Large Scale Central

The New Aristo 0-4-0

General Discussion
#21

Oh Alan.
I am certainly not a competitor of AristoCraft per se. Never have been since AC partially hived off the Crest part many years ago.
I have never, repeat never commented about the R/C electronics they make. That would be unprofessional on my part.

Notwithstanding that, I am also a consumer and handler pf AristoCraft locomotives and have probably had more experience in the 25 + years I have been in Large Scale, than you have with many of their products. As such I feel I have every right to comment about them.
Some have been good, for example the RS3 which I regard as one of the best locos ever made. Some have been terrible.

However it has been the Laissez Faire attitude shown by the proprietors to consumers over the years that concerns me as a consumer.

I would respectfully suggest you resist criticising the messenger, instead of accepting the truth of the message.

#22

Let’s move on.
Fellow LSC person:
What has been the most reliable of your AristoCraft steam-outline locomotives?

#23

Tony,

I do not doubt your extensive experiences or qualifications. My post, mainly directed to Tim, was about rudeness and a particular insult pointed in my direction and other who happen to like Aristo products… It had nothing to do with any manufacturers failings with their products or their attributes or lack of them. It was as simple as that. I made my point to Tim because I am sick and tired of seeing the abusive comments week after week usually elsewhere, but now more so here, over a period of years.

In my view this place and any other Forum for that matter, is better of without that tone of post…

#24

None:

They haven’t made NG anything aside from the Delton connie and than was too expensive for the old indoor layout, and too big for the Pizza.

Pacific, Mike, Mallet, Connie all too big and/or require wider curves than I can afford.

The switcher is the only thing that really works on my indoor layout, and even though the one I bought is very new, it is defective in a way I am finding intolerably inexcusable.

I wasn’t joking when I said I have had Scientific and New Bright trains than were ridiculously cheap yet surprisingly reliable runners, so we know LS trains can be designed and built reliably for very little money, my Lil Big Haulers are also very inexpensive yet solidly reliable. So what gives with AC that even though they have received notification on many levels that there are problems that they instead of addressing them, they instead ignore the issues or try to shift the blame, and it isn’t occasionally, its year after year after year, I can personally recall reading almost the same discussions back when I started in 2000 regarding the Pacific and Mikado, 13 years isn’t enough time to address basic design problems?

Or is it that in reality they have run things on such a shoestring budget that have very little input on the production side of things, in essence they have been getting all these years exactly what they have been willing to pay for?

All is not doom and gloom though, all of my bashes that use the diesel blocks, the FA1 or centercab blocks are solid reliable runners.

#25

Thankc Vic. Let’s get some more opinions.
Could Alan and Tony take it elsewhere please?
Fellow LSC person:
What has been the most reliable of your AristoCraft steam-outline locomotives?

#26

John,

I do not find Tony and Alan’s comments misplaced on this thread or this forum. I think what they have to say is quite enlightening from both sides. Like they say, if it bothers you, don’t click on it. No offense intended, my friend.

#27

Here is my roster,

Fa and FB repainted and rewired, no issues
Fa Santa Fe, no issues made from scrap parts for my son Vincent, re-wired
Fa Napa Valley, no issues
Mikado, tons of run time, usually run on our modular layout some times for 8 hours at a time, added revo and Sierra sound board, no issues
Pacific, added revo with sound, no issues
Mallet, bought used no issues
0-4-0, bought for $20, rebuilt, no issues
Two u25b’s rewired for revo, added new smoke units, bought used, no issues.
E8, bought used had one bad gear, so far no other issues

I guess I am very lucky,

This is just my experience,

Nico

Disclaimer, this post is not pointed at anyone, just my personal experience.

#28

None taken, Joe. But ever since I started this thread I’ve been trying to get a handle on what Aristo steam-outline products might be worthy of kitbashing, as I have a particular project in mind. Now I’m finally getting close to some answers, and the whole thing is in danger of getting derailed because Alan has taken offense to something. Which frankly I don’t give a crap about. It’s his problem, not ours, and most certainly not mine.

I’m trying to keep this thing on topic and get some answers. Both Alan and Tony have their experiences, which might add to this, or they might continue their discussion, derailing it.

I suppose I could start another thread… or can this one be rescued, so maybe I could gain a little insight into other people’s experience with these products? Dealing with AristoCraft has been problematic for many, including myself; it feels a bit like walking on thin ice. Yet I have heard rumors that SOME of their steam-outline stuff is actually not bad, and I’d like some confirmation of that from some members here. That’s all I’m asking for, and it seems reasonable to me that fellow LSC members would understand somebody’s desire for a little straight information, and humbly leave the egotistical pomposity and related BS out of it.

#29

Thanks Nico. Our posts crossed. Info much appreciated.

#30

I have older REA Rogers which is a great runner. (I got it used from Vic)

After getting that one I decided to purchase a newer Rogers. Well big mistake. It runs like crap. I guess they decided to take the pickups off the back trucks. The electrical pickup stinks on the newer version.

I also bought the center cab trucks for my Class A Climax. They work great on battery power but on track power it runs like my newer Rogers.

I like the Train engineer. I think its a great system for track power. Never had issues with that

All of my track is Aristo and I cant complain about their track. It holds up in all the temp extremes and looks good once weathered.

I also had the 0-4-0 live steamer. I though it was a great runner for a first steamer. The price was very affordable and you got the added RC to boot. Its too bad it didn’t fit into my RR theme so I sold it for a Forney. I would have kept it if I didn’t need the $$$$$ for the Forney. I wish they stuck with the live steam.

Other then the above nothing really appeals to me. I wish they did more narrow gauge stuff or even stayed with the live steam. I think they had something their and was looking forward to seeing that live steam Rogers.

Im at a stage now where my main focus is live steam and scratch building stuff. The only rolling stock that I would buy would be either accucraft or kits. But now Im getting off topic, Ill leave it at that…

#31

John, you have some very mixed messages here. Your initial post and thread title refers to the NEW Aristo 0-4-0 not all steam locos for kitbashing. A lot of the information you wanted you got with the link, from MLS, posted by Shawn Viggiano. In that thread R J de Berg gave a very balanced view of his findings and what he did to correct what he did not like. The thread was soon obfuscated by people talking about the OLD 0-4-0 and other things. Even the most recent reply to you refers to the OLD version.

I think you can take it that Tony and I have finished our comments to each other: we have “met” before but still remain amicable. But then I tthink we are of the same ancestry.

You say I took offense to “something”. Careful reading would show that I and others alike were compared to nazis. As a Canadien that may not bother you: it did me.

This is my last post in this thread so feel free to elicit the information you require: I hope you get it. For the record I am intested in the loco once it hits my shores.

#32

I had forgot the Rogers. It was an old REA version and yes, it ran very well. Can’t say anything about the new ones but the old REAs were great.

#33

Good to hear this about the old REA Rogers, you guys. That may be the raw material I’m looking for right now… Sounds as if the Mikado and the Pacific might be good bashing fodder for other projects as well. My main concern would be to be certain that the mechs were solid and didn’t have to go thru a complete 0-4-0 style rebuild. I’d far rather start with something solid & dependable right off the shelf and go forward with my bash from there.

#34

John, and others…Although the loco is a 4-6-0, the basic B’mann Big Hauler is just about as dependable as they come too. They continue to upgrade them…just recently they went to a complete metal gear train, and an upgrade to the pilot truck…

The 0-6-0 part of the loco, gives the option to not just stay with the 0-4-0 wheelbase, but to have an 0-6-0 also.

After so many years of the B’mann (I think) 5th edition of their drive; I have yet to have one fail on me. The Basic Annie, is also still priced at a level that anyone can contemplate purchasing a copy. The tender is large enough to hold the Batteries and receiver, for that conversion if desired.

Out of the box it will readily handle very tight curvatures, and pull a good number of cars.

So…don’t forget that option, when looking at bashing/rebuilding material…

Fr.Fred

#35

2-Mallets one with wiring issues Fixed, The motor block kept slipping a wheel and causing

Rods to lock up. Tired of sending them back with low mileage for repairs…SOLD BYE…

Also been few reports of Catching FIRE. Was blamed on sound unit but that turned out to

be untrue Surprise Surprise…

1- Mikado…Wired wrong again and bad smoke unit, Sent for conversion didn’t like new operating system.

Sold…

1-Pacfic ran well but always ran crooked down the track and they could never fix it… SOLD

1- Consolidation defective from the start wheels bad … Promised new ones and we never received…REALLY BIGGEST piece Steam Junk Aristo has made thus far DONT buy…

1-Newest 0 4 0…Built 2011 boxed in 2012 sold to me as new production in fall of 2013

So far wheel has come off but after I fixed that seems to be running ok now.

No D cut wheels as we were told and they used them OLD wheels with the plastic

center sleeve on the tender !!! Why I dont know.

Most all of these are very toyish looking and have some Quality issues with running and wiring, If

your going to buy a motor block go over it well before installing it, but even then…

(http://freightsheds.largescalecentral.com/users/nicholas_savatgy/_forumfiles/96_lg_clr.gif)

And remember that you may not be able to get repair parts and you May/Will need them.

Just the FACTS… Youtube Videos 12ns12

I buy AML and USA Trains for reliable running steamers…Maybe you could buy a Die-cast chassis

and cut it down to fit your project. Just a thought

All my loco’s are electric versions.

#36

John, when you ask everyone to “be nice”, and then you say “and humbly leave the egotistical pomposity and related BS out of it.” you shoot yourself in the foot. I believe your statements combined together are very hypocritical.

You also seem to be unaware of a lot of history, like when Aristo stole a product design from Tony and then threatened to put him out of business.

This is a public forum, and you don’t “own” a thread.

Greg

#37

Greg Elmassian said:

John, when you ask everyone to “be nice”, and then you say “and humbly leave the egotistical pomposity and related BS out of it.” you shoot yourself in the foot. I believe your statements combined together are very hypocritical.

You also seem to be unaware of a lot of history, like when Aristo stole a product design from Tony and then threatened to put him out of business.

This is a public forum, and you don’t “own” a thread.

Greg

Greg, How you doing ?

Talk with ya next week Friend…

#38

Hey Greg.
That comment about product ideas is actually inappropriate for this “new 0-4-0” thread. Even though it is true.
There are other similar instances that have happened to others and can be given as examples.

Might I suggest that we wait until AC future plans are publicly more definite before opening old wounds?

#39

Just for those individuals who believe that I have a ‘grievance’ with a particular company, well, my Sesame Street Rogers and rolling stock are doing just fine. The loco runs like the proverbial Swiss watch (I hope that no Swiss are offended as it seems some on this site who post very, very rarely have very, very, very thin skins). Of cause the pathetic rubber traction tyres turned to junk before the loco was even removed from the box. I cut down LGB traction tyres to fit and they will outlast me.

Now also for those thin skinned posters, an observation NOT a grievance. The Consolidation had a gestation period of many years before production. At the time of development, Aristo was deeply involved in negotiations to define wheel/gauge standards. This was widely documented. What was the result of this intensive negotiation, a locomotive that cannot even run on the same manufacturer’s track without derailing. Who makes the technical decisions at that site?

The 0-4-0 has been in production for many years and yet they still cannot make a reliable, fault free drive. Whose fault is that, certainly not the consumer. Although if the dedicated band of henchmen who have faithfully followed the word of the master had of spoken out a long time ago then maybe the faults still in existence today may have been corrected years ago.

The master in a personal email advised me that at the time of the Mikado wheel retention fiasco, that no one had ever reported a failed drive unit. His own forum was inundated with reports of wheel slippage, but what he meant was that no one had returned a locomotive for warranty repair. We are so accustomed to failed drive units that we fix the items ourselves rather than return for repair.

#40

Nick S. said:

I just keep it short and let people know the facts buy Ro watch them go, Buy Pulk sit and sulk.

A blatant exaggeration. I don’t know what kind of troubles you’ve had with your AC locos, but clearly not every AC loco (or other product) is crap.

I suppose now I’ll be accused of “drinking the Kool-Ade” for pointing out that the fact that some people are happy with their AC stuff.