Large Scale Central

Some ramblings on 2015 build challenge

The MIK - Annual Build Challenge
#1

Some thoughts on Mik’s Build Challenge 2015.

As “The Challenge” is now more or less done for 2015, I have some ramblings and thoughts to pass on. Thank you for all the accolades. I carry on the build challenges because I believe that it’s my way of giving back to my community here at LSC. With out giving back to an organization, you become a non constructive part, a taker, not a giver. When an origination has more takers then givers, it will eventually die. I believe that the build challenge is good for our community, and I will do my best to keep it going, and carry on what Mik started.

It has been asked about the number of voters this year. I had several people express a desire to vote in private, their thought was that not voting for someone might hurt there feelings or whatever, that they didn’t vote in a particular way might be miss construed. What ever, why not, so I opened up the vote to private, and I did get numerous additional votes, No I didn’t spend a bunch of time researching each ones membership status, I took them at their word.

28 people voted. Not all voters voted in all categories, and some voted in non vote categories ( i.e.: best napkin ). In the General build category, each one could vote for their choice for 1st, second, and third. I assigned 3 points for a 1st place vote, 2 points for a 2nd place vote, and 1 point for a 3rd place vote. The totals decided the winners.

I sent out 28 kits total. I cut up wood ( all from re-cycled scrap ) for a total of 55, 16 scale ft. kits, 10 each in, 1:22.5, 1:24, 1:29, 1:32, and 15 kits in 1:20.3. With an avg. of 32 pieces in each kit it came to about 1760 custom cut pieces in the 5 scales. As I have no way of knowing who, in what scale, will join, I cut to all scales.

The break down on kit sizes was. 13 in 1:20.3, 6 in 1:22, 5 in 1:24, 3 in 1:29, 1 in 1:32 . Eric S. did make his own in 7/8 scale as I had not cut to that size. Our Brit’ also built his own 16’ platform as shipping time would have prevented him from starting till the challenge was almost over. Almost 50% were 1:20.3 and only 4 were in the smallest 2 scales.

Why the whimsical fun theme? A couple of years ago Mik and I tossed around ideas for the build, and this was discussed, and we decided that we didn’t have all the stuff to pull it off on such short notice, and thats when I offered up my Shorty Gons kits I had cut but not built yet. Oh well maybe next year. Last year (2014) everyone wanted a structure and so the car got pushed back yet again till this year. Next year… I’m on my own, and I all ready know what it is going to be…

The “First Timers” category is a win-win for all. We lopped a lot of people in to it this year, and I hope that there will be a lot more 1st timers next year, which means the challenge grows better each year, with new souls joining in the fun.

A special thank you to all the prize givers. A very very personal special thank you to Todd H., John C. and Vic S. (and you know why).

I have received a couple of critiques in that there is such great builders joining that “they don’t stand a chance of winning anything” i.e. their build skills are not up to that level, so why put out the effort to join in at all. Wow… that is an issue at the very core of the build challenge. The “Challenge” is to BUILD, not to win. Have I, by adding to, and building up the prize pot, created my own double edge sword. Encouraging people to join by offering up prizes, getting great modelers to build great things, and in so doing creating an atmosphere that discourages some to join in. This is not at all what I want the challenge to be, or that, what it should be. It’s defiantly NOT what Mik wanted.

It has crossed my mind to maybe set up two skill levels of builds, or something along the lines of expert and novice levels. (But who decides?).

Your ( LSC ) Thoughts? Good open discussion please!

Yes, I have a bunch of extra car kits, Kits are Free, cover postage $. to PAY PAL account @ [email protected]. Let me know the size you want.

Thanks again for making this years Mik’s Build Challenge the best ever.

Dave

#2

Last year I built my gas station, assuming that I would not win. I ended up posting 2 separate threads on how I made the roof and windows for my building. I also won something. I was happy to play along at home, and I got a build off of my “someday” build list. So I won just by getting off my behind and doing something. I also hope that I gave back something with my explanations of how I made the windows and roof.

This year I built my bobber, also something on my “someday” build list. I also won something, even though I thought I didn’t stand a chance.

So next year, join in and build something. You just might win, and even if you do not win, you will get a project done. Thats a win in my book. Plus you have the fun of joining in the group project. Its always more fun playing along with others then going and working alone.

#3

Dave Taylor said:

I have received a couple of critiques in that there is such great builders joining that “they don’t stand a chance of winning anything” i.e. their build skills are not up to that level, so why put out the effort to join in at all. Wow… that is an issue at the very core of the build challenge. The “Challenge” is to BUILD, not to win. Have I, by adding to, and building up the prize pot, created my own double edge sword. Encouraging people to join by offering up prizes, getting great modelers to build great things, and in so doing creating an atmosphere that discourages some to join in. This is not at all what I want the challenge to be, or that, what it should be. It’s defiantly NOT what Mik wanted.

It has crossed my mind to maybe set up two skill levels of builds, or something along the lines of expert and novice levels. (But who decides?).

Your ( LSC ) Thoughts? Good open discussion please!

Dave

I have no real build skills and my hands are arthritic making it difficult, and painful to do the small stuff. But what I do have is imagination and creativity, and that will get you through. (http://largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-wink.gif)

Thanks for putting this together and your efforts to make it successful.

#4

For the first time ever, I didn’t vote.

Simply put, too many categories and too little time.

By the time I was half way through the build threads, voting was over.

It was also difficult to determine who the “first timers” were.

My suggestion…simplify.

Let members vote for their 3 favorite.

Let the prize donors determine the winners of the “special” categories.

Ralph

#5

What Ralph said. (Mista B)

#6

This is a very thoughtful discussion so far… I agree with Dave Taylor’s concerns and with David Maynard’s encouraging comments. I also sympathize with Todd and his arthritic hands - that must be a huge annoyance to a model builder. I lost the sight of one eye last year and that has been a surprising handicap as well; you can’t perceive depth, or line up things accurately, or locate centers, or measure readily, and so much more without a lot of compensating effort.

I also found myself in the same position as Mista B., unable to keep up with all the action, 'though I was able to read halfway or more through all the builds but I was not able to read to the end of them all, so in that sense, the challenge has sort of outgrown our ability to keep up! But that’s probably a good thing as it indicates that it has successfully got us all off our collective duffs. While I did not enter the challenge itself, all the action and good examples got me moving again on a large project that has been on hold for a couple of years. I have brought it close to completion, prompted by watching everyone else’s progress!

Mista B and Dave T have both made good suggestions for fine-tuning and simplifying the challenge. We do want to put the emphasis on it as a challenge rather than a competition. I don’t think I could add to their comments, but hopefully others will chime in and perhaps offer some creative solutions. Clearly, we do need some fresh thinking around these points.

Thanks for running the show, Dave, and for opening up this discussion, which I hope will be a fruitful one. Cheers!

#7

I always thought of the build challenge as a way to wipe away the “winter blues” by collectively encouraging everyone to build something during a specific time frame. The time and money limit was thrown in as an ‘extra gotta’ which makes it fun for both beginners and ‘experts’.

Maybe just go back to awarding no prize at all? And if people want to share something have them make a collective contribution towards the build?

Or if people want to award a prize, do it all ‘back channel’ and let the pool of prize participants pick who does the best.

#8

A BIG Thank you to Dave T for all he does to keep this challenge going.

I didn’t receive to many votes this year because there were better builds than mine. Yes it saddened me but what can one do besides try your best and reach a bit further to grab that higher bar next time?

Last year for the challenge I built a 2 bay engine house and it is one of my favorite buildings to date. The year before a MAC speeder and the year before that the challenge was to finish something that we had started and for me that was a yard tower. These builds caused me to try new things and step beyond my meager modelling skills. I am very proud of the accomplishments and without the build challenge I might not have attempted these things.

With all that in mind, each and every modeller that accepted the challenge and did his best is a Winner.

The build challenge (note I didn’t say Contest because ultimately it is a personal challenge to build what you can within the rules and share the results and build techniques with friends) is getting bigger every year and it is tough to keep track of what everyone is doing.

To help keep better track next year we could all post our napkin plans on a separate thread within the annual build challenge spot, Thanks for that Bob. Then 3 weeks into the challenge we all post one photo showing the status of our builds with a few words and then at the end we post the finished photos for voting. That way we have one spot where we could all quickly check in on the builds. No comments would be allowed in these 3 special sections, if you want to comment please go to the builders log to do so.

The voting categories need to be tightened up or made a bit clearer. I was confused at first as I think some were but then figured it out. I guess guys just need to know what they are voting for. there should not be any problem about being afraid to step on any ones toes or hurt feelings. You are Voting for what you feel to be the top 3 best builds, the best build log/story, the spirit of Mik and other categories. No one should vote for their friend just because and no one should be hurt because someone is honest. Politics should not come into play.

I vote for keeping the prize pool as it is a incentive for many to give it a try. Every ones skill set is different so keeping the ball field level is very difficult. I don’t think there is a way around this besides setting up 2 levels to the challenge which might do more to confuse than help.

Every year the challenge has gotten better with more participants and more amazing skills being demonstrated and I’m looking forward to next time.

#9

Dave, I think You have done a very good job of carrying on the challenge as Mik would wanted. I look forward to it since my first time two years ago. It is a great way to pass the time when the weather is bad out and to build something to improve the skills. I have learned something from someone every year now. Although I did not participate as intended this year, due to personal stuff happening, I still learned and saw some neat builds. I like the idea of prizes. Not sure what Mik had for the first time he had the contest, But I would like to see it continue as is. Prizes donated by participants or ones that just watch the progress is really neat. The spending cap is a must too. Well I will quit rambling on. Just keep up the good work Dave… Travis

#10

Todd, the idea of a group post, beginning plans, halfway through and finished is sort of what happened this year. Not all in one thread, but there was a “halfway” thread and a finished thread. My thing is, on both builds I did, I didn’t start with any written down plans, I design as I go. Also, especially this year, I wanted to keep people guessing as to what the heck I was doing. If I wanted everyone to know, from the start, what I was building, I would have entitled my thread with the word Bobber in it.

Some folks can take the time and design the whole project, or most of it, right from the start. I never was that good at design. I am more a “fly by the seat of my pants” kinda guy. Sure, I have an idea in my head about the next 3, 4 or 5 steps, but the idea gets refined when the time comes to do them. So I will probably never win a napkin design award.

As it is I think the challenge works. I didn’t vote, because there were so many categories to cast the votes for, and I got caught up in some household and personal stuff during the voting window. I just didn’t have time to sift through the builds and figure out my picks for each slot of the ballot. I think all of the entries were winners, and I am proud to have my entry alongside such great builds.

#11

Dave, Mik and the rest of you had a great idea and executed it well! I, for one, have been sort of a lurker on this forum but found the Challenge a fun way to get involved. I really enjoyed seeing what each builder came up with and had a great time with my own project. The fun of the project was my goal, the awards were not in my sights or much of a motivator to tell the truth…not that they weren’t great prizes and I thank those who offered them!

I am pleased that my Moose chariot was so well received, I think it was unique but not really the best build of the challenge, others had better technical skills and some very interesting Ideas!

I shared my project with some other forums as did other builders and got some good comments but this is a very unique community that can make such a group project happen.

I had also thought to write up a little article for Garden Railways, It would be interesting for the readers to see some of the fun we all have! I had started out thinking just to write up my own project but that would be silly, so if you like the idea, send me a short story and some good high quality photos, I’ll edit it all together, send it in and donate all proceeds to next year’s challenge. send stuff to eric(at)shearwater(dash)boats(dot)com.

#12

Todd Haskins said:

A BIG Thank you to Dave T for all he does to keep this challenge going.

there should not be any problem about being afraid to step on any ones toes or hurt feelings. You are Voting for what you feel to be the top 3 best builds, the best build log/story, the spirit of Mik and other categories. No one should vote for their friend just because and no one should be hurt because someone is honest. Politics should not come into play.

Agreed…, but it does and there are any number of reasons that someone will or won’t vote for someone online if they know that others will know how they voted.

I could have come up with a train that simultaneously cures ebola, solves cold fusion, and pops corn, but I can think of one LSC member who would never vote for me, if he knew that I knew that he had voted for me, just because he would never want to give me the “satisfaction.”

#13

The prizes are secondary to the fellowship. I had post its of scattered ideas and a general direction of critter, but no idea how I was getting there.

Half way thru, the paint went on thick and ran and ran and ran and ran. Yep on each side. Moose muffins and dual animations, I was ready to quit.

Add one helping of fellowship; John P. became my cheerleader and gave me hope, he was seeing the vision. Knowing he operates a gallery, my thinking changed and instead of the perfect kitbash, I leaned ‘artsy’. During exhaustive Pondering Sessions, I realized my last year definition of Mik described an Artist more than a modeler.

I scrubbed half of the paint off and I uncovered something to see…

To the beginners; jump in we’ll help you. Several buds learned about alcohol and ink washes. I reminded Todd of Wyland; a cheesy calif muralist, for his hot tub build. I think there was a first timer or two with pin nailers … funny I never used my new one.

I confess; I’m looking forward to a new junk box ala Mik, but I’d join just for the fellowship and a chance to rub shoulders with real modelers!

Thanks again to Dave for putting this on and keeping us together.

John

#14

Mista B said:

For the first time ever, I didn’t vote.

Simply put, too many categories and too little time.

By the time I was half way through the build threads, voting was over.

It was also difficult to determine who the “first timers” were.

My suggestion…simplify.

Let members vote for their 3 favorite.

Let the prize donors determine the winners of the “special” categories.

Ralph

Wow, I was thinking that most folks would follow along and have an idea long before vote time. Some were ‘follow along’ stories.

For the casual voters we should have weekly threads; the Good Intention openers, what I procrastinated the 1st week, my first faulty start, and the 2nd and here I am…and a Final showing. (2-3 pics ea.)

The ‘First Timers’ was cross pollinated with first time builders and builders in their first Mik Challenge… Last year was my first Mik build, but I’ve been bashing kits for decades. I didn’t think rookie.

John

#15

John, I would have read along with the threads, and I was at first, but I found I was loosing too much build time reading along so I stopped. I figured I would catch up after the finish line and before voting. Then I had some “issues” that kept me away from the computer, so I didn’t vote. I liked the entries, and it would have been difficult for me to vote, I would have had to weigh all them back and forth for a while to decide.

#16

Even though I didn’t win I figure that’s not the point of it. In fact, I haven’t even looked at what scores are part of the Challenge.

To me the Challenge is more personal. I just think it’s FUN.

This year’s personal Challenge was dedicated to someone some of us know. I dedicated my Challenge to HO modeler John Allen.

Many of you are saying, who is John Allen?

John Allen is a top-notch HO modeler from the 1950s who drew me into HO trains. He built many cars and scenes with a sense of humor.

My swaybacked car was part of what he liked to build and using his ideas I built mine. Dave’s kut provided the inspiration and I may try my hand at building more.

I am really glad Dave has tackled this Challenge and really appreciate his dedication.

I don’t think I see any places to make changes and wonder what Dave is thinking about for next year!

#17

John Caughey said:

Wow, I was thinking that most folks would follow along and have an idea long before vote time. Some were ‘follow along’ stories.

John

I did follow along with some that had more frequent entries.

But even those required a bit of a review.

I can only relate my experience to why I did not vote.

But obviously, there where a whole lot of people that didn’t vote.

Including some of those who participated.

Ralph

#18

I’m another non-voter. I really think this contest is great. I don’t want my comments to discourage anyone from participating and posting detailed build threads.

To be honest, there was so much participation I couldn’t keep up. And when the Vote thread was posted there were so many entries and so many pictures of each entry that it made my head spin (http://www.largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-surprised.gif)I’m also not a big fan of whimsy, so my interest wasn’t there like it was in past challenges.

Maybe the vote thread could be limited to 2 pictures per entry. That would at least help. I don’t think you should eliminate the prizes.

#19

I didn’t vote because I was participating and just didn’t think my vote should count. That’s really just a personal thing.

#20

I think a simplified prize category certainly could be in order. Spirit of MIK and then 1st, 2nd, 3rd favorites. I like separating Spirit of MIK from favorites, for me they were two very different votes for two very different reasons.

As one who donated a prize that was my way of giving to the community as well. However, I understand how this may derail the challenge by making it a competition. So maybe award a prize to the four categories above and then do a raffle for the rest. I am sure I can speak for most if not all of the prize givers that they just wanted to enhance the fun. A raffle would encourage participation and maybe eliminate some of the competitive nature or perception of it.

As a participant. This was just fun. A way to participate with other people doing something we all love and without needing to spend a fortune. Not to make a jab at anyone, but if your reasoning for not participating was because your skills are not up to snuff (your opinion not mine) then I am afraid you missed out on a fun experience. I could care less if I won anything or even if there was a prize to win. I am came here to LSC specifically to participate in this challenge, I didn’t think there was awards, never crossed my mind. Do it because you want to be challenged and let others tell you how good your doing.

I just really had fun and I want everyone to take part either building or admiring those of us that are. Like John said just about the time you think your getting run over by a moose, or drowning in a hot tub, or being taking for a ride in a 200’ tall house on wheels, someone comes along and admires your work and gives you inspiration. Mine was when John L. took interest in my homemade PVC/Bamboo drivers. It spured me on, not for any other reason than someone took notice of unique that I did.

So build for the sake of building and enjoy the company (and Doc Toms tall tales).

How many days til MK 2016?