Large Scale Central

Bullying and The future of Aristo Craft molds

General Discussion
#1

Hi Guys;

  1. William, I like your choice of locomotive icon selection.

  2. Greg, your reply to William:

"

  • When you decide to counter someone with much more understanding of the subject than you, then you should be sure of your facts "

Come on Man, William is only asking a question about parts availability. You do not have to jump down his throat. This is a nice people forum.

  1. Greg is absolutely correct about parts availability. It is not cost effective to produce parts. Spare parts production is an expense that cuts into the profit of locomotive and rolling stock sales. Only LGB produced spare parts which was reflected in the initial purchase price of their high priced product by the consumer.

Aristo Craft was made under Kader , parent company of Bachmann.

Bachmann also did not produce spare parts. The only spare parts available to the Bachmann repair dept came from tearing apart locomotives or from end of production run unused parts.

  1. My prediction is that Kader will eventually transfer the Aristo molds to Bachmann for a “new” 1:29 product line.

The Aristo Pacific locomotive will be retooled to update the level of detail. The heavyweight cars are perfect as is.

The Aristo streamline cars cannot compete with the USA Trains streamline cars and so will not be produced.

I know nothing about diesels so I do not know if any of the Aristo diesel molds will be used.

The Bachmann 1:20.3 narrow gauge standard means that the 1:24 Delton C-16 and Delton rolling stock will not be produced.

  1. Greg, maybe you might assemble some California investers and team up with Scott to bring back the Aristo product line before the molds pass from Kader down to Bachmann ?

  2. The re-introduced Pacific will retail for around 800.00 ( my guess ) TrainWorld mail order price.

The heavyweight cars will retail for around 350.00 to 400.00 each ( my guess ) TrainWorld mail order price.

  1. It is really too bad that the 1:24 scale Delton product will now no longer be produced.

On the other hand, new entrants to the hobby have the advantage of the super detailed 1:20.3 narrow gauge locomotives and rolling stock.

So maybe it is time to acknowledge 1:24 scale has passed on.

Maybe an American investor will buy the 1:24 scale Delton molds from Kader. But that is faint hope.

Norman

#2

And again, from the wording in your post, it sounds like speculation is the answer. Why not wait till you have facts from the company, instead of speculating on a best guess ?

If you are a member of the above mentioned companies, my apologies.

#3

Norm,

Glad you nailed Greg on bullying. I among othews get very tired of his constant bullying when there is absolutely no call for it. Bullying and attacking someone for asking a question shows what poor upbrining he has had. It probably does more harm to the hobby than all mistakes manufacturers make.

#4

And in the thread you reference, William kept it civil. Why do you need to stir it up? Are you looking for the Avatar of Death?

#5

2 candidates in the running now.

#6

Dave, N.B., Marconi said:

Why not wait till you have facts from the company, instead of speculating on a best guess ?

Nothing wrong with a little speculation.
As long as it is presented as just that, speculation.

However, if he wants to call Greg out, why not do it when/where it happened rather than mix the two subjects together?

As it is, it seems like this will be on the fast track to “Purgatory” :wink:
Ralph

#7

Ralph Berg said:

Dave, N.B., Marconi said:

Why not wait till you have facts from the company, instead of speculating on a best guess ?

Nothing wrong with a little speculation.
As long as it is presented as just that, speculation.

However, if he wants to call Greg out, why not do it when/where it happened rather than mix the two subjects together?

As it is, it seems like this will be on the fast track to “Purgatory” :wink:
Ralph

The issue with speculation is that people take some they hear from somewhere, and run with it. Then someone else tries to set the record straight, or get clarification, and before you know it, the name calling starts. There’s no indication at all that Bachmann is going to use the Aristo molds. The only common thread is that the molds are in a factory that makes both Bachmann and Aristo, but that’s enough for people to start quoting street prices for a Bachmann-released Aristo product. That information came from nowhere except the imagination. Purely inventing things out of whole cloth like that is a disservice, and misleading.

Everyone already knows that the Aristo topic is a hot button for many people on the forum, yet cant help but wade in and start throwing words around. We’re already down a member or two that ‘likes to stir things up’. Lets keep a level head, ok?

#8

If we are speculating here, and it appears that we are, I see the 1:24th line coming back. Probably under a different name, but coming back. It didn’t die when Delton went away, Aristo bought it and brought it back.

Norman, I thank you. I felt a bit put down by the response I received. I can be told I am wrong, and I quite often am, in a much more polite way then I was. As I told the District Attorney, “Sometimes its not what a person says, its how he says it.”

#9

Bob McCown said

The issue with speculation is that people take some they hear from somewhere, and run with it. Then someone else tries to set the record straight, or get clarification, and before you know it, the name calling starts. There’s no indication at all that Bachmann is going to use the Aristo molds. The only common thread is that the molds are in a factory that makes both Bachmann and Aristo, but that’s enough for people to start quoting street prices for a Bachmann-released Aristo product. That information came from nowhere except the imagination. Purely inventing things out of whole cloth like that is a disservice, and misleading.

Everyone already knows that the Aristo topic is a hot button for many people on the forum, yet cant help but wade in and start throwing words around. We’re already down a member or two that ‘likes to stir things up’. Lets keep a level head, ok?

The speculation was certainly taken to the extreme.
But I have enough sense to see it for what it is. Others should too.

As for stirring things up, that seemed to be the intention. Hence my reference to “Purgatory”.
Ralph

#10

Hi David:

1:24 scale is the scale I adopted while also using the Bachmann 1:20.3 scale 4-4-0 loco and their 1:22.5 scale J&S coaches still being able to “fit in” with the 1:24 scale Delton C-16 loco and Delton caboose.

The advantage I think 1:24 scale has is that it is not too large for an indoor layout and yet still large enough for an outdoor layout. Hence, two markets available for the mfg. .

With the 1:24 scale Gauge One track error, there was a demand for exact track gauge 1:20.3 scale and Bachmann introduced the 1:20.3 Shay.

With the introduction of the beautiful Accucraft 1:20.3 scale J&S coaches, 1:20.3 scale has been shown to be just how large it is! Hence, I was unable to purchase the Accucraft J&S coaches.

I would have preferred if Bachmann had introduced exact gauge 1:24 scale track and had regauged their Big Hauler loco, their only loco at the time. But this was not possible as LGB had already established the Large Scale market on Gauge One track scaled at 39 inch track gauge. I guess this is also why Delton chose Gauge One track for their 1:24 models.

Maybe someone will buy the Delton molds but how much demand is there now for 1:24 scale given that Bachmann has produced the 1:20.3 scale C-19 loco?

I just like the look of the Delton stuff. Well detailed but not overly so such that parts will not fall off if the models are used outdoors.

Norman

#11

Oh man, am I glad I have seven more turnouts to build before the season starts.

That, a few other urgent projects and going railfanning should keep me out of the loop while the rumour mill grinds on.

PS is the GenerationNeXt website done yet???

#12

I don’t know how many times I’ve stated that I got into this hobby to HAVE FUN, MAKE NEW FRIENDS. etc.

Some people just get to be real tough guys when they’re sitting behind a keyboard, sorta like the guy in the gin mill who gets braver and braver with additional fire water added to his bloodstream. Then you have the braggarts who think their opinion counts more than anyone elses because they own more trains than others.

Just putting my nickel in and taking three cents change.

Pat

#13

Norman I chose 1:24th scale because it was easiest for my brain to do calculation when making buildings. I figured out once, what scale I should be in, to model a 40 inch gauge railroad on 45mm track. It wasn’t quite 1:24. But as most things in my hobby, there are compromises.

Pat, Gregg is very knowledgeable about the industry, and for a while Lewis even consulted Gregg. So his opinion is very valuable, and he has much more insight then I will ever have. I do value the opinions of those who I know are more knowledgeable then I am. It wasn’t the message, it was the way the message was delivered that could have used a little…polish.

#14

How many times does someone have to politely set someone else straight about a speculation that is somewhat ‘out there in fantasy land’?
Patience gets thin and replies get gruff. Some people only have so much tolerance and are not here to nurture hurt egos based on delusional ideas.
The speculator finally meshes the gears in the head and explains their idea with much adjustment to claim some validity.

Andrew

#15

Did anyone find it strange why crest and the aristo parts were supposely given navin and not scott. Is not scott the grandson of lewis. Makes me wonder if lewis retired a millionaire or not in florida. I agree with Greg who owns that company.

#16

Now Troys comment is the one that can make this thread explode, because their so much unknown behind the curtain speculation that can be made.

I doubt Louie fully retired in the first place, so how much was his hand still in the business, how is it that Navin took the Crest product with the remaining Aristo parts. What is the relationship of Scott and Louie right now? I’m thinking seriously strained and that’s why the creation of geNext.

As for Norman’s original comment, nice call Norman, you were spot on

#17

David,

I value Greg’s knowledge. His website is one of the best model railroad reference sites on the internet. I highly recommend it to many others. I also realize everyone is entitled to a second chance. But like I said, its a hobby. Relax, take a chill pill. Have some fun. Help the next guy. Promote the hobby, don’t scare people out of it.

Like an old timer at my firehouse told me, “It’s easier to be nice.”

Enough said.

Pat

#18

#19

I I have the right to question the quality and stability of any company before I buy something new or used from them. I do not let any sales person double talk me. If some new company takes over the aristocraft train line I will question there quality too. There should be no drama or explosions over questioning how stable a company is and who owns it.

#20

PS I do own over 20 aristo engines in new or used running condition.I also own over 10 usa engines too. I have a stake with both companies to keep my fleet tumning.