I live 1/2 mile from the UP mainline across Nebraska. I’ve been seeing the longer UP trains with about 3 engines up front and the pusher about 2/3 of the way back. Mostly container trains, and they roll at about 60-65 mph! So you can let the grandkids crank up the speed and still be prototypical!
Hi Jerry,
With extra units in the consist they call it DPU (distributed power units). In contrast to a “pusher”, the mid train unit stays on; any excess power would come off the front.
Lots of that type of train on the CP in our neck of the woods, so I had to do a bit of learning i.e. ask the engineers, the road managers and read whatever I could find. On the CP they use a program to assemble the trains and assign the required power. The time I was filming at Fort Steele one of the long (124+ cars) coal trains came in, a crew change and a quick fix on one of the 4400 units. The compressor relay for the air had to be reset; apparently one of the weak spots on the 4400s. The engineer told me that they would still be OK to proceed, even if the compressor wasn’t working, but the train would handle differently during brake applications.
Hans-Joerg Mueller said:
Hi Jerry,With extra units in the consist they call it DPU (distributed power units). In contrast to a “pusher”, the mid train unit stays on; any excess power would come off the front.
Lots of that type of train on the CP in our neck of the woods, so I had to do a bit of learning i.e. ask the engineers, the road managers and read whatever I could find. On the CP they use a program to assemble the trains and assign the required power. The time I was filming at Fort Steele one of the long (124+ cars) coal trains came in, a crew change and a quick fix on one of the 4400 units. The compressor relay for the air had to be reset; apparently one of the weak spots on the 4400s. The engineer told me that they would still be OK to proceed, even if the compressor wasn’t working, but the train would handle differently during brake applications.
Actually you can isolate the DP units from the head end. On the coal and grain trains that I ran with DP I would isolate the DP in certain areas because you would lose comm, and if you’re trying to slow down, and the rear end of your train is still shoving it makes it a bit hard to control. Generally all the DP units are put online (physically moving the isolate/run/shutdown switch), and then from the head end controlled by the engineer. A couple of things you can do; isolate the DP (drop throttle to idle), set up a fence (have the head end and rear end at different throttle settings), and normal mode (DP does what ever the head end power does). One of the interesting fail safes of the systems is that if you set 10lb’s of air, the DP will automatically go into idle. Running with DP takes a little bit to learn, but it’s really nice train handling, along with fast air sets and releases.
Craig
Hi Craig,
I guess it depends on the profile of the line, for some sections of the CPR here in the West there are specific braking routines in the Employee Timetable. Sure made my eyes pop when I read all that “good stuff”; as one of the guys on one of the Swiss fora has it in his sig: “It’s easy to get a train up to speed, it’s a different matter to bring it to a safe stop”.
On that comm matter, I’ll have to ask next time I’m in Revelstoke how that works in the long tunnels through Rogers Pass.
In the tunnels they most likely have repeaters. A while back BNSF spend a ton of $ installing repeaters inside the cascade tunnel (7.8 miles) and they still have some comm loss but not as much. Ironically it’s more geographical locations then tunnels that cause a comm loss. Lots of hills and curves and that sort of things (along with crappy and old antennas) cause interesting things to happen to DP.
Anyone can run a train uphill (that’s when the engineer gets his nap), but not to many people can run down mountain grade with a heavy train! I would think that specific restrictions for dynamic brakes would remain in place for mountain grades, but not for flat land running. One of the ‘rules’ that got broken every once in while was the 5 mph over speed limit when going down mountain grade, if you hit 5 mph over you have to dump it. But a few engineers would sweat it out and get their train under control at 5 over. I always ran conservatively 2-3 mph under on the mountain cause it adds just a bit of extra stress.
Lots and lots of rules for running in mountain territory! And then when it snows it just gets even funner! How you run in the summer and in the winter are two different beasts. The BNSF management was getting mad at us out here in Wa in the winter time because we would run with 10lbs set on the independent line to keep the brake shoes warm, and they tried to get us for violating a rule. Then when the flatlanders came out and went up on the mountain they kind of got scared straight when you try and stop, and for some reason the brakes don’t want to hold cause they’ve got a thick layer of ice built up. They learn real fast why the rules get thrown out the window during the winter time in the mountains!
Craig
Yeah the trick with the pre-warmed brake shoes is good, would have saved one of my acquaintances a lot of hassle and embarrassment (and a set of underwear :lol:).
Yep, it will be interesting to see what winter will bring. I have a standing invite from a CP road manager for a little trip. Could make for a super video. 
Melting ice of brake shoes is an interesting part of mountain railroading. I remember my first couple of trips solo over the mountains in the winter. I always dragged my independent brakes more then I needed, but I figured it was worth replacing a few brake shoes, then having my conductor get pissed off at me because I had to dump the train. I know quite a few conductors who have had to tie down the whole train in waist deep snow, and then walk back and knock them off. They are wet from sweat from the waist up, and wet from the snow waist down! LOL How come if the engineer f***s up, the conductor is the one stuck doing all the work? The smart conductors pack snow shoes!
I think winter railroading is much more interesting then regular railroading.
Craig
Sorry for derailing the thread Jerry!
Craig,
Can’t you put it in second gear, engage the Jake Brake and just let it coast down hill? :lol: 
Ken can do that.
Craig Townsend said:
............How come if the engineer f***s up, the conductor is the one stuck doing all the work?
I think winter railroading is much more interesting then regular railroading.Craig
Sorry for derailing the thread Jerry!
On those conductors, they have a responsible position, anything or anyone f… up they are responsible.
See they don’t have that problem on most European railways. One man crew, one man to fix things.
The problem with shooting video in the winter? Which gives out first the battery, my hands or my patience? I remember shooting th CP Holiday train
[vimeo]http://www.vimeo.com/8397685[/vimeo]
it was quite “crisp” (never mind the heavy mountain gear!), the wind was blowing and then, at Salmon Arm, it started to snow in a serious fashion. Shooting the video was a piece of cake, driving home (about 70km in a snow storm) wasn’t.
Hi Jerry!
We call those “mid train dupes” or super trains. Sometimes they just put two trains together so they can move 2 trains with one crew. Other times there will only be 20 or so cars behind the DPs. Of course with a train stretching close to 9000 feet long, it’s hard to find a place to park it! And then when they get to No. Platte, we have to call an extra crew (the dog catchers!) to take the thing apart again!
HJ,
Very nice.
Even an old Scrooge like me liked it.
It’s too bad Buffett doesn’t do something like that with his trains.
Thanks for the info Bill, you working for the UP makes you the one to ask.
Even an old Scrooge like me liked it. smile smile
It’s too bad Buffett doesn’t do something like that with his trains.
Maybe Buffett is more interested in keeping his people working. The super trains just cost jobs. It takes “X” horsepower to move “Y” tons of cars, so by putting two trains together, the only savings is the cost of the crew that’s not required for the second train.