http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/story/2013/07/18/business-cp-cn-rules.html
Interesting points of attention!
Seems like common sense rules. I guess it was too expensive, before. Did I say that out loud?
Some of those ‘rules’ are already in place here in the States. The FRA mandates some of them, and the railroad companies enforce the others…
Sounds to me like a bunch of fluff to appease the public when these rules are most likely all ready in place by the class I’s (CN & CP) in Canada.
Leaving a locomotive locked is nice in theory (every cab has outside lock) but not everyone has a locomotive lock key. I know some of the CN units I’ve been on have been locked with a switch lock. Reversers are a dime a dozen… Oh wait I mean they are ultra rare (just like the LGB boxes) 
But the underlying cause is of the derailment is that not enough hand brakes were tied. If you tie enough hand brakes the train won’t move. Simple as that!
Craig,
Precisely! But they rather apply a bit of fluff instead of being specific about such points as hand brakes and the proper manner to apply the required test. That could mean an extra hour of on-sheet time for applying/testing and extra time to release all the brakes again.
Hans-Joerg Mueller said:
Craig,
Precisely! But they rather apply a bit of fluff instead of being specific about such points as hand brakes and the proper manner to apply the required test. That could mean an extra hour of on-sheet time for applying/testing and extra time to release all the brakes again.
According to the GCOR (which I worked under) the rules state that a sufficient number of brakes be tied. Then in the Air Brake and Train Handling rules (specific to each railroad) this was defined as ‘sufficient’ to hold a train. Then it gave a list of procedures to ensure that the hand brakes held. And no it didn’t take an extra hour. It took maybe 20 minutes at tops. You make a 20 lb set, go tie hand brakes, and then come back to the cab. While the conductor is grabbing is grip, and the hoghead is putting his stuff into his grip, you release both the automatic and independent. Once the ETD tells you that the train line is charging again, the train is being held by the hand brakes. Then you wait until the airflow drops below the threshold, and you make a 20lb set. Meanwhile the conductor is sitting in the yard office (or the shuttle van). It doesn’t take that much extra time to do a release test.
When the relief crew gets on board the train, the first thing the conductor does is knocks off the brakes, and while he’s doing that the engineer is walking through the locomotives doing a daily inspection. Its really not that much extra effort to tie and release handbrakes.
And no you can’t be specific about X number of brakes to tie per train and tonnage along with grade! Because every brake has a different holding power. A skinny guy can tie 20 wimpy brakes, and the hand brake chain is loose (but tight) or a stronger guy who knows how to tie brakes can tie 10. Each is sufficient and would be tested by releasing the train line.
What happens when the rules state that X number of brakes must be tied, then X number is tied, and it’s proven to be insufficient? Per the ‘rules’ you tied the required amount? That’s specifically why the rules state a “sufficient number.”
Craig,
MM&A is one of only two railways in Canada permitted to run single person crew trains. Not only will the engineer/conductor be the only one doing all the work, he will also be fully responsible for everything, because the “suits” could convince Transport Canada that “it is safe enough”. Supposedly under any and all circumstances?
HJ,
I don’t agree with one man crews for a lot of reasons. Not having someone to bounce ideas off of in terms of safety is a big issue. I believe that there are some shortlines in the States that also have one man crews. Not sure on the exact number of jobs and/or railroads. Two people in the cab is a lot safer than one person!
I was told that I was responsible for the train even after I was past my hours of service, tied up and getting my federal rest. Explain that one!
Craig Townsend said:
HJ,
I don’t agree with one man crews for a lot of reasons. Not having someone to bounce ideas off of in terms of safety is a big issue. I believe that there are some shortlines in the States that also have one man crews. Not sure on the exact number of jobs and/or railroads. Two people in the cab is a lot safer than one person!
I was told that I was responsible for the train even after I was past my hours of service, tied up and getting my federal rest. Explain that one!
Railroads have a long history of being a semi-military service. Not para-military, like police, but still has some of the trappings of the military. This comes from the many West Point grads who built the railroads, to the plethora of former military who have operated the railroads over the years. There is a rigid “Chain of Command,” with Officers, Middle Management (Non Commissioned Officers) and then the workers (Private Soldiers). The Railroad has well defined Standard Operating Procedures, Rules and Regulations that other civilian corporations do not even come close to having. There is no (or very little) fraternization among the ranks. Other corporations are much more lax in that regard. I could go on, but you get the point.
Your responsibility for your train, even after it is tied up and you are getting your federally mandated rest comes from the 5th General Order that every recruit learns in his first few days in Boot Camp which says, “I will not quit my post until properly relieved.” If you have not been properly relieved by another crew, you are responsible for that train.
It may be harsh, but that is the only way to make it work.
Very interesting write-up on how loose things really are.
Hard to believe but …
http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/story/2013/07/18/transport-canada-rail-safety.html
Again the word “sufficient” keeps coming up. You can’t write a rule that gives a specific number for each and every train, other than by saying 100% of hand brakes must be tied.
But back to personal experience when I got in trouble for the roll out 36 hours after I cut away my conductor got in trouble for not applying the minimum number of handbrakes for the grade that the train was parked on (something like a .25% grade). But he applied a ‘sufficient’ number of brakes, he applied something like 3 or 4, but the ABTH chart said 5.
So the company couldn’t really get him for violating a rule, because the brakes he applied were sufficient to hold the train for 36 hours (the cause of the roll out was entirely different). So per the ABTH chart he was short a couple of brakes, but it held the train. The other concern that was brought up in the investigation was how is a conductor supposed to know the exact grade of every mile of the territory? Heck even engineers don’t know mile by mile grades. Engineers just know where it goes up and where it goes down.
I guess I just have a different perspective after working in the industry of a while.
Craig
PS. Most railroads are ‘self insured’… Its one of those ‘costs’ of doing business.
Craig,
I appreciate and respect your experience.
I find it interesting how the different supervising/regulating entities in Canada are unable to give a straight answer to specific questions.
BTW on the grade question: in Switzerland there is a marker for each change of grade e.g. 15‰ up or down as indicated by the marker, followed by the length of the grade e.g. 2415m.
Hans-Joerg Mueller said:
Craig,
I appreciate and respect your experience.
I find it interesting how the different supervising/regulating entities in Canada are unable to give a straight answer to specific questions.
BTW on the grade question: in Switzerland there is a marker for each change of grade e.g. 15‰ up or down as indicated by the marker, followed by the length of the grade e.g. 2415m.
I’m sure the FRA would give a similar response to those questions.
When I went through engineer training all of us new engineers were given a engineering track chart for all the subdivisions that we run on. These show the grade, curves, degree of curves, at grade crossings, signal locations, bridges, etc. They were helpful in learning the territory, but impractical to carry in your grip. The more you worked the territory the more you learned where the steep grades were. In mountain grade (2.2%) the signals would have a “G” marker on them to indicate that the grade was too steep to require a stop and proceed at a restricting indication. But no mile marker or anything to indicate the steepness, and/or the length.
Those Swiss sure know how to climb mountains at a 15% grade! The steepest I was on was a 5% grade on the “Boeing Hill”. The industry spur climbs from sea level up to the Boeing plant at Everett WA. Similar rules as the mountain grade, but we also had to put skates and chocks on all the wheels before uncoupling. And we worked with a 110 # train line instead of a 90# train line. That was a pucker factor at 5% grade, I can’t imagine a 15% grade!
That’s 15‰ (permille) aka 1.5%.
Okay
http://www.leaderpost.com/news/Older+111A+tank+cars+long+seen+rail+safety+risk/8686039/story.html
They aren’t all the same.
The rubber hits the road.
Bit by bit more information …
A lot of short lines make big money storing cars on their tracks. And not just in sidings either. If your a shortline and you have 5 miles of mainline track that doesn’t have a customer, but a leasing company contacts you to storage cars, you can sure bet that those cars are going to end up sitting on a mainline.
But for the accident up in Canada, I don’t find it anything more that SOP to stop a train on the main. I parked a many train on the main track and left the train unattended.
The very last paragraph of the article makes no sense to me… Why can’t the RR deliver cars to a customer? “On Wednesday, a rusted yellow derailer sat clamped on the siding in Nantes, with a large yellow warning sign planted in the gravel nearby. Farther back, nearly two-dozen boxcars remained in the same location on the siding where they have been since the crash. Mr. Brassard said the cars were scheduled to come to the Tafisa factory for loading but Quebec provincial police have not allowed them to be moved.”
There’s one thing that keeps bothering me about this accident, how come the locomotive is not in the pile up of tank cars?
(http://freightsheds.largescalecentral.com/users/hcng/1297439570647_ORIGINAL.jpg)
Everybody keeps talking about not enough brakes were or were not set. I want to know how the cars became uncoupled from the locomotive. And who’s to say what ever force did uncouple the cars could have released enough brakes to allow the cars to start rolling.
Chester Louis SA #64 Hampshire County Narrow Gauge