Large Scale Central

Bachmann K27

General Discussion
#16

Maybe my lack of interest in the ‘K’ is the reason I have not noted any postings that are not congratulatory to the release. I was amazed, no less, at the rather lack lustre response to the release on this forum. I expected a little enthusiasm, but the release has been met with little more than it is on show in pre-production guise.

I feel the the ‘poor’ reaction is down to the ‘its finally here attitude’. We have been waiting for some time for it to at least arrive in the preproduction guise. The waiting has been tormented by the riduculous ban on talking about the locomotive. This ban, I feel, has sapped the initial enthusiasm felt for the project. The loco will sell, but recent downturns in the price of the Bachmann largescale releases will severely limit any future releases. This loco is the make or break scenario for any future releases. I feel that apart from the curious, the majority will await news of any production related problems and the anticipated firesales in a year or two. How many paid nearly $500.00 for their Shays and their Connies and their Heislers, only to see the prices plummet within a couple of years?

The purchaser today is generally more street wise and expects a bargain. Some will definately rush out and put down their $1000.00, but at this price, one really needs to assess the market and see what comparable products are around (this is getting into live steam price range). A ‘K’ has no place in my railroad, due to its size. I am able to run smaller prototype 1/20.3 scale locomotives, but am not prepared to ‘start again’. My interest is in 1/22.5 scale. The ‘K’ will look good and when released ‘in the box’ will receive accolades of acclaim, but Bachmann really need to look at their PR machine for the way this project has been (mis)handled. The ‘K’ is a high-priority acquisition for many, so any failure to impact on the marketplace is not the fault of the consumer. The last few months frustration on the Bachmann forum, as regards no discussion of the project (from a contractual standpoint), will, I feel, seal the fate of the release. This will be a major acquisition for most and one would feel that the manufacturer would have ‘supported’ the potential purchaser in his choice. The support has been contrary to what would have been expected, even to one commenter on another forum trying to initiate a thread in condemnation of the person who fronts the manufacturer forum. This personality ‘clash’ and the consumer being left out in the dark for many months will not be the encouragement that many will need to make such a purchase. It is definately time for some new blood to drive this project to fruition, if it is to be a marketting success. If it is not, then I feel Bachmann will back away from any future major project releases.

#17

Tim,
I suspect that Bachmann had very little to do with the decision to put a ban on even mentioning the K-27! From the rumblings I have overheard it would seem that Kader is calling the shots! I very much doubt that Bachmann will ever again make such a Faustian deal without corporate masters pulling the strings regardless of the consequences! I think we’re all in agreement that the K-27 is a awfully big gamble for Bachmann which is why it is so strange that the marketing of this engine has been abysmal!! There was even a rumor going around that WE couldn’t talk about “Voldemud” (Gads! If there ever was an appropriate nickname!) or our thread would be summarily yanked! No explanations and we would be banned from the forum!!!

Of course that was probably just so much nonsense (note that I said “probably”) however it DOES demonstrate an apalling lack of marketing savvy on Bachmann’s (i.e. Kader’s) part! Am I bitter about this? Absolutely not!! I want this K-27 to totally change the perception of Fn3 modelling! We CAN have large mainline locomotives that aren’t hand-crafted brass and costing several thousands of dollars (besides, the K-27 has always been my favorite locomotive!)

How the K-27 is finally received will depend more upon it’s performance than any fancy marketing strategy. The one absolutely essential thing that MUST be done is for Bachmann to get a production model into the hands of a Beta tester so that those “niggling little problems” that inevitably creep up can be discovered, documented and (most importantly) corrected before the public discovers them and it’s reputation for reliability is tarnished! I will reserve judgement on the marketing of the K-27 now that ol’ “Voldemud” has come out of the netherworld and can be spoken of in something other than hushed whispers. I’m sure that Bachmann is chomping at the bit to get this baby launched!

One other small matter.

It has been insinuated that r/c battery people hate DCC and want to “Nip it! Nip it in the bud!!!” (with kudos to Barney Fife!) This is NOT the case! With regards to Bachmann and it’s plans, the fiasco with the “Quasinami” left an incredibly bad taste in our mouths! There were posts on the forums from people that seemed to be “insiders” that the K-27 was to be DCC equipped and that an integral part of the motor was the DCC interface making removal of the DCC component nearly impossible! While I was sure this was outrageous fantasy, I was given a “reality check” by those so informed that this is indeed the case with certain systems in O scale! Apparently, there have been proponents of DCC that have been pushing their agenda and have received some support from elements within Bachmann’s management. I am dubious but I wish them success as long as I am able to continue to have r/c battery control as an option. Unfortunately, with the 3-truck Shay this was the situation with half of the run. I understand that there will be inside canted cylinder K-27’s as well as the outside model which has been shown. I sincerely hope that the management at Bachmann (and Kader) have learned from the past and won’t make the same mistake again. DCC, r/c battery or track power…the pool’s big enough for everybody and the water’s fine! Come on in!

#18

Whaddahell is Voldemud? An expensive type of mud use in pricey spas? Maybe the name of he who cannot be mentioned… Voldemort?

#19
Steve S said:
DCC, r/c battery or track power...the pool's big enough for everybody and the water's fine! Come on in!
Yeah, just wait for the first disappointed "kid" to have a leak! :lol: ;) :lol:
#20

Steve,
the Bachmann forum ‘ban’ on discussion was a total fiasco. I personally had several postings removed for daring to make a statement. The result of this is that I very rarely venture back to the site. I can understand being ‘reprimanded’ for slandering or abusive language, but the simple removal of postings because it suits someone in the hierarchy is censorship. Some postings deleted did not even make reference to the ‘K’. I feel that the Bach-man, personally, has lost some ‘esteem’ over this situation and I certainly do not hold him in the esteem that I felt some years ago. Bachmann really need to take a long hard look at a) who they take advice from and b) how they market any future offerings. I, for one, would like to know why the three month ban on discussing new products was applied to the ‘K’, only and not to the recently announced 1/20.3 scale tankers and gondola.

     This fiasco has left a definate sour taste in my mouth and I will certainly not be supporting this venture with my wallet.   In so far as the future of Bachmann and DCC,  well,  we only need to wonder why Bachmann has not extended its DCC system further into the largescale market.  To do so would only show that those who 'are listened to' are not in touch with the real largescale market and are only pushing their own specific agenda.  Some years ago,  a local state government pushed its own agenda and only allowed automatic gearboxes to be fitted, ex-factory, from a major automobile manufacturer.  The supposed reason for this was that the automatic gearbox was more 'environmentally friendly'.  The fact that the car used more fuel than an equivalent manual gearbox model was irrelevant.    Consumers were 'forced' to buy the auto model and then retro fit manual gearboxes,  using aftermarket parts.  Sounds exactly like the current situation being lumped on us with largescale.  Someone has a specific agenda and we the consumers are not being consulted.  We already lost one major manufacturer because they beat a different drum to their consumer base.  LGB, Bachmann, dinosaurs = extinction!
#21

Let me explain something.
The removal of posts was by contractual obligation.
They were not allowed to discuss the K on their forums or at shows for a certain period of time.
ALL posts about it that got specific enough to be in violation of their contractual obligations were removed.
Sorry if it got your knickers in a wad.

#22

Dave,
not being paranoid, but when my postings are deleted and yet others’ postings remain, which were more type specific, then contractual obligation is merely an excuse to exercise censorship. What I said stands, in my view. If I do not fit the ‘new’ Bachmann ‘mould’ psyche, then I want no part of the ‘new’ Bachmann.

#23

Just to lighten things up a tad, one of our former “experts of everything” - you get three guesses and the first two don’t count :wink: :lol: - asked on a German forum “What is that phonebooth on the K27 tender?”. You just gotta love it!
Oh BTW there were/are German SG engines which had/have a similar “phonebooth” on the tender ( I don’t know if the preserved one of those and I’m too lazy to look right now)

OK, it isn’t a “dog house”, it is a “phone booth”. Gotta love it! :lol: Gotta string some wire!

#24

I think the K’s were originally built before they invented phone booths. But every man that’s been in trouble with the CEO at home knows where the dog house is…:smiley: :lol:

#25
Warren Mumpower said:
I think the K's were originally built before they invented phone booths. But every man that's been in trouble with the CEO at home knows where the dog house is....:D :lol:
Yeah, yeah and it's not on the tender behind! :D ;)
#26

BTW in that post with the pictures on “TOF” there was mention of Stan having a bit of a problem keeping the K on track. If picture three is indicative of the track work, welllllll … hmmmmm … I can easily see why that would be. (meow!)

#27
Hans-Joerg Mueller said:
Just to lighten things up a tad, one of our former "experts of everything" - you get three guesses and the first two don't count ;) :lol: - asked on a German forum "What is that phonebooth on the K27 tender?".
Is [i]that[/i] what that is? Silly me, thinking Bachmann forgot to put the crescent moon on the door. :D

Later,

K

#28

<>

Fer crimeny sake! What is it? A release of some secret guvmint securuty item!
It’s just a fargin plastic model enjin.!
Sheeesh!

TOG

#29
Hans-Joerg Mueller said:
OK, it isn't a "dog house", it is a "phone booth". Gotta love it! :lol: Gotta string some wire!
Does it have ventilation?
#30
Bob McCown said:
Hans-Joerg Mueller said:
OK, it isn't a "dog house", it is a "phone booth". Gotta love it! :lol: Gotta string some wire!
Does it have ventilation? .
. Yeah, but you need to turn on the fan. :lol:
#31
Steve Featherkile said:
Bob McCown said:
Hans-Joerg Mueller said:
OK, it isn't a "dog house", it is a "phone booth". Gotta love it! :lol: Gotta string some wire!
Does it have ventilation? .
. Yeah, but you need to turn on the fan. :lol:
Or you have one of the Mini-Ventilators ride it. That would fix her good!
#32

Sorry, finger trouble

#33

Warren,
the ban on discussion of the ‘secret’ K-27 project was a contractual arrangement with the loco manufacturing arm of Sierra (now you know where the Tsunami came from). Blackstone(?) and Bachmann, in partnership, used the same engineering/tooling diagrams for the loco, Blackstone in On3 scale. One detail in the contract was that Bachmann could not mention existence of the largescale project for nine months after the Blackstone project had been released. I think it hardly likely that anyone contemplating an On3 K-27 would baulk at buying it if they were interested in largescale and so sales would not have been impacted. The Tsunami fiasco and now the contractual mayhem, in my opinion, have done little to extend the credibility of the company.

#34

Correction.
Contract was between Kader and Blackstone.
Bachmann, being a wholly-owned subsidiary, had no input.
Bachmann, as a wholly-owned subsidiary, does what they are directed to by the parent company.

#35

Tim, I’m not sure how my name got drawn into this but now I’ll express my feelings.

How dare some pompous assed company tell me what I can and cannot talk about. I signed no contract and am under no obligation. Maybe that’s why I don’t visit sites like Bachmann…and to some extent Aristocraft.