Large Scale Central

Wood Glues

Modeling
#1

As in another discussion, so as to not hijack the post.

The discussion was brought up about the type of glue to use for out door use. I have been using Tightbond III (TBIII) for a number of years in a number of uses out doors and have yet to have a failure. And I know that you’all have your personal preferences.

The discussion let to the point of is TB III water proof. Well I think the point is “Define waterproof” and what are the exceptable standards for you, and Non-waterproof defined glue.

Here is the ANSI testing requirements for “Type 1, and Type II” ratings. (this was copied from TB website)

What is the difference between the ANSI/HPVA Type I and Type II

water-resistance specification?

Both of these tests are conducted using 6” by 6” birch laminates glued

together to make three-ply plywood. The test for Type I is clearly more

stringent than Type II, and involves boiling the glue bonds and testing the

specimens while they are wet.

Type I testing involves cutting the 6" by 6" assemblies into 1" by 3"

specimens, boiling them for 4 hours, then baking the specimens in a 145°F

oven for 20 hours. They are boiled for an additional 4 hours, then

immediately cooled using running water. The specimens are sheared while

wet, and the bonds must pass certain strength and wood failure

requirements to pass the Type I specification.

Type II testing involves cutting the 6" by 6" assemblies into 2" by 5"

specimens, soaking them for 4 hours, then baking the specimens in a

120°F oven for 19 hours. This is repeated for a total of three cycles, and the

bonds must not delaminate to pass the Type II specification.

To pass the Type 1 test, says to me that it’s pretty darn good and will work for what I use it for. I’m not going to be boiling any of my structures for more then 4 hours!

#2

For the glue joints that I need to be truly waterproof, my unpainted bridge and trestle, I use urethane glue. For the ones I need to be water resistant, on my painted buildings, I use Titebond II. Recently I have purchased some Titebond III, but I haven’t used it yet.

As for boiling, I wont be boiling my buildings neither. And I don’t think they will bake at the temperature of 145°, but they may bake at 120° round here.

#3

Very interesting Dave. Was that testing done on tightbond 3 or 2 or 1 ?

I have been using tightbond 3 for years and the only time it has failed is when I didn’t use enough of it and water was able to get in around the pieces that were glued together. I haven’t thought to drown or cook any of my structures either.
I’m wrapping up building the doors on my challenge build. I used a bunch of craft sticks and gave them a tightbond 3 bath with a paint brush to get the glue into all the cracks. They were then painted.

Tightbond 3 is good stuff.

#4

I’ve used Tite Bond 3 for all my trestles and buildings outdoors. The engine shed below has hand laid individual shakes glued with TB 3. Five years outside and not one shake has failed. Some of my trestle is wet all the time from the waterfall with no failiers in the glue joints. GOOD STUFF!!

#5

Great explanation Dave. Agreed - Titebond III is a excellent performer and my wood glue of preference. When possible, I always secure the glued joints with 23 gauge pin nails. I have never had a glued and pinned joint fail.

When possible, I try to incorporate a mechanical fit into a joint. Like Boomer, I don’t like going back to repair something, that could have been avoided with a little additional effort.

My grandfather instilled the idea in me as a child, that if it’s worth doing - do right the first time. Works for me.

#6

Solid technical description Dave. Thanks for the info.

I ‘tested’ TBIII for myself. I had a clump of TBIII glue that when dry I threw in a cup of water. After about 3 months it finally started to dissolve. So, I figure if my buildings are submerged in water for more than two and a half months I may need to start to worry.

TBII only lasted about a week in the water.

A bit of sarcasm, yes. But, TBIII is where it’s at for me for wood glue. With a good roof to shed water and a base to keep the structure off the ground I feel that TBIII should keep my buildings together until I need to pass them onto my son.

Terry

#7

TBII is labeled "water-resistant, TBIII is labeled “Water-Proof”…

#8

I use Titebond III fot most things and it works well. The only place where I don’t use it is when attaching metal roofing to wood buildings.

For that I use E6000 and have great luck with it. Both work well outside.

#9

I use Titebond III for all my buildings. (Along with pins, brads and other small hardware…)

I use Titebond CA specially designed for wood for all my rolling stock builds. It is the strongest CA for wood I have found. I’ve tried others such as 2P10. It comes in four viscosities.

For roofing, I use clear solicone, basically because it is less smelly than E6000 and holds outside real good. I’ve not lost a single cedar shingle nor any corrugated panels due to wind, rain etc.

#10

I just recently started using TIII based on recommendations from you guys. I really cant say how well it will do, since I dont have any buildings outside that I’ve used it on, yet. I also like to have a mechanical fastener along with the glue. I never trust a glued joint.

The recent purchase of a pin nailer will help greatly in my upcoming projects.

#11

It’s good to have all this tech info and recommendations in one spot. Thanks Dave and you other guys. All duly noted.