Large Scale Central

The Carrizo Gorge railroad

Prototypes
#13

This sure brings back some great memories! My brothers and I used to hike the tracks through the gorge many times back in the late '70s through the early '80s.

The first time I hiked to the big trestle, there was a crane car on the spur track next to the old tank car. Also, the semaphore signal was still intact, and there was a small building next to it.

I don’t know what happened to the crane, but the building and semaphore were quickly destroyed by vandals (the scum of the earth!), along with many other things along the tracks. Later on, illegals became a big problem, hiking the tracks to avoid the Border Patrol and leaving lots of trash, starting fires, etc. The timbers in one tunnel were burned out that way, along with a couple of the smaller trestles.

One time we pushed that speeder up the tracks a long ways, then let it coast and rode it back down. That was really cool. Sadly, the next time we were there, the speeder had been pushed over the cliff by vandals.

Some folks used to ride the tracks on homemade carts back then. My brother and I nearly got run over by one of them! We were hiking back to camp shortly after sunset and it was starting to get dark. We hadn’t expected to be gone so long so we didn’t bring flashlights.

As we were crossing a very long trestle with no catwalk, a cart came roaring up the tracks. No headlight, and apparently no muffler either. The engine noise was so loud no one could hear us yelling. We got out as far as we could on the ends of the longest ties and just prayed we wouldn’t get hit. The cart roared past us and never even slowed down. To this day I don’t know if the people on it ever noticed us.

It’s too bad those passenger cars and the caboose were left in the gorge. They’ll be completely trashed before very long.

BTW, the Carrizo Gorge was the inspiration for my layout.

#14

I’ve never been out along the line. Got to the Campo museum a couple of years ago. A very nice collection of RR stuff. There is a maintenance facility for the line in Jacumba that is worth a visit as well as you go thru there. Just make a turn to the north at the main interesction it town and go about 3 blocks.

#15

When was the line abandoned? Judging by the gallery cars in the video it could not have been before the 60’s. I’m surprised that equipment is still in as good shape as it is. Around here all of the glass would be broken out in a month. I agree, vandals are the scum of the earth.

#16

Jon,
On the YouTube page, someone says it was abandoned in 2008. I think there were earlier periods in it’s history when it was also not used.
Ralph

#17

The line was originally built by the San Diego & Arizona Railway. The 11-mile section through the gorge has 17 of the line’s 21 tunnels and a couple miles worth of bridges and trestles. Later the RR was taken over by the Southern Pacific and renamed the San Diego & Arizona Eastern Railway. The route through the gorge was first abandoned after suffering damage from Tropical Storm Kathleen in 1976.

In 1979 the railroad was purchased by the Metropolitan Transit Development Board. There was a brief attempt to repair the line, but another storm just a few months later in January 1980 caused more damage and the work stopped for a while.

Eventually the line was repaired and reopened between San Diego and Plaster City in January 1983. In June of that year two trestles were burned, apparently caused by campfires of illegal immigrants passing through the gorge. In 1984 the MTDB signed an agreement with RailTex to operate freight service under the name San Diego & Imperial Valley Railroad. Freight service only went from San Diego to the border at San Ysidro. Later, it became possible to operate as far east as Tecate, MX.

In 1989 work began to repair the “Desert Line”, though the gorge. Apparently worked stopped when a tunnel partially collapsed after the timbers were destroyed by a fire. In 2001 the Carrizo Gorge Railway was formed and signed a contract to reopen and operate the desert line. Repairs in the gorge were finally completed in 2004. The railroad mainly shipped sand from the desert to be used for concrete in San Diego, however there were also shipments of grain, lumber and other materials. In 2008 the Carrizo Gorge Railway placed an “embargo” on the line. I’m not sure what that means but they’ve ceased operation, at least for now.

In 2010* a tunnel in Mexico was burned, shutting down operations from SD to Tecate. The passenger cars and caboose that are now stranded in the gorge belong to the Carrizo Gorge Railway. I know that they often talked about someday using them to do tourist runs through the gorge but I don’t know if they ever did any.

*Edit: Apparently the correct year of this damage is 2009.

#18

Thanks for the history Ray.

#19

Unless they have their own security force (LARGE) with STK orders, I am not sure the vandalism will not bankrupt any attempt to operate.

Bob C.

#20

Comment deleted.

#21

Vey cool. If those cars were left out like that by me they would have rusted and been ruined by now. That dry desert weather really preserves things.

#22
Ray Dunakin said:
In 2008 the Carrizo Gorge Railway placed an "embargo" on the line. I'm not sure what that means but they've ceased operation, at least for now.
I'm told by my RR buddies that "embargoed" means "not operated but not officially abandoned."

Thanks for the history, Ray. Very interesting.

Steve

#23

I swear I’ve seen those cars off the 8 freeway when I’ve come across from Tucson, and about a year ago saw an old red F unit of some kind going back and forth just outside of Ocotillo along the 8

#24

Embargoed does mean not operated on but not officially abandoned. Yeah the line was always a maintenance headache. The most recent attempt to reopen the line just ran into one bad turn after another. I personally believe the line will only be partially used as part of the local museum train line.

#25
Victor Smith said:
Embargoed does mean not operated on but not officially abandoned. Yeah the line was always a maintenance headache. The most recent attempt to reopen the line just ran into one bad turn after another. I personally believe the line will only be partially used as part of the local museum train line.
A few years back I was driving along I-8 quite regularly. There was a string of hoppers and on engine sitting there by I-8 down by the turn off to Plaster City. I was curious about them. Then one evening I saw a train with the hoppers, a box car and an end bulkead flat heading up the line. One evening I was in Jacumba and saw the string of hoppers moving along the line thru the trees. 2 years ago I was in the area again and the string of hoppers are now up on the line near Jacumba. So the line from the low desert up to Jacumba (and presumably along to the Railroad Museum in Campo) must be passable. There is railroad maintenance area in opperation in Jacumba. Turn north at the only interesection in town and go about 3 blocks. The street ends at the railroad. Some cars, engines and firefighting equipment with railroad wheels in addtion to road tires there when I visited. If I get back down there this spring I'll report on what I observe. The Railroad Museum in Campo is well worth a visit.

I uderstood that the original railroad from San Diego was begun by Spreckles. Back in the days when all “tycoons” had to have their own railroad as a “status symbol”. It never made it to Arizona . . . . :wink:

#26

What a great video! That was fun to watch. Can you imagine how cool a dinner train would be over that line?

#27
Narrow Gauge Lover said:
Victor Smith said:
Embargoed does mean not operated on but not officially abandoned. Yeah the line was always a maintenance headache. The most recent attempt to reopen the line just ran into one bad turn after another. I personally believe the line will only be partially used as part of the local museum train line.
A few years back I was driving along I-8 quite regularly. There was a string of hoppers and on engine sitting there by I-8 down by the turn off to Plaster City. I was curious about them. Then one evening I saw a train with the hoppers, a box car and an end bulkead flat heading up the line. One evening I was in Jacumba and saw the string of hoppers moving along the line thru the trees. 2 years ago I was in the area again and the string of hoppers are now up on the line near Jacumba. So the line from the low desert up to Jacumba (and presumably along to the Railroad Museum in Campo) must be passable. There is railroad maintenance area in opperation in Jacumba. Turn north at the only interesection in town and go about 3 blocks. The street ends at the railroad. Some cars, engines and firefighting equipment with railroad wheels in addtion to road tires there when I visited. If I get back down there this spring I'll report on what I observe. The Railroad Museum in Campo is well worth a visit.

I uderstood that the original railroad from San Diego was begun by Spreckles. Back in the days when all “tycoons” had to have their own railroad as a “status symbol”. It never made it to Arizona . . . . :wink:


If I recall it was SP that finally connected it with their mainline in Yuma, thus finally fullfilling its aim to be a “transcontinental” rail connection, I havent been to the rail museum yet, just too far for a day trip, maybe one of these days.

#28
Victor Smith said:
Narrow Gauge Lover said:
Victor Smith said:
Embargoed does mean not operated on but not officially abandoned. Yeah the line was always a maintenance headache. The most recent attempt to reopen the line just ran into one bad turn after another. I personally believe the line will only be partially used as part of the local museum train line.
A few years back I was driving along I-8 quite regularly. There was a string of hoppers and on engine sitting there by I-8 down by the turn off to Plaster City. I was curious about them. Then one evening I saw a train with the hoppers, a box car and an end bulkead flat heading up the line. One evening I was in Jacumba and saw the string of hoppers moving along the line thru the trees. 2 years ago I was in the area again and the string of hoppers are now up on the line near Jacumba. So the line from the low desert up to Jacumba (and presumably along to the Railroad Museum in Campo) must be passable. There is railroad maintenance area in opperation in Jacumba. Turn north at the only interesection in town and go about 3 blocks. The street ends at the railroad. Some cars, engines and firefighting equipment with railroad wheels in addtion to road tires there when I visited. If I get back down there this spring I'll report on what I observe. The Railroad Museum in Campo is well worth a visit.

I uderstood that the original railroad from San Diego was begun by Spreckles. Back in the days when all “tycoons” had to have their own railroad as a “status symbol”. It never made it to Arizona . . . . :wink:


If I recall it was SP that finally connected it with their mainline in Yuma, thus finally fullfilling its aim to be a “transcontinental” rail connection, I havent been to the rail museum yet, just too far for a day trip, maybe one of these days.

Good for a weekend trip. Go down to Julian and stay at the Julian Hotel. Then make a trip down to see the museum, maybe also the “desert tower”, lots of nice places down in the “back country” of San Diego County. Old Gold mining stuff around Julian, go down in the Eagle Peak Mine, etc.

Julian . . . http://www.drburkholter.com/cf11.html

#29

I am a member of an RV Truck Camper Forum. A fellow member there recently posted a narrative of his trip to the S. Borrego Desert area. Although the main theme of the posting is his desert camping trip, there are lots of very highly detailed pictures of his hike along the Carrizo Gorge RR. In fact they started by camping next to the RR and the first couple of pix are of a water tank. Here is a link:

http://www.rv.net/forum/index.cfm/fuseaction/thread/tid/25732041.cfm

Just be sure to look all the way through the many pix. Lots of great RR stuff!

Hope all desert RRers like this.

Happy RRing,

Jerry

#30

Great pics!
The guy has a great sense of humor as well.

#31
Jerry Bowers said:
I am a member of an RV Truck Camper Forum. A fellow member there recently posted a narrative of his trip to the S. Borrego Desert area. Although the main theme of the posting is his desert camping trip, there are lots of very highly detailed pictures of his hike along the Carrizo Gorge RR. In fact they started by camping next to the RR and the first couple of pix are of a water tank. Here is a link:

http://www.rv.net/forum/index.cfm/fuseaction/thread/tid/25732041.cfm

Just be sure to look all the way through the many pix. Lots of great RR stuff!

Hope all desert RRers like this.

Happy RRing,

Jerry


Wife and I loved your story. It reminded us of our trips with our camper back in the late 70 when we first got married. She never been out camping in the boon docks in her life.
So we did a lot of exploring in Ca and Nev. Places that had to use chain and binder to get our Veh. around in places. But, hey like you no one has been around these places where we went in our time.
Sure wish we had good cameras then like they have out there now… Most of our stuff was 8 mm cam.
There is so much history in the desert and Mt’s.
Now to old to get out like that anymore, so really enjoyed your link.
Tk again for sharing. Noel & Jane

#32

Great pics, and enjoyable, humorous post.

You might want to let him know that those “track tensioner/thingamajiggies” are actually flange lubers. As the wheels of a train pass over it, the motion works a pump that forces a small amount of grease onto the flanges, which reduces wear on the tight curves.

BTW, that old water tower is the prototype for my In-ko-pah RR water tower. Sad to see how much more vandalism has been inflicted on it in the past few years.