Yes Zubi,
I heard/read about similar (ad)ventures. If memory serves the usual comment was: I should have scratchbuilt it instead, because this and that and the other is still not to scale.
Hans Joerg, Sorry, but I am perfectly happy with my rendering of the 1:22.5 Porter using Lehmann’s. It was not easy but the end result is the best looking version I have ever seen. I did it for a friend but it now visiting me in Tokyo so I may be able to take some photos. Of course it is not an exact scale model of any particular prototype, but who said that it should be? It is meant to capture the feel of the Canadian 42inch gauge Portage Railway Porters http://www.portageflyer.org/history.htm You see, scale accuracy is not the only and perhaps not the best way to achieve realism. A bit of weathering and artistic alterations can go much further way in that direction. And if you want even more realism, go live steam, gas alcohol coal in that order. Finally, if this is not satisfying, enroll with a historical society, help restoring a steam locomotive or a coach. After you sweat for a few weekends on or under a real thing scale issues will matter less;-))), Zubi
Zubi,
Close only counts in “Horseshoes”. :lol:
BTW on that railway, I have the MacKay book on the subject. Used to live just around the corner from the publishing house.
Zubi, think “Africa.” In 20 years when “cheap” and “chinese labor” can no longer be used in the same sentence, that’s where I see things heading. The global economy depends on a cheap labor source for a variety of tasks (hence the illegal immigration debate in this country). As the standard of living in China expands, manufacturers will need a new pool of unskilled, dirt-poor laborers to whom $3/day is like winning the lottery. $700 million in economic aid doesn’t hold a candle to the long-term benefit derived from developing a strong manufacturing center.
Cale, one can hope that with Marklin’s influence, “had” may yet be “have.”
One last thought–I think part of the problem with the quality issues we’re having from the manufacturers is that the only incentive they have to improve comes from the inside. There’s really very little direct competition as the market settles down into their individual niches. I think if Accucraft were to move into the “inexpensive” locomotive market with their 1:20 stuff as they’re doing with the K-4 and GP-60 on the 1:29 side, or if LGB were to push more in that direction, we’d see Bachmann step up with a bit more rigorous pre-release testing program. I think we’re seeing the benefits of that kind of direct competition in the 1:29 market, and we’re also beginning to see it in the 1:20 rolling stock, as each company in the game looks at what the other “isn’t” producing, and producing it. And that’s definitely not a bad thing.
Later,
K
Hans-Joerg Mueller said:
Zubi,Close only counts in “Horseshoes”. :lol:
…and grenades…!
Ken Brunt said:Hans-Joerg Mueller said:
Zubi,Close only counts in “Horseshoes”. :lol:
…and grenades…!
Sorry folks. I don
t know what you are referring to. I scanned the entire discussion and the is no occurence of close` at all! Zubi
Quote:
… Finally, if this is not satisfying, enroll with a historical society, help restoring a steam locomotive or a coach. After you sweat for a few weekends on or under a real thing scale issues will matter less;-))), Zubi
It had the opposite effect on me. After a weekend combing through and packing two of the EBT’s 120-year-old passenger cars for transit back to Pennsylvania, I went home and built a model of one of the cars we shipped home:
(http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/eastbroadtop/combine18/passengerinterior.jpg)
(http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/eastbroadtop/combine18/passengerthree4.jpg)
If anything, that experience made me even more of a stickler for detail. (Though I do still allow room for some level of compromise. Having a kid will do that.) Later, K
Kevin Strong said:Kevin, if the $ keeps falling we may be able to find these cheap workers in the USA;-)) rather than in Africa... But then, I believe that Asia has something unique to offer in terms of the work force. The world would not be (technologically) where it is now if the Asian boom had not taken place. Best, Zubi
Zubi, think "Africa." In 20 years when "cheap" and "chinese labor" can no longer be used in the same sentence, that's where I see things heading. The global economy depends on a cheap labor source for a variety of tasks (hence the illegal immigration debate in this country). As the standard of living in China expands, manufacturers will need a new pool of unskilled, dirt-poor laborers to whom $3/day is like winning the lottery. $700 million in economic aid doesn't hold a candle to the long-term benefit derived from developing a strong manufacturing center.
Kevin Strong said:
................If anything, that experience made me even more of a stickler for detail. (Though I do still allow room for some level of compromise. Having a kid will do that.)
Later,
K
Kevin,
The closer one gets to the real thing the more one will notice the differences between that and the “models”.
Of course it’s sometimes just like painting; impressionistic, realistic and abstract. Or paint by number (that’s the “take out of the box and be happy”). 
If I had the ways and means to start a company.
One to manufacture a correctly scaled “large scale” product.
Made right here in Washington state.
Not even taking into consideration the set up costs and tooling.
Who would pay 1 to 2 thousand bucks for a high quality product?
Minimum wage is Wa. is up to above $8.00 and hour. For a snot-nosed high school kid.
Not even taking into consideration professional tool and die journeymen, etc.
Probably Union shop, as well.
That’s why all the crap is made in China today!
And made as cheap as they can, with the cheapest components the company can buy.
All Bachmann has to to is spend a few bucks more on a Buehler (sp) motor, for instance.
That’s a start…
j
After reading all the posts above and one that said more complaints/problems to come!!! “BUYER BEWARE” sounds appropriate to me how about you guys!!!
(http://www.lscdata.com/users/blueregal/_forumfiles/horse.gif)
John, the Ks have a 19 volt Pitmann motor with ball bearings. They’re gettin’ there.
Later,
K
John Bouck said:
All Bachmann has to to is spend a few bucks more on a Buehler (sp) motor, for instance. That's a start...j
Sure John,
And in order to save on transportation they can source it close by from Bühler.
OTOH I don’t see much wrong with a Pittman motor, they have been around in the larger scales for as long as I can remember.
Kevin Strong said:
John, the Ks have a 19 volt Pitmann motor with ball bearings. They're gettin' there.Later,
K
They surely do Kevin.
Only problem is they have screwed up the gear ratios.
Instead of the recommended 30:1 they have ended up with about 14.5:1.
Most operators on flat RR’s probably won’t notice, except for the rather quick starts.
Those that run longish trains up grades will definitely notice.
Dunno about getting there.
Seems it is more like one step forwards, two steps back.
TonyWalsham said:Kevin Strong said:
John, the Ks have a 19 volt Pitmann motor with ball bearings. They're gettin' there.Later,
K
They surely do Kevin.
Only problem is they have screwed up the gear ratios.
Instead of the recommended 30:1 they have ended up with about 14.5:1.
Most operators on flat RR’s probably won’t notice, except for the rather quick starts.
Those that run longish trains up grades will definitely notice.Dunno about getting there.
Seems it is more like one step forwards, two steps back.
Tony, 30:1? too slow for someone …didnt you see that LSOL video?
Ya mean you dont want your K to go flying down the track like a French TGV?
Can’t do that with a 30:1 ratio…
Might be time to ask Barry if his new Connie gearbox can be of use here.
Ya know, by the time all the fixes are added to this beasty, the only thing original left may be the plastic.
In China they make stuff to their customer standards. LGB had product made in China, no real complaints about the quality, they were good because LGB demanded that they be good. If Bachmann demanded the same standards then their product would be good. The only way that Bachmann will build a good product is when the public demand one. If you don’t buy the junk, then they won’t build junk and start making a good quality product. Don’t beat me up about this, it is just my opinion. OK, Warren you can. But nobody else.
Tony,
There were plenty of complaints in Europe about the quality of “Made in China” LGB.
Tony-
On-target…however, IF the consumer demand is for pre-delivery testing (how about testing a prototype?) , then the demands made by the public won’t have to come from those who already BOUGHT the product. That’s where the rub is: Complaints from those who have spent the money, complained on this site, read the remedies proposed, read the reviews, did their own repairs or sent the loco back to Bachmann–and hoped for resolution. Of course, the rest of the savy consumers hoped the “next run,” if there is any, will bring satisfaction to those who waited.
My wish is there be a universal demand by readers on this site for prototype testing by Bachmann instead of sporatic and isolated responses to the idea.
Is this not what we all want from Bachmann?
From Bachmann Corporation: Mr. Bud Reece, do you wish to respond?
Wendell
Then stop buying the stuff now! Why keep buying Bachmann or any other brand if you know they keep making stuff not up to your standards? I think that the silence from Bachmann and/or MR. Reece about this problem speaks volumes. I think maybe I have bought my last Bachmann locomotive.
Uh, Tony…
No complaints about Chines made LGB?
Or, CGB?
Wiring?
Loss of 3-point suspension?
Oh, wait…if you know anybody at any repair shops, ask them about motor AND block wear issues.
I’m not going to tell you what they are, I am going to wait for you to search it out.