Large Scale Central

General Motors

General Discussion
#1

I read in the paper the other day a column by an analysis about what GM might do due to their recent problems.
They would drop Buick and Pontiac from the line all together.
They would drop the Chevy truck division and the Chevy large SUV division.
They would keep GMC to build the light trucks, larger trucks and large SUV’s.
They would keep Cadilac as is, perhaps making a “cheaper model” to make up for the high end Buick loss.
They would eliminate most small town dealerships, or under performing dealerships.
They would drop Hummer.
They would keep Saturn.
Chevrolet will still build Corvettes, and all the Chevy cars, less the fore mentioned SUV’s.

Interesting, Huh?

#2

There is still a GM buyout of Chrysler in the works. If that happens, with all those additional car lines, something would have to go.

I can’t say I would miss Buick. Does anyone miss Oldsmobile? I’ve always liked the sporty side of Pontiac, but probably wouldn’t buy another one for a long time. Consolidating trucks/SUVs to GMC makes sense, but they will need to make a models that sell for what the Chevy versions do now or risk loosing more market share to Japan.

#3
Jon Radder said:
There is still a GM buyout of Chrysler in the works. If that happens, with all those additional car lines, something would have to go.

I can’t say I would miss Buick. Does anyone miss Oldsmobile? I’ve always liked the sporty side of Pontiac, but probably wouldn’t buy another one for a long time. Consolidating trucks/SUVs to GMC makes sense, but they will need to make a models that sell for what the Chevy versions do now or risk loosing more market share to Japan.


I would miss Buick. Great cars. My wife’s Lucerne is basically the Cadillac DTS and built on the Cadillac line. Great car, and almost $20,000 less than the Cadillac. Before that she was driving a 2003 Buick Century that got 40mpg here in the mountains.
Ralph

#4

I really have no sympathy for the executives at GM

How many years has the writting been on the wall for Detroit that they needed to make changes, and start researching more fuel efficient and alternative fuel vehicles, yet they refused to aknowledge that the world automarket was going thru major changes. Jeeezzz the Smart has been around now for almost 10 years. The Prius for several years also, almost every non-Detroit manufacturer has been engineering and marketing the next generation of smaller comfortable fuel efficient vehicles . Yet GM still made big gas guzzlers, even when gas started to climb to over $3 a gallon 4 years ago, the marketing emphisis was still on large SUV type vehicles. They killed their own electric car, mothballed all the technology for 10 years, and now are playing a game of catchup with Toyota and Honda. Even now with GM hemmoraging money I’d bet a dollar there are still upper managenment types who are convinced that all they need is for gas prices to go down and all will be fine and they can go back to business as usual.

As much as I hate to say it, maybe they NEED to fail, it may be the only way to cut out their top managment and bring in new blood, that may be the ONLY way they can change their corporate culture and survive to produce appropriate cars for the new century.

#5
Victor Smith said:
I really have no sympathy for the executives at GM

How many years has the writting been on the wall for Detroit that they needed to make changes, and start researching more fuel efficient and alternative fuel vehicles


The Century my wife had sat 6 people and got 40mpg. How much more efficient do you want? And nearly all the Chevrolets have been able to run on E85 for several years.
They made what people were buying.
Take a poll here and see how many trucks and SUVs are being driven. I doubt you will find many here driving a Smart or a Prius.
Ralph

#6

About a year ago I caught part of a TV show about cars. They were interviewing one of the chief designers for GM. He used terms like “design articulation” and “product vocabulary”. I knew at that instant that GM was in trouble.

#7

You know, when I drive a 1950 F-1 pickup I paid cash for almost 20 years ago, and a 1950 Tudor I paid cash for almost 39 years ago, the addition of fuel is not that big a deal on something that is no longer taxed, no payments, comfortable, and will probably out-run some of the new econo-cars, and guaranteed have already out-lived them.
Remember Pearl Harbor.

#8
Quote:
... ...Remember Pearl Harbor...
As much as we remember Pearl Harbor, we should also keep in mind how much money we spent rebuilding Japan after the war. It was largely our economic investments that spawned their automotive industry. Now, they're repaying us by building many of their cars on our soil, including the one I drive. If the Japanese manufacturers can build affordable, quality cars using American labor, there's no reason the US companies can't do the same. Notice that it's not the maquiladoras they're shutting down.

I think the root of the problem for the US companies is a combination of brand fatigue and bad timing. US quality and design was arguably in the toilet in the early-mid 80s. At the same time, the Japanese companies ramped up and began building cars that had form and function. That gave them the edge which US companies have yet to regain. There’s no reason they can’t regain the lead, except that I think people are somewhat “tired” of the brands. Ford and Chevy are just “vanilla” brands anymore. Personally, I think the big 3 need to take a page out of the Japanese playbook, and create new brands with an entirely different philosophy. (Saturn’s about as close as they’ve come, and they’re at least having limited success there. Note that they had even more success when they pushed Saturn’s product line to a broader spectrum.) Simply re-badging a Ford Excursion as a Lincoln Navigator isn’t enough. It’s got to be a completely different product line. Couple that with a focus on alternative fuel technology in the product line, and I think they can really take off. If something as ugly as the Prius can sell like hotcakes, think of what you could do with a good-looking hybrid. It will be interesting to see how Chevy’s Volt sells.

Later,

K

#9

I re-interate.
If it says Nissan, Nisei, Datsun, Totopet, Toyota, Mazda, or even the maker of the “Zero-sen”, Mitsubishi, I don’t care if the SOB’s make 'em on the MOON.

Not in MY driveway.

Toshiba.
1987.
Release of classified US submarine technology to the russkies.

#10
Curmudgeon said:
I re-interate. If it says Nissan, Nisei, Datsun, Totopet, Toyota, Mazda, or even the maker of the "Zero-sen", Mitsubishi, I don't care if the SOB's make 'em on the MOON.

Not in MY driveway.

Toshiba.
1987.
Release of classified US submarine technology to the russkies.


Gee Dave,
I guess you must have felt a real sense of relief when the manufacture of consumer goods shifted from Japan to China. :stuck_out_tongue:
Ralph

#11

Dave,
Would a vehicle of your-oh-peein heritage ever be seen in your driveway?

#12

IF they were an english-speaking country, and known of late to be our allies, never had a de gaulle in their past, nor Benito, Franco or Adolf, maybe. If for no other reason than to stick it up the establishment.

(http://lscdata.com/users/curmudgeon/jag1resize.jpg)

Why do you ask?

#13

Just wundrin…
If my wife wins the new car war, and she’ll prolly will, would you object to a British made Mini Cooper in your driveway one day for a visit.
Don’t worry, won’t show up with an Asian model.

#14

My wife works part time for a Chevy dealership general manager. (Not at the dealership. but at his other business–a horse training facility.)
Anywhooooo,
she says they have laid off all unnecessary personnel, are down to 2 or 3 salesmen, etc.
It ain’t lookin good.

#15

The new Minis are german made.
Using french parts.

#16

Built in UK by John Cooper Works, Oxford. Owned by BMW. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uuDeEArJ8NQ

(http://www.lscdata.com/users/jebouck/miniplant1s.jpg)

#17
Curmudgeon said:
The new Minis are german made. Using french parts.
Could explain why the cars always seem to be fighting about what side of the line they want to be on. :)

Later,

K

#18

Best check.
Even the Mini owners are corn-fuzed, as some say door tags state engines made in Gemany, some France, transmissions same, or Japan.
Some are shipped to England in parts for assembly.
Still owned by Bad Motor Works.

#19

Same as so-called Detroit iron.
Parts shipped in from Mexico, Asia, and Europe.

#20

And, if you google it, you will find a whole lot of folks not interested in the Renault/Peugeot frog motors.