Large Scale Central

Hell on Wheels American

General Discussion
#1

So I got hooked on the AMC TV series Hell on wheels a few days ago. I am watching at a fevered pitch to catch up. I wanted to know what locomotive they are using for the show so I googled it. They often have more than one but there is a primary one that is a beat up wood burner. Turns out the thing is not a real locomotive and quite honestly doesn’t look real to me. Turns out it is plywood and Styrofoam. But worst of all it is not even very close to historicaly accurate compared to the replica at the Golden Spike National Park.

Hell on Wheels Version

UP Jupitor 119 as recreated by the park service.

Jupitor in its day.

There are some giant glaring mistakes. While I can understand that the folks at AMC are not making a historical documentary wouldn’t have been nice to get at least some of the details right.

A few explanations could be in order. First they are still no where near done and I ccan believe that a great number of different locomotives were used up to that famous day. Or they just don’t care to be accurate, or this is 100% fiction only very loosely based on history. I don’t know.

What I do know though is that I love the gritty litle beast they are using and it would be fun to model it.

#2

Its an NKP… as in No Known Prototype. It was built for the show and is made mostly of wood, the first season version had to be pushed with a pick-up truck. The second season they rebuilt the engine and a second engine, both to include a V8 truck motor driving the tender wheels with a chain.

Here’s a short from the series explaining how they built it:

https://youtu.be/WoLc1EZsRig

I like the series but I consider it about as historically accurate as Star Wars, its pure fiction that happens to use a real event as a stepping off point, but its pure fiction.

#3

Yeah I saw that video. Its actually pretty cool and I am trying to not be to critical I realize it is meant not for train buffs but for a TV drama. I believe the #2 loco in season two the coal burner is more accurate looking to the Jupiter. I just would have thought that they would have taken a road trip to Utah and at least tried to duplicate the UP Jupiter since it is a iconic locomotive and is synonymous with the UP and the Golden Spike. None the less though I do like the looks of what they build its a gritty little loco that just yells early work horse.

#4

One thing I noticed that was “wrong” until I looked at other period photos was the squared smoke box. Interesting detail but does show up on other period locos

#5

Devon Sinsley said:

One thing I noticed that was “wrong” until I looked at other period photos was the squared smoke box. Interesting detail but does show up on other period locos

They used it because it was MUCH easier to build out of plywood LOL (http://www.largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-wink.gif)

#6

Vic Smith said:

Its an NKP… as in No Known Prototype. It was built for the show and is made mostly of wood, the first season version had to be pushed with a pick-up truck. The second season they rebuilt the engine and a second engine, both to include a V8 truck motor driving the tender wheels with a chain.

Here’s a short from the series explaining how they built it:

https://youtu.be/WoLc1EZsRig

I like the series but I consider it about as historically accurate as Star Wars, its pure fiction that happens to use a real event as a stepping off point, but its pure fiction.

Star Wars is not history? I’m shocked, shocked, I tell you! (http://largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-surprised.gif)

#7

Vic got it wrong!

star wars IS history. just in the opposite direction as the romans are.

#8

From curiosity: Is Jupitor 119, the recreation, actually consistent in construction compared to the actual locomotive? My guess is all materials and parts are an exact duplication. However, one never knows. Is it to the Park Service’s credit this loco was not rented out for the movie – presuming a rental was a consideration.

Wendell

#9

Wendell,

The answer to your question is a definite no, it is not built as it was in the day. There is an excellent documentary on it. I will see if I can find a link to it. But the biggest challenge was that the technology no longer exists to build them that way. The other problem is that safety standards for boilers is much more stringent than the non existent standards back in the day. So they were forced to make some compromises in order to complete the job. What is most fascinating is that there were no existing locomotives of the type nor were there any drawings. These guys hired basically what one might call a team of forensic engineers to figure out how to make it as exacting as they could. Right down to the paint job. I highly recommend you watch the documentary. Its fascinating to me.

My apologies for my confusion. The Jupiter is not UP’s 119 it is CP’s #60. I am not sure now which one the documentary is about. Maybe both.

#10

Here is the link

#11

I’m glad you finally got the name spelled right!

That squared off smoke box / cylinder saddle is more typical of English designs. There were imports and a few copies, before ‘our’ style of longer smoke boxes predominated.

John

#12

There are references to true fact in the series. As an example I saw, online a day or two ago, an article about a two girls who were abducted by Native Americans in the 1860s ( I think it was). The younger one died and the older one’s face was tatooed identically like the prostatute’s face on the show. I am not a historian so there might be a lot of discrepancies but the show is interesting anyway.

#13

Yeah Ben I am a budding historian and one thing I have learned is even back in the day the newspapers embellished and used a whole lot of artistic lisc so to make a TV drama series that is not meant to be a historical documentary I guess we can forgive them for there creative interpretation of events. I do believe the show can give us a glimpse of what it might have been like. I have no complaints about the show from a complete drama series I find it quite entertaining.

I do believe the show is picking pieces of history and running with them. It would be interesting to know just how much of that is going on. Do you have a link tot hat article if it is online. I would like to read it.

#14

We are hooked on the series too. Lots of basis in History, but only an event or a name here and there are correct. Thomas Durant was in fact the head of the UP at the time and Credit Mobilier which was truly corrupt (Google Credit Mobilier Scandal) and that scandal included a US Senator. The UP Chief Engineer was a Civil War vet, but from the North - Bohanan is a purely fictional character.

This is the last season. Once the golden spike is pounded there is no more story!

#15

Daktah John said:

We are hooked on the series too. Lots of basis in History, but only an event or a name here and there are correct. Thomas Durant was in fact the head of the UP at the time and Credit Mobilier which was truly corrupt (Google Credit Mobilier Scandal) and that scandal included a US Senator. The UP Chief Engineer was a Civil War vet, but from the North - Bohanan is a purely fictional character.

This is the last season. Once the golden spike is pounded there is no more story!

Did they run out of railroads to build, once the Trans-continental was completed?

#16

Don’t give anything away. I am only half way through season two

#17

STAR WARS ISN’T REAL?!?!?!?!?!?!

Life. Ruined.

#18

Dang, Star Wars isn’t real. The next thing you will be telling me all those trains the UPS man has been delivering were not from Santa Claus. How am I going to explain that to the wife?

#19

I want to quell a vicious rumor right now. Who ever is spreading the bold lie that Star Wars is not real needs to be drawn and quartered. Senseless rumors like these have started wars. Of course Star Wars is real…Geez. Some people just like to start stuff. This could have been catastrophic if allowed to proliferate. Relax people Star Wars is real. How else would they be coming out with the next in the series of 100% factual documentaries this December.

#20

Devon Sinsley said:

Don’t give anything away. I am only half way through season two

I’ll give you through the weekend. You’ll probably get up to date by then. I don’t know how long AMC’s website will have S5E1 and last weekend’s S5E2. Can’t miss them!

Steve - This is the story of Colin Bohanan, not the RR. Pretty sure he will be retiring once the RR is complete, but we don’t know that yet. It has been announced that Season 5 is the end and it will have a long mid-season break.

Back to the original subject of the locomotive: Once I learned that it was fake I could see all the flaws and continuity issues when they show it running. Before I knew that it looked very real to me.