Large Scale Central

Question about Aristo Motorized Swithc Machines

Electronics
#1

I’ve used Aristo’s electrically operated switch machines, but it’s been a long time. Version 1 of my indoor layout had a pretty extensive network of them controlled with a diode logic interlocking. If my memory is accurate, the machine has a three wire scheme with a common wire, sending a long voltage pulse (push button) down one wire and common would flip the machine one way, or the other way with the other wire and common. I don’t recall the optimum voltage, but it was probably 12-20VDC.

When I rebuilt the indoor as a switching layout, all electric switch motors were eliminated in favor of manual throws. As the layout has grown, I find need for a few remote operated machines in places where reach is an inconvenience. I used a rod operated throw in one spot already, and I could use the simple DC switching method the Aristo motors are designed for -OR- I could add a turnout module to my RailPro system to control them. I like the idea of remote radio control, so I’m researching what that will take.

Reading the RailPro AM-1 modules instructions before I buy, they mention hook-ups / programming for SNAP Vs MOTORIZED. I think I know what those terms mean. If I understand them correctly, a motorized switch machine would be like a Tortoise Machine, that takes a few seconds of energy to move the points with a motor, where a classic Snap Switch contains a solenoid like device that only needs a quick pulse to move the points in a “snap”. When it comes to the Aristo machine, it works like a Snap Switch, but from experience I know it contains a motor. So which is it?

Guess it’s time to dig a machine out of storage and experiment. If anyone has any insight, I’m happy to hear it.

#2

Jon, as you know my setup is very similar to yours, indoor layout, running RailPro, and my switch machines are all manual Bachman Switch Stands which I have just installed. Since my layout is a shelf layout and in some places I have to reach three feet to throw some switches I may also be looking for some easier way to throw these turnouts. I personally like the push/pull rod method, but would also consider the electric switch machines, but not a fan of the snap action ones, just my personal choice. My HOn3 layout is all Tortoise and very happy with there operation. I guess your question might be best answered on the RailPro Forum, https://rpug.pdc.ca/index.php?PHPSESSID=n71a3a71aijtauvhvj0ql6o3v2& not saying that many here probably will have your answer as many on here are on the RailPro forum as well. I will wait for your/there answers and see what other say.

trainman

#3

I wonder if a HO motor would be strong enough and as easy to adapt to a G switch, since there is so much available for the little guys , maybe get one and see if it will adapt. Of course I have no clue if they are expensive. Just a thought.

#4

Thank guys.

I dug what I have left of Aristo motorized machines out of storage. I’m not sure any of them are salvageable. I tore one apart to verify an old drawing I made of the workings. Found the motor gear just spinning on the shaft. Attempted to glue that back tight with CA, which seems to have worked, but getting them assembled with all the small shafts and gears properly aligned has proven to be a real challenge.

John - I don’t think anyone on the RailPro group would have my answer as it relates specifically to the Aristo machine, not how the RailPro module works. IF I can get any of these motors to operate correctly I don’t think wiring them would be an issue. My old drawing reminded me the They use two wire with an internal switch connected to a pair of diodes that power a DC motor. If the switch is in the straight position, a short AC pulse will get rectified by the diode and spin the motor in the correct direction to move the points to curved position and also move the internal switch to the other diode, ready for the next pulse to throw it the other way. I’m pretty sure using the Two Wire Snap Switch settings on the module would work.

Pete - The more I dig into this, the more I realize how poor this old Aristo design is. Finding some other method seems to be the best path as rebuilding my old motors to be reliable seems unlikely.

Now I’m back to thinking about servos! I have a few kicking around, so some experiments are in order!.

#5

Joh,

you saw my setup last fall , which is more than you are looking for I think. as you just want something to move the points in a distant location. the controllers I used from Tam valley are dcc compatible, meaning you can address them remotely thru dcc buss. so I do not know if this would be compatible with your rail pro or not. mine are just dc powered and use the pushbuttons to activate. the leds for the turnout position would be helpful if the turnout is potentially out of view.

one other thing, the servos I have used are the cheep 10 fer bulk packages on eBay.

Al P.

#6

I seem to recall from a York show past that someone (Cliff?) was working on a weatherproof servo box for switch machines.

#7

Hobby King has fairly cheap water proof servos.

https://hobbyking.com/en_us/hobbykingtm-waterproof-analog-servo-3-2kg-0-17sec-40g.html?queryID=c540ed4f42fc8c15835cf732f8259339&objectID=47697&indexName=hbk_live_magento_en_us_products

Martin

#8

Thanks again for the responses. This will be for my indoor, so waterproof is not required.

Al - Yes, I recall your system. The RailPro module I’m considering does not output DCC, but rather controls the motors directly. There is not a lot of info out there about controlling servos, but it is hinted at that it supports servo motors in one of the advertising litterature, but no mention of servos in the documentation. The only mention of servos on the RPUG website, is in conjunction with a Sparkfun servo controller and just uses a simple on/off output to trigger the servo controller.

It is possible to load an accessory program into one of the loco modules. I have spare loco modules and several old servos around, so I can do some experimenting on the bench.

#9

Sooooo…

Looks like RailPro can’t control a servo directly. It can do motor control, but that’s voltage based and won’t drive a servo. Based on another thread here about using servos as switch machines I picked up some Servo Testers off Amazon to play with. I think I can modify them to handle the servos for switching duty with a simple DC power input I can get from the RailPro module.

Rooster - prepare youe A-Bomb graphics. I’m going in…

#10

Jon Radder said:

Sooooo…

Looks like RailPro can’t control a servo directly. It can do motor control, but that’s voltage based and won’t drive a servo. Based on another thread here about using servos as switch machines I picked up some Servo Testers off Amazon to play with. I think I can modify them to handle the servos for switching duty with a simple DC power input I can get from the RailPro module.

Rooster - prepare youe A-Bomb graphics. I’m going in…

Go for it John,

I have had my test bed using an LGB R1 point successfully working for nearly 2 weeks now, the only downside to using the servos is that you lose the ability to move the point blades by hand but if the point is a “cut lunch and a waterbag” away from where you are standing why would you want to.

My parts are on their way and I have the solar charged battery for power installed, I am using a Buck converter off the 12V battery to supply the 5V for the servos.

Dave Bodnar’s method is very simple (solder in a switch and a resistor) and works well, I have used what is known in electronics as a trimpot instead of a fixed resistor so I can make adjustments over time.