Large Scale Central

USA Hudson - derailing?

Problem Solving
#1

The two USA Hudsons at The Living Desert layout , Palm Desert, are frustrating our efforts to answer why the locos continue to derail – all at different times and in different places along the 1500 feet of mainline track.

The derailment is in the front truck I have stretched slightly the support bar spring to increase downward pressure on the front axle. There is no appreciable change. One suspicion is simply the weight of the loco on roadbed that is essentially gravel. The first evening we ran it, pulling seven USA NY Central heavy weight passenger cars, it had one or two glitches then ran fine all evening. The next day, with the park jammed on this Thanksgiving weekend, the problems occurred – which is the prompt for this request for help. Granted, the weight may have been the problem accompanied by the track inadvertently being walked on while the daily cleaning with a pole sander-equipped with an LGB track pad- The help is careful not to step on the track so this is likely not the cause. Meanwhile, the diesels, assorted USA, run fine on this same mainline-- any of the fifteen LGB Moguls run fine. We subbed an A-B-A F7 pulling the same NY passenger consist after virtually giving up on the steamer. No problems as it ran continuously for eight hours.

Please offer your working suggestions. The Hudsons are a crowd pleaser and we have thousands who watch. Both locos experience the same derailment. Welcome are any operations tips running our USA BIG BOY which also has had some track derailment foibles.

Many thanks.

Wendell

#2

Wendell, sorry to hear about this problem. I am confident you have checked both engines for all the obvious things, like gauge on the lead axles, that the front trucks pivot easily from side to side, have enough “slop” that they can rock side to side a little, and wheels turn freely and are not loose on the axles. Considering that both engines have the same problem, it seems to me there is incompatibility between these engines and the track. And I am confident that tight curves or S curves are not the problem. Interesting that the derailments happen at various places. For what it’s worth, a friend had a problem with the lead axle on a USAT 6 wheel truck derailing at a switch. But with careful observation, we found that the derailments were actually 40 or 50 feet before the switch but the engine ran that distance fine until it got to the switch. Could this be happening there too? I suggest checking that the track is level side to side, even though I doubt this is the problem. Since so many other engines negotiate the track fine, it must be a subtle thing causing the problems. Also I suggest checking track alignment at all switches and track joints. Also the width of the rail head varies, so look for a track joint, in a curve, where the outside rail head widths are different next to the joint. You didn’t say, but have you tried running in both directions?

#3

Hmmm

I’m thinking track verses weight of engine.

The USA’s other engines are light enough to float over small problems were the heaver engine accentuate the problems.

Too bad you do not have a Aristo RDC ( great for finding fault in your track! )

The Big Boy is even heaver …

#4

I have had derailments that drove me crazy until I realized it was due to a change in grade. This is not visible until you pull all of your hair out and cuss! Just something else to look for. Good luck!

#5

Bill, Sean, and Lou - Thanks for your input.

I welcome all input - especially from those of you who may own and operate USA’s Hudson and BIG BOY. Please offer your analysis.

I am forwarding your ideas to the group of regular volunteers at the railroad section of the Living Desert

Thanks,

Wendell

#6

Did you check the wheel gauge?

#7

Todd-

Good question. I didn’t make the check that night. I will include your question with the list.

Removing the front truck and pushing it on varied track sections in the repair shop - including turnouts - appeared to work OK. However, the check may prove that on varied exterior track, that is the reason.

Wendell

#8

Todd Brody said:

Did you check the wheel gauge?

How about track gauge?

#9

Check to see if the track is level from rail to rail, a torpedo level works great for that. As you slide the level down the rails look for any abrupt change in the levelness (is that a word?). Any big change thats a good place for derailments. Those USA Hudson are not forgiving on uneven track.

#10

Murphy must be lurking around…(http://www.largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-yell.gif)

#11

Track cross level would be my first guess… They don’t have the up and down wheel travel of the diesels.

Greg

#12

I would set it on a level piece of level track, and check the clearence on the rear truck. I have owned about 8 Hudsons over the last few years. Most people don’t know this, but they have a tendency for the frame to warp. I have fixed several. It is most noticeable on the clearance of the rear truck. If its warped and goes around a corner, the rear truck will catch on the body detail and derail !

#13

Thanks Rex, I just got my first one, and stupid me, picked it up under the front pilot and broke the brake rigging casting… drat! Know where I can find one?

Greg

#14

USA mite have it, I have bought several parts and pieces from them for other Hudsons I have repaired for guys

#15

And how does one unwarp a Hudson?