading dock.

I made a frame of scraps from some project (mine or my father-in-law’s, no idea) and bored some holes into it to serve as rotation point. I had a piece of metal rod left over from my failed attempt to use a robotics motor to power a locomotive, and Kid-zilla and I tapped it into place. Hey, at least it is still being used as an axle! Affixing the door to the axle was a problem. My original plan to use cotter pins and jewelry links proved twidgety, fragile, and visually obtrusive, so I just used thin wire to wrap around the axel, through a small hole in the brinde, and back under the door, taking advantage of low light and distance from the wire to “hide” it in plain sight.

On the top of the frame, we tapped two holes and put 3mm grommets in them. Then we ran lengths of jewelry chain through the grommets, wiring them to the bridge as we did the axle on the lower portion. We stuck picture hanging nails through the chains on the backside to hold them in place, the glued the whole assembly to the mill.

The faux draw bridge is below:

This is taken from about 5’ closer than any viewers will ever get. There are a few more details to go on this area. The first is the approach to the “pit” where the conveyor would be. If I had a longer run of track, I’d make a small rise. Episodic bouts of poor MOW practices have led to the conclusion that tight turns, tight spaces, and short runs do not favor grades! I think I’ll make the approach to the “conveyor” concrete, probably using stucco to be consistent with the rest of the mill, and place timbers across the conveyor area’s lip along with a few stringers underneath them and possibly alongside. This should still meet the goal of implying some sort of depression under the tracks. The other detail is a simulated door to the loading dock, which, as mentioned, will be made from scribed styrene and match one on the other side. Hopefully, the hobby shop survived the latest shutdown.

Meanwhile, I located a 4’ length of PVC, shown below alongside a ruler and the mill:

It needs to be tall, but there is a point where realistic looks ridiculous, too. At 6" above the mill roof’s peak, I think it will look tall enough to be impressive without becoming a PVC Sears Towe looming over the “mountains” behind it.

As ever, I am happy to receive any guidance / suggestions.

Before closing this update, a few thoughts on the annealed beverage can process:

  1. Not all cans are equal. Some companies make thinner cans, apparently, and they are much, much easier to work with, requiring only one run through the crimper.
  2. It stinks. The whole house smells like hot metal for about 3 hours. Anneal at your own risk!
  3. The painting tree can only shield 12 panels at a time. We spray paint in the lee of a coconut tree. Maybe it’s time to reconsider that choice!

Updates to follow as required (anneal, scribe, cut, crimp, paint, repeat…)!

Eric

#76

Update:

And this, folks, is what 100 beverage cans look like after being rendered to 4"x2.5" simulated corrugated metal siding:

Sadly, even by using the annealed, uncrimped scraps to the left, this probably not enough material It is, however, enough material to move forward. Spraying the siding in the lee of the coconut tree proved wasteful. I think (pray?) I can spray the cans after they have been affixed to the foam core, but I am not sure I am willing to take the risk. Anyway, there is enough material on hand now to continue the process of turning foam into 1:24 scale mill. I should be able to turn-to on that tomorrow.

I also rethought the loader shed area a bit. I spread stucco up to the dark strip that simulates the conveyor’s pit. Since my mill has a “concrete” foundation, this is consistent with the rest of the project. This will allow a shorter “bridge” over the pit itself, simplifying things, allowing me to proceed with material on hand, and, hopefully, enhance the impression there is a “pit” in there. I’ll size it to fit between the ties of the 12" straight tracks to hold it in place while giving it enough room to wiggle a bit laterally. I can add some walkways on either side, too. I am also reconsidering how best to cover the outside of the shed in the event styrene may not be available locally. I may go back to craftsticks, but, regardless of glue, I have found these tend to pull away from core material over time.

I procrastinated a bit on cutting the stack, but it is time to cut it, bore the hole in the roof, and move forward…Next week! The procrastination is giving me time to putter around with my ideas for basic lighting, so all is OK.

Updates will continue as progress merits.

Eric

#77

Eric Mueller said:

And we’re annealing, and cutting, and crimping, and painting, and repeating… Since the adhesive comes in a tube for glue guns, I want to build up a lot of siding material to try and use the glue up in one shot. I’ve found these glues do not store for long once opened.

In other news, I did locate the scrap pipe I needed for the stack at the hardware store, and I have puttered around with my doors and such. for the doors, I am debating the following course of action:

  1. Glue them over a piece of siding. Easy, but the extremely curious might notice this “cheat.” The mill sits quite a bit in from the garden, so this should not be too much of a problem.
  2. Cut a hole in a piece of siding and mount the door behind it. With a little extra effort, it avoids the issues above. If I screw it up, it’s back to annealing, cutting, crimping, and painting…
  3. Glue the door to the mill and place scrap siding around it. This “saves” a piece of siding, makes use of my scrap material, and should look OK. It might be fidgety.

We remain on a lock-down, so I still have to get the styrene for the exterior of the shed.

No pictures today!

Have a great weekend!

Eric

Eric,

For the glue gun tubes after opening try using some plastic cling wrap over the cut opening which is held in place by the nozzle tubes or leaving the tube and screwing a small self tapper into the opening to keep the air out.

I am getting close to starting the construction of the peninsula that will feature a sugar mill so I am lurking in the shadows and watching how you do yours so I can pinch some ideas.

#78

Eric Mueller said:

Update:

Anneal, scribe, cut, crimp, paint, repeat… There being only so much of that I can take, I twidgeted away on one of the loading sheds nominal details, the drawbridge that runs from the mill, crossed the track, and allows the sacks of refined sugar and workers to cross over to the loading dock.

I made a frame of scraps from some project (mine or my father-in-law’s, no idea) and bored some holes into it to serve as rotation point. I had a piece of metal rod left over from my failed attempt to use a robotics motor to power a locomotive, and Kid-zilla and I tapped it into place. Hey, at least it is still being used as an axle! Affixing the door to the axle was a problem. My original plan to use cotter pins and jewelry links proved twidgety, fragile, and visually obtrusive, so I just used thin wire to wrap around the axel, through a small hole in the brinde, and back under the door, taking advantage of low light and distance from the wire to “hide” it in plain sight.

On the top of the frame, we tapped two holes and put 3mm grommets in them. Then we ran lengths of jewelry chain through the grommets, wiring them to the bridge as we did the axle on the lower portion. We stuck picture hanging nails through the chains on the backside to hold them in place, the glued the whole assembly to the mill.

The faux draw bridge is below:

This is taken from about 5’ closer than any viewers will ever get. There are a few more details to go on this area. The first is the approach to the “pit” where the conveyor would be. If I had a longer run of track, I’d make a small rise. Episodic bouts of poor MOW practices have led to the conclusion that tight turns, tight spaces, and short runs do not favor grades! I think I’ll make the approach to the “conveyor” concrete, probably using stucco to be consistent with the rest of the mill, and place timbers across the conveyor area’s lip along with a few stringers underneath them and possibly alongside. This should still meet the goal of implying some sort of depression under the tracks. The other detail is a simulated door to the loading dock, which, as mentioned, will be made from scribed styrene and match one on the other side. Hopefully, the hobby shop survived the latest shutdown.

Meanwhile, I located a 4’ length of PVC, shown below alongside a ruler and the mill:

It needs to be tall, but there is a point where realistic looks ridiculous, too. At 6" above the mill roof’s peak, I think it will look tall enough to be impressive without becoming a PVC Sears Towe looming over the “mountains” behind it.

As ever, I am happy to receive any guidance / suggestions.

Before closing this update, a few thoughts on the annealed beverage can process:

  1. Not all cans are equal. Some companies make thinner cans, apparently, and they are much, much easier to work with, requiring only one run through the crimper.
  2. It stinks. The whole house smells like hot metal for about 3 hours. Anneal at your own risk!
  3. The painting tree can only shield 12 panels at a time. We spray paint in the lee of a coconut tree. Maybe it’s time to reconsider that choice!

Updates to follow as required (anneal, scribe, cut, crimp, paint, repeat…)!

Eric

Eric,

After driving past and looking at at least 6 different sugar mills in my travels of the last week, I think 6 inches maximum would be more than ample, most mill stacks here in Aust are not that tall when compared to power station stacks for instance.

They really are just oversize exhaust pipes for the furnaces after all, plus the modern ones have fly ash washers fitted so all that comes out is water vapour.

#79

I “Love” it but it’s only my opinion !

#80

Update,

First, GAP, thanks for numerous tips. I cut the stack as you suggested. Based on photos, the local ones came in dark, light, and dark-and-light. I think I am going to go with “spray can primer black” to make it stand out from the mill! All had some sort of lip near the top I will have to emulate, too.

Second, I proceeded applying siding to the mill today. Again, GAP, to you the honors for tipping me off to “DAP 3.0” It is foam safe, tacky enough to adhere on contact, and slow drying enough to allow for adjustments. I needed a lot of those!

I decided to start with the mill’s backside to allow for experimentation and mistakes. I first marked up some basic dimensions to begin estimating the number of panels, each of which is about 4"x2.5":

I then began experimenting with placement. I knew there were variances in width and length of my panels, so I figured I had to leave room for overlap and screen for “too skinny” pieces, saving them for other areas near the edge. I found that the crimping crunched the width about 1/8", so I made marks every 2 1/8". This proved to allow for overlap and the occasional “skinny” panel. I also dressed the edges to their tops, using a straight edge. I found it was easier to layer glue on the foam and press panels in place than to put glue on the panels and then press them to the core. The results are below:

Note, GAP, I cheated and bought a cap when I got the adhesive! Residual curl in the panels meant some did not adhere. I am not sure if I should let this be and call it “character” or try to fix it with CA glue later. The bond would be panel-to-panel, so there would be minimal threat to the foam underneath. These gaps, though, are enough cause for concern to disabuse me of spray painting panels on the foam! I have lots of annealed scrap waiting to be trimmed, crimped, and painted to cover that remaining strip of foam along the top.

There was only minimal overhang, and, by shear dumb luck, the placement of the panels corresponds to the sill of the windows! See below:

Incidentally, the PLAYMOBIL crew was doing MOW work. TONKA-Dude stepped in.

I’ll let all this dry overnight before proceeding with the paneling. GAP, if you go this route, be advised the only fun part of the paneling may be the VB that stands between you and the raw material! Glad I can show you a way, even if it is a way to avoid!

Before closing, Rooster, thanks for your compliment. The loader shed part of the project, while perhaps the least visible, has consumed a good bit of mental energy. The Mill is in an illogical position due to constraints of my garden, so showing a plausible work flow has become and increasingly important goal along the way. This required just enough detail in this area to imply it without so much the project bogged down on things that would largely remain barely seen. I did consider adding railings on the walk ways to protect the employees pushing / raking cane onto the conveyor, but the constraints of space might have impeded the more important visual aspect of cane cars actually travelling through the shed! The little side projects to bring this part of the project along have broken the tedium of the siding effort.

Updates and progress dictates!

Eric