I recently let the ‘Magic Smoke’ out of my K-27 on a club run. After dissecting the loco, it turns out to be the small board right under the flywheel on the motor. I know a couple of fellow B’mann owners have made conversions that have removed this board. I am hoping that one of you might still have one and be willing to part with it.
Thanks in advance.
Bob C.
Sorry Bob…I can’t help myself! 
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/89/Bomba_atomowa.gif)
Did the smoke escape thru the smoke stack in true steam fashion? The macabre side of me wants to know?
Wayne
Rooster, I would expect no less of you 
Wayne, unfortunately I was not at the exact spot when it happened. A fellow member yanked it off the track. Being as the board is near the backhead, and there is a small fan located in the top of the boiler shell right there, I would assume it did not make it to the stack Woulda been cool if it did (:
Bob C.
Any idea as to purpose of said board? Any idea why it “blew”? Spooky!
Show me a picture, please. I may have one!
Paul Austin
Show me a picture, please. I may have one!
Paul Austin
Total purpose I am not sure. The optical chuff sensors connect through this board tho. And it appears that a pair of pickups go to the trailing truck. I am not seeing any other obvious charring on the board in the top of the backhead (controls the flicker I think) and collects all the stuff to run to the two connectors to the tender. I heard once that it was a feed back board to the main board in the tender, but never could get a confirmation of it. I did find out that I can get the board from B’mann, but was hoping to find one from a fellow modeler who is no longer in need of his.
As to why, no one actually saw the cause, only the smoke and wonderful acrid fragrance afterward. Talking to one of the electrical wiz’s at the club, he tells me he has seen traces on boards that were probably marginal in size, fail of a period of time. Not sure right now. Just trying to get her fixed up with some enhancements as I go.
Bob C.
(http://rgsgardenrailroad.com/K_regeared02.jpg)
(http://rgsgardenrailroad.com/K_regeared03.jpg)
This is not a stock K-27. this has been re-geared, but the circuit board is still there.
Ken,
Thanks for the great photos. The small board in the bottom photo below the brass flywheel is the culprit. I see you are still using yours
I also appreciate the up close and personal photo of Rodney’s gearbox installed. For some reason I could not get that picture in my head before. His regear is on my agenda of upgrades to do while this loco is in the backshop. Along with battery and R/C (to be wired to a switch so she can be run on track power as well).
Is that additional weight you added in front of the stock weights? If so, how much did you add? Last question, do you have any issues with the pilot truck tracking? I am looking at trying to put a slightly heavier spring in the pilot assembly to possibly make it track better, along with additional weight in the boiler.
Thanks for the response, and sorry for the additional questions.
Bob C.
Great pics Ken.
Bob, if you haven’t done so already it is a good idea to reverse the fan so that it sucks air up instead of blowing it down. Doing so will greatly improve the air flow of the smoke unit and the smoke will then go up the stack instead of down and out through the boiler.
Be careful of the screws used as two of them will be too long and if forced tight will pierce the boiler shell.
Tony,
Thanks for the advice, I will heed it. I will be neutralizing the smoke generator by disconnecting one lead, covering it with heat shrink, and securing it with a zip tie. I do not use the smoke generator any way and this will remove one inadvertent SNAFU.
When re-installing the fan, can a washer be placed under the screw head to alleviate the possible shell penetration?
Bob C.
Bob. If you are not using th smoke leave the fan as it is. If you do decide to change it use shorter screws.
Tony,
After a chat with Dave Goodson, and following some of his recommendations and suggestions, it appears I am much closer to a major decision than I though. I can not find my schematics that came with the loco, so I am not sure of some of this, but here goes.
Dave brought me up to speed on the axle pickups on the 1,2 and 4 axles along with the potential pinched wire condition. After disassembling sufficiently to check the condition of the wires, I did some testing with the multimeter. I have no pickup on the no 1 axle, and it ‘appears’ there is a short to the frame. IF this condition is not normal I am at a crossroads - send it back to Bachmann for repair or move forward with battery power, and R/C. For the most part either situation will leave me without my favorite prime mover for about 6 months (that seems to be the B’manns turnaround based on other club members experiences).
I would like your opinion Lithium battery packs. Dave provided his with some additional information I had not otherwise heard. I am aware of the fire/explosion issues relative to heat, but no one has been able to clarify where the ‘boom’ point is. Living in the panhandle of Florida where 100 degree ambient days with strong solar heating can be the norm on summer days, batteries hidden in a black tender might just reach that point. I have some small computer CPU fans that could be installed, but will that be enough.
As for the internal fan, I might see about ducting the fan from the stack to the interior boards (if I go the send it off to B’mann route). There is certainly enough space behind the smoke box door to do it.
Thanks for your input, it is most welcome.
Bob C.
I have just one loco with a Lithium Ion pack. It has been installed for about twelve months in my LGB # 50 dismal. It was the only type that would fit under the hood and provide a reasonable run time.
I am still leery about Li-Ion, but not because of just the possibility of fire and/or explosion. I don’t believe they are good value for money. Whilst my experience of Li-Ion is limited to one loco I do have them in a cell phone, a digital camera and this Lap Top, So far their life span is limited to around two years. Period. They seem to have a planned life span. My I Phone battery quit 2 weeks after the 2 year Telco contract ran out. This lap top lasts about 1 hour now on batteries. Likewise I have had four batteries in Fuji digital camera since 2000.
By way of contrast, NiCd last a very long time. I know of packs over 20 years old that are still going strong. Sanyo claim 1,000 recharges for their good quality cells. I don’t doubt the Chinese ones will not last as long.
For the same reason, lack of longevity of NiMh cells, I don’t like NiMh either. Sanyo claim 500 recharges. Plus they all self discharge at a prodigious rate. For that reason, always flat batteries in digital cameras, Sanyo invented the NiMh - Alkaline hybrid cells that are guaranteed to hold 85% charge for 12 months. Unfortunately they only come in AAA and AA sizes here in Australia. As such they cannot handle loads much over 1 amp without shortening their life span.
So for now, and for the foreseeable future, it is NiCd for me.
Bob Cope said:
Ken,Thanks for the great photos. The small board in the bottom photo below the brass flywheel is the culprit. I see you are still using yours
I also appreciate the up close and personal photo of Rodney’s gearbox installed. For some reason I could not get that picture in my head before. His regear is on my agenda of upgrades to do while this loco is in the backshop. Along with battery and R/C (to be wired to a switch so she can be run on track power as well).
Is that additional weight you added in front of the stock weights? If so, how much did you add? Last question, do you have any issues with the pilot truck tracking? I am looking at trying to put a slightly heavier spring in the pilot assembly to possibly make it track better, along with additional weight in the boiler.
Thanks for the response, and sorry for the additional questions.
Bob C.
The R/C and Sound were all plug-n-play, so taking out the circuit boards was more trouble then it was worth.
I sometimes have an issue with the pilot truck, but that could be with related to problems with the track itself that occur occasionally, it hasn’t been an on going issue, yet. A heavier spring probably wouldn’t hurt.
The gearbox install will require you to remove the fan and reposition the circuit board next to it, simple really. I cut the screw tabs shorter and moved it up a bit.
Tony, the smoke unit is one of the first things removed. For the pitiful amount of smoke it produces, I can’t see wasting the electrons on it. The electrons find a better use by moving the goods to customers…
No problem with the questions, just glad to help.
Ken,
That’s interesting. The weights directly in front of the gearbox are the only weights in my loco. I don’t have the weights over the post for the screw thru the sand dome. I don’t think the extra weight will hurt in my case, maybe keep in on the track better.
If you don’t mind my asking, whose sound and R/C are you running, and are you completely satisfied with it? Any wishes or regrets?
I will be hunting a heavier spring this weekend, the usual big box stores. There is one small local hardware still in business I might also try.
Smoke unit will most likely be removed no matter what direction I go with the other issues.
Thanks again.
Bob C.
Bob, this one is a real recent purchase, like last year at the ECLSTS, so it could be a newer version. Rodney introduced his gear box in this forum right before the show and I ordered the gearbox before I even bought the loco. the sound is a Phoenix PB9, and RCS is from Don Sweet in NH. The batteries are 14.4v 5600mah Li-on from Cordless renovations. More then satisfied, though my one complaint is the volume control doesn’t work. The sound runs full blast all the time. But since it’s outside it doesn’t bother me that much, so I haven’t bothered to find out why it does that. Another thing I found during the installation was I couldn’t get the factory chuff sensors to work, so I had to install a reed switch and magnets on one of the tender axles. That’s not really a complaint, just a minor issue. Ran it a Bob’s last fall, ran it at Fred’s during the invasion last summer, so Bruce, Bob, Ric Golding, Andy Clarke, and a few others on here have seen and heard it run. I’ve had nothing but good returns from all of them. I’m impressed with it’s pulling power. I’ve had 10-15 cars behind it and you wouldn’t know it’s pulling them up a 2-3% grade on my layout. Do I have any wishes? Yea, I wish I had a bigger layout to run it on…but I did make sure the turntable I built could handle it … With that gear box and that motor, the extra weight won’t hurt it at all. The only thing I can see it hurting is your back from lifting that monster…
(http://i253.photobucket.com/albums/hh58/rgseng/K-27/K_2702.jpg)
Ken,
AH HA, that explains the extra weight! Mine is now about 4 years old. According to all the chatter about the counterweights and such I should have had all kinds of trouble, but Knock on Wood (thumps head) I have not had any of those. It looks like the second weight is almost the same weight as the first one. Hmmmmm I have a collection of lead somewhere…
I do have a Phoenix PB11 I just received, all prep’ed for the K, but since I let out the magic smoke I will hold off until all final decisions are made. I did have a PB9 installed by Robby at RLD, and he did the same as you with magnets and reed switches on the tender axle. I may move them to the driver axle, ala Kevin Strong, more decisions… Volume for me is an issue as I do some indoor running and a LOUD sound card can get annoying. I learned that lesson at the SEGRS 2010 (won’t go into details unless asked).
Thanks again for the input. Great shot of you loco on your layout. For now I can dream…
Bob C.
Bob Cope said:
For now I can dream......Bob C.
