Large Scale Central

Our New Shay: The Rest Of The Story

Modeling Motive Power
#6

Very cool Gary. I think you will enjoy this little engine.

I have the “wood burning” version that also came from Royce when they were in production. I was never clued-in on break-in procedures and it had a pretty serious hitch in it’s giddy-up when I first ran it. Accucraft had me send it to a servicing dealer (another well known name in the live steam world that I just don’t remember. Dave Hotman maybe?) It ran better when I got it back, but I’d never describe mine as a Swiss watch (https://www.largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-surprised.gif)

@Pete - How come I never heard of that heat shield idea!!! Mine doesn’t have a lot of hours on it but I do know the smoke box gets pretty hot. It will smolder a small chip of coal I throw in for smell. I probably have one of the few wood burning locos that smells like a coal burner when they go by! It’s so hot that I can’t keep a brass number plate to stay glued (JB-Weld Hi-Temp) to the original number plate. I suppose I need to look into that shield mod.

#7

That’s awesome and I don’t even like steam! Jealous I’m not your son or maybe I would like steam!

#8

Actually I lied!

I have had a nut for the Kalbach 2cyl narrow gauge shay for awhile as it was inter connected with the CVRR back in the day.

https://www.dcnr.pa.gov/StateParks/FindAPark/CowansGapStatePark/Pages/History.aspx

Scroll down to Industrial Times ^^^^^^

Driven the route a few times and they had some serious balls back in the day!

SORRY for Jacking up your thread but dang you hit a fetish (rubbing hands together)

#9

Rooster said:

That’s awesome and I don’t even like steam! Jealous I’m not your son or maybe I would like steam!

He earned this Shay with a 16 month combat tour in Iraq in 2004-2005 as a Combat Medic :). 1st CAV DIV

#10

Jon Radder said:

Very cool Gary. I think you will enjoy this little engine.

I have the “wood burning” version that also came from Royce when they were in production. I was never clued-in on break-in procedures and it had a pretty serious hitch in it’s giddy-up when I first ran it. Accucraft had me send it to a servicing dealer (another well known name in the live steam world that I just don’t remember. Dave Hotman maybe?) It ran better when I got it back, but I’d never describe mine as a Swiss watch (https://www.largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-surprised.gif)

@Pete - How come I never heard of that heat shield idea!!! Mine doesn’t have a lot of hours on it but I do know the smoke box gets pretty hot. It will smolder a small chip of coal I throw in for smell. I probably have one of the few wood burning locos that smells like a coal burner when they go by! It’s so hot that I can’t keep a brass number plate to stay glued (JB-Weld Hi-Temp) to the original number plate. I suppose I need to look into that shield mod.

THIS is exactly why Royce offered to do a few FaceTime sessions with us and walk us through the stamp and break-in :). My son has NO experience with steam. I have quite a few years of running large scale 1-1/2 inch locomotives: 3-3/4 inch NG Porter with coal and propane, 1-1/2 inch ten-wheeler on coal, 1-1/2 inch Mogul on coal and a 1-1/2 inch Little Engines Pacific on oil. With Royce’s help, we should be good. :slight_smile:

#11

Jon Radder said:

Very cool Gary. I think you will enjoy this little engine.

I have the “wood burning” version that also came from Royce when they were in production. I was never clued-in on break-in procedures and it had a pretty serious hitch in it’s giddy-up when I first ran it. Accucraft had me send it to a servicing dealer (another well known name in the live steam world that I just don’t remember. Dave Hotman maybe?) It ran better when I got it back, but I’d never describe mine as a Swiss watch (https://www.largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-surprised.gif)

@Pete - How come I never heard of that heat shield idea!!! Mine doesn’t have a lot of hours on it but I do know the smoke box gets pretty hot. It will smolder a small chip of coal I throw in for smell. I probably have one of the few wood burning locos that smells like a coal burner when they go by! It’s so hot that I can’t keep a brass number plate to stay glued (JB-Weld Hi-Temp) to the original number plate. I suppose I need to look into that shield mod.

THIS is exactly why Royce offered to do a few FaceTime sessions with us and walk us through the steamup and break-in :). My son has NO experience with steam. I have quite a few years of running large scale 1-1/2 inch locomotives: 3-3/4 inch NG Porter with coal and propane, 1-1/2 inch ten-wheeler on coal, 1-1/2 inch Mogul on coal and a 1-1/2 inch Little Engines Pacific on oil. I also have experience in timing both Walschaerts and Stephanson valve gear (which is why you had a hitch in your giddy-up :slight_smile: ) With Royce’s help, we should be good. :slight_smile:

#12

Gary, awesome story!

#13

Very nice indeed.

#14

I suppose I need to look into that shield mod.

I would strongly advise it. It isn’t difficult, and you don’t have to take the truck off, but it helps. Here’s a little eye candy: not one, but 2 at once. Mine is in front, and has a Chuffer (!). Jerry’s Shay and train behind.

P.S.

that also came from Royce

I didn’t think he was still in business.

#15

Pete Thornton said:

I suppose I need to look into that shield mod.

I would strongly advise it. It isn’t difficult, and you don’t have to take the truck off, but it helps. Here’s a little eye candy: not one, but 2 at once. Mine is in front, and has a Chuffer (!). Jerry’s Shay and train behind.

P.S.

that also came from Royce

I didn’t think he was still in business.

I’m going to “wait and see” on our Mich Cal #2 until I have a chance to steam it up for the first time. I’m also going to do a couple of “break-in” stamps on rollers (per Royce’s instructions) and then actually do a couple of short runs as a break-in runs (also per Royce’s instructions).Extreme heat build up in the smoke box could be caused by several things. Individual firing techniques. Pete, you are very experienced with these smaller steam engines and I am definitely taking your suggestion about the shield seriously :)! I think I can get measurements for the size of the shield and make one in my shop. Then take it up to the cabin and install it. Royce said the trucks are brazed/silver soldered brass components and he said they “could” be damaged by extreme heat. Thanks for the suggestion/warning.

#16

Gary,

I have had the pleasure of running an open cab version of this loco since they first were released and it is a pleasure. I have heard of the truck melting concern but even with a smaller id stack made for me by Torry Krutzke and a Summerlands chuffer installed I have never had a problem. It is absolutely mandatory (even if you add the heat shield) that the flame pops back into the boiler tube vs burning in the smoke box. I always light mine with the door open and it is easy to tell by visual and sound cues that the flame is in the proper location. You will be surprised at how well this loco runs at a very low burner setting, the safety valve rarely lifting.

Bob Weltyk recently posted a video of it running on his track on Mylargescale.com live steam forum under Michigan Backyard Live Steamers 2021. I have done a lot of personalization over the years and it is always a hit at the train shows at which I run. I hope you and your son enjoy this loco as much as I have.

Best, Tom

#17

are very experienced with these smaller steam engines and I am definitely taking your suggestion about the shield seriously :)! I think I can get measurements for the size of the shield and make one in my shop. Then take it up to the cabin and install it.

Gary,

I it was Ryan at Triple R who gave me the scoop. My pal had his wheel rims loosen and Ryan fixed it. Ryan also mentioned the burner is bigger than is needed, and you’ll note Tom B’s comment that his runs nicely on a low setting. Fitting the heat shield is an easy fix so I wouldn’t wait.

Royce said the trucks are brazed/silver soldered brass components

Well, Royce may be thinking of some other Shay, as general opinion is that they are not brass. Take a look at this thread - about fitting plastic trucks!

https://www.gscalecentral.net/threads/2-or-3-cylinder-shays.315815/

Accucraft has them on their website again, marked “pre-order”
AP26-100S Single Truck - 1:20.3 Shay, Live Steam (1) SKU: AP26-100S $200.00

#18

Pete, I have my Shay apart for some cab repairs so I think I’ll add the heat shield just in case. The crews of yours and Jerry’s shays in the video must be ending their shift and in a hurry to get back to the barn. Speed demons! (http://largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-wink.gif)Tom

#19

I think I’ll add the heat shield just in case.

Wise move. (http://www.largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-cool.gif)

Accucraft has them on their website again, marked “pre-order”
AP26-100S Single Truck - 1:20.3 Shay, Live Steam (1) SKU: AP26-100S $200.00

I did some research and Triple R Services indicate that they are indeed brass, but from the latest 3-cylinder Shays. In theory you could buy a pair and fit them after your pot-metal trucks disintegrate, but it is not known whether the driveshafts and couplings would be identical.

#20

The crews of yours and Jerry’s shays in the video must be ending their shift and in a hurry to get back to the barn. Speed demons!

Yeah. Ryan commented that the new trucks are a lower ratio, so the newer locos runs slower.

You can’t hear it on the video, but my ‘chuffer’ is audible if the burner is quiet, and with 8 or more chuffs per revolution of those small wheels it does sound interesting!

#21

Tom Bowdler said:

Gary,

I have had the pleasure of running an open cab version of this loco since they first were released and it is a pleasure. I have heard of the truck melting concern but even with a smaller id stack made for me by Torry Krutzke and a Summerlands chuffer installed I have never had a problem. It is absolutely mandatory (even if you add the heat shield) that the flame pops back into the boiler tube vs burning in the smoke box. I always light mine with the door open and it is easy to tell by visual and sound cues that the flame is in the proper location. You will be surprised at how well this loco runs at a very low burner setting, the safety valve rarely lifting.

Bob Weltyk recently posted a video of it running on his track on Mylargescale.com live steam forum under Michigan Backyard Live Steamers 2021. I have done a lot of personalization over the years and it is always a hit at the train shows at which I run. I hope you and your son enjoy this loco as much as I have.

Best, Tom

Hi Tom,

I’ve definitely heard all about your 2-cyl. Shay from Bob Weltyk :)! In fact, he sent me the video of your engine running at his meet a couple of weeks ago. Beautiful engine :). AND it sounds and runs great.

#22

Hey Gary,

I was wondering if you were going to get around to posting this cool story of your Shay adventures.

I don’t remember if I mentioned it to you but those dis-connects started life on the Port Orford Coast Railroad. As I mentioned in my email we were on the coast all week and had lunch with Dick and Helen on Friday. I was telling him that some of those log cars made it all the way to you and he thought that was fine.

Later buddy.

#23

Pete Thornton said:

The crews of yours and Jerry’s shays in the video must be ending their shift and in a hurry to get back to the barn. Speed demons!

Yeah. Ryan commented that the new trucks are a lower ratio, so the newer locos runs slower.

You can’t hear it on the video, but my ‘chuffer’ is audible if the burner is quiet, and with 8 or more chuffs per revolution of those small wheels it does sound interesting!

Pete,

Did Ryan comment if these new trucks (and couplings on driveshaft) would fit the 2-cyl. Shay?

#24

Did Ryan comment if these new trucks (and couplings on driveshaft) would fit the 2-cyl. Shay?

Ryan said: “Yes, you can interchange the two trucks between the models, or at least as far as I know you can. The mount and u joint size are all the same between the various styles of mich-cal 2 and 3 truck. However there could be some early ones that are different in line shaft/universal lengths, as there were at least two batches of both 2 and 3 cyl before the 28ton came about. YMMV.”

In other words, someone needs to try it on an early Shay with bad trucks. But I can’t see it being difficult to fix if the couplings and driveshafts are different, compared with the problems of making a new truck.

#25

Rick Marty said:

Hey Gary,

I was wondering if you were going to get around to posting this cool story of your Shay adventures.

I don’t remember if I mentioned it to you but those dis-connects started life on the Port Orford Coast Railroad. As I mentioned in my email we were on the coast all week and had lunch with Dick and Helen on Friday. I was telling him that some of those log cars made it all the way to you and he thought that was fine.

Later buddy.

Hey Rick,

That makes them even MORE special for Thomas and me. Ordered the new wheel sets from Jason this morning.

I had a long talk with Thomas tonight on the phone and the remodel on the old cabin is really "roarin"g now. Had a dozen workers over there today doing sand blasting on the old river rock stone fireplace (inside and outside), a few rooms downstairs getting brand new knotty pine paneling (the real stuff, not sheets of plywood) dismantling the old floor furnace (dating back to the mid thirties and prepping the kitchen for granite counter tops. The old place is probably wondering what happened after a hundred years!