Curmudgeon said:To be perfectly honest, no. I have not noticed this problem. Probably, because I do not have the disposable income required for the more expensive locos. I only have starter set locos right now, three LGB US profile starter sets and one Bachmann Big hauler. I have absolutely no illusions of grandeur.
Ever notice that on track power cheapie starter set locos are MUCH faster than more expensive locos? Because, most starter sets don't have that network. You should read up on the early red catalog about main line/switching locos sometime. TOC
In the LGB line, more expensive are things like UINTAHs, Sumpters, Moguls, and basically anything with sound.
dave wiskochil said:I've also considered computer control for some aspects of my dream layout, but I know nothing about it. How does it work? Is there a device that connects to the computer by USB or some such? What software does it use? Can you suggest a website that I could start researching?
But in my situation, I am very involved in computer control. I want to have five trains running at a time. All running by the correct rules of the road, with schedules and goals. I want to interface with that system with one cab, one loco, to move around the railroad and interface with those other locos. Consider it a big, costly, finely detailed video game, I guess.
What you probably do not realize is the rosy path some are laying out before you.
You know the trainsim games?
And the digital comands?
The end goal is to get you in the closet, video camera on board, and run your trains from the closet without ever actually seeing them.
I can’t wait!
Curmudgeon said:
What you probably do not realize is the rosy path some are laying out before you. You know the trainsim games? And the digital comands? The end goal is to get you in the closet, video camera on board, and run your trains from the closet without ever actually seeing them.I can’t wait!
If that is what you envision, that is what will come of computer control for your layout.
For me, it already is different. I have a limited control set that allows me to operate a train, while the rest of the layout works on its own. This also allows me to set the controller down, focus attention elsewhere, and have the layout continue to operate.
For me, its great. I cant imagine what it will be like for you.
Kevin Morris said:I am using the limited control program included with LGB's MTS system. Better software exists, an example is Railroad & Comany.... http://www.freiwald.com/dave wiskochil said:I've also considered computer control for some aspects of my dream layout, but I know nothing about it. How does it work? Is there a device that connects to the computer by USB or some such? What software does it use? Can you suggest a website that I could start researching?
But in my situation, I am very involved in computer control. I want to have five trains running at a time. All running by the correct rules of the road, with schedules and goals. I want to interface with that system with one cab, one loco, to move around the railroad and interface with those other locos. Consider it a big, costly, finely detailed video game, I guess.
Several DCC vendors sell a computer interface, and most of the aftermarket software will work. My layout interfaces with my laptop via serial port, but it could be controlled with a USB port.
Kevin Morris said:Kevin,
I've also considered computer control for some aspects of my dream layout, but I know nothing about it. How does it work? Is there a device that connects to the computer by USB or some such? What software does it use? Can you suggest a website that I could start researching?
How many websites would you like? How much automation would you like? 
If you plan on analogue, CMRI is a nice start. Model Railroader ran a complete series back in 19whatever. There’s also the book “Build your own universal computer interface” Bruce Chubb; ISBN 0-8306-3122-4.
If you plan on DCC, best plan on lots of reading. In DCC there are smart systems and there are not so smart systems. The not so smart systems cost you lots of money in the long run! Just ask those people who bought MTS starting with “Incarnation 1” and then wanted/needed the newer features of “Incarnation 2” and “3”.
dave wiskochil said:Kevin Morris said:I am using the limited control program included with LGB's MTS system. Better software exists, an example is Railroad & Comany.... http://www.freiwald.com/dave wiskochil said:I've also considered computer control for some aspects of my dream layout, but I know nothing about it. How does it work? Is there a device that connects to the computer by USB or some such? What software does it use? Can you suggest a website that I could start researching?
But in my situation, I am very involved in computer control. I want to have five trains running at a time. All running by the correct rules of the road, with schedules and goals. I want to interface with that system with one cab, one loco, to move around the railroad and interface with those other locos. Consider it a big, costly, finely detailed video game, I guess.Several DCC vendors sell a computer interface, and most of the aftermarket software will work. My layout interfaces with my laptop via serial port, but it could be controlled with a USB port.
And then there are the systems where you don’t need to buy a separate computer interface, the interface is built into the command station and serves multipurpose functions i.e. such as firmware updates etc. etc., but as I mentioned in the previous post, those are the smart systems.
Dear All - I have come to a conclusion, watching all you guys tying yerselves into pretzels/double Moebius strips over this stuff. It has taken some time, but then, I’m getting older by the minute.
DCC/MTS/Tsunami/Airwire/…all digital systems?
Now I know how a it feels to be a dog looking at a flat-screen TV.
tac- rapidly becoming an all-live steamer…
Terry A de C Foley said:
Dear All - I have come to a conclusion, watching all you guys tying yerselves into pretzels/double Moebius strips over this stuff. It has taken some time, but then, I'm getting older by the minute.DCC/MTS/Tsunami/Airwire/…all digital systems?
Now I know how a it feels to be a dog looking at a flat-screen TV.
tac- rapidly becoming an all-live steamer…
www.ovgrs.org
Yeah but the dog still enjoys the wide screen Gravy Train commercials just as much as the technogeek who bought the TV
I’m now more ever convinced my KISS principle is the way to go…
BTW thats “Keep It Stupidly Simple”
How is your outside/garage layout coming along Vic.
It’s been a long time since I’ve been privvy to an update.I’ve just had my first open day here.Everyone brought a wonderful spread of models,bought and made.We had live steam,battery,diesel-electric and electric.Only thing missing was clockwork.(couldn’t find the bike keys !)
How are you?
I think traffic control put Vic in a holding pattern…
Terry, didn’t you know…?? We’ve set this whole discussion up just to drive you nuts…:lol:
Dave W, the hard part about holding this discussion is that each of you have an entirely different view of what the railroad is supposed to do. Dave G (TOC) is an operator. That requires a “hands on” type of control, a thinking engineer and is totally unsuitable for a computer interface. Whereas you seem to be the type that likes to set up several trains, grab a cold one and sit back with your friends and enjoy the trains running through the garden. There is nothing wrong with either method of enjoying this hobby. But you two will never agree on control of the layout til the day h*ll freezes over and Bob is hauled off to the mental ward for banging his head against a wall too long. But that is what makes this hobby so interesting…everyone can create his own world and run it as he wishes.
The deeper I get into this hobby the more I appreciate the diversity it brings to us…including the multitude of scales and operating methods.
We had this… http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=do6Aq4JZ6PQ and this… http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jRhLDz1-Gxc and this… http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ne-iB6EZeHw and this… http://www.gscalemad.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=8842 I’m sure Vic will catch up
<<<< But that is what makes this hobby so interesting…everyone can create his own world and run it as he wishes.>>>>
As long as he doesn’t stand on a soapbox and try to preach and/or cram his priority down listener’s throats.
No one’s system is better than the other.
No one’s method of operation is better than the other.
Some are just a bit more “interesting.”
TOG
John Bouck said:
<<<>>>As long as he doesn’t stand on a soapbox and try to preach and/or cram his priority down listener’s throats.
No one’s system is better than the other.
No one’s method of operation is better than the other.
Some are just a bit more “interesting.”TOG
My point exactly.
Cut the crap and enjoy the hobby.
Each to his own.
Show what you are doing instead of ‘being clever’.
One may claim dcc, but about one inch of wire actually can qualify.
My stuff is digital, too.
I just have removed the constaints of mains, track cleaners, clamps, bonds, feeders, power districts, programming tracks, seminars, special forums, customer support staff, incompatible protocols.
Like I said earlier, see what happens when you put a Quasinamin-equipped 3-truck Shay on your MTS controlled layout.
The number of folks who are absolutely clueless as to what needs to be done or how to do it is astounding.
Personally, I have no time for an automatically controlled railroad. The last thing I want from a railroad is to set it up so that it runs by itself, so that I am able to walk away from it. The enjoyment, I derive, is from actually being at the railroad and ‘operating it’.
David W. speaks of limited disposable income and yet has purchased one of the more expensive (now redundant) operating systems. Reminds me of the current ‘hoon’ situation we have in Australia, with speeding young drivers carrying out street races on public roads. These guys have road machines that they have spent forty to fifty to one hundred thousand dollars modifying to have the fastest car on this planet, but when told of a scheme that would cost them one hundred dollars to learn how to control their cars, the reply was, “I cannot afford $100.00 to spend on advanced driver education”.
I have seen many fully automatic railroads at exhibitions and my immediate thinking is walk away, nothing to see here. If one wants a completely auto railroad then save thousands of dollars and purchase a train simulator game for ten bucks, but firstly check to see if the game is actually compatible with your computer system software. Now that would be new, a manufacturer making a system totally incompatible with existing operating systems - totally captive market (as long as the manufacturer survives to keep the market).
I quite agree with the automated thing.I don’t go there.It’s far more fun with everything running at once.
We had 2 live steamers behind the shed on RC,2locos on MTS at the top.Everything run at the same time.
Line of sight.
Tim Brien said:
Personally, I have no time for an automatically controlled railroad. The last thing I want from a railroad is to set it up so that it runs by itself, so that I am able to walk away from it. The enjoyment, I derive, is from actually being at the railroad and 'operating it'.David W. speaks of limited disposable income and yet has purchased one of the more expensive (now redundant) operating systems. Reminds me of the current ‘hoon’ situation we have in Australia, with speeding young drivers carrying out street races on public roads. These guys have road machines that they have spent forty to fifty to one hundred thousand dollars modifying to have the fastest car on this planet, but when told of a scheme that would cost them one hundred dollars to learn how to control their cars, the reply was, “I cannot afford $100.00 to spend on advanced driver education”.
I have seen many fully automatic railroads at exhibitions and my immediate thinking is walk away, nothing to see here. If one wants a completely auto railroad then save thousands of dollars and purchase a train simulator game for ten bucks, but firstly check to see if the game is actually compatible with your computer system software. Now that would be new, a manufacturer making a system totally incompatible with existing operating systems - totally captive market (as long as the manufacturer survives to keep the market).
Tim,
There are different levels of automation, it is quite nifty if you can run your train under manual control and the rest is taken care of by “the box” and if you can add on several more manually controlled trains with “the box” still handling the rest, that is nifty.
In the smaller scales I’ve operated on many different layouts with many different schemes of op. Get a bunch of pros, she’ll be alright in complete manual. But “the box” may save your bacon if you have one or two “rocket scientists” at the op session, that is if the grasp the functions of the hand helds.
Did I ever mention the special handheldl I presented to the one “rocket scientist”. Piece of 2" square hardboard, 1 pushbutton, two wires soldered to the pushbutton but not connecting to anything. I called it the “Most simplified Handheld”, for those people who have trouble with a direction toggle and a speed pot. Yeah, I know I am mean!