Large Scale Central

Odd mining track switch

Prototypes
#1

I ran across this photo of the entrance to Sutro Tunnel (Dayton, NV), which I was able to visit last October. The track was mainly for hauling out dirt and hauling in men & timbers & etc. during the tunnel’s construction, and maintaining the tunnel after that.

The track switch caught my eye, and I can’t see how it worked. A 3-way stub of course, and it looks like the moving rails slid on some boards. I could easily be wrong, but the thing seems too short to bend the rails. Further back, there might be a pivot plate for the rails. But if so, how was that joint made? Can’t picture moving a loaded cart with the rails, like that vector-plate thing (I forget what those were called).

Any thoughts on how this worked?

Cliff

#2

Train Li sold a 3 way version of this, notice that there are a few “spreaders” to keep the gauge, in both this picture, and looks like one in your picture a ways away from the “stubs” themselves.

#3

Actually, they might have just unbolted the rails, pushed them over, and re-bolted…?

#4

Cliff,

I think Greg got it right. the rails being so small easily bent to the desired position, then a gauge plate, such as used on turntables to keep them in alignment would be placed between the rail ends.

Al P.

#5

Thanks Greg, I was looking at TL’s site earlier but couldn’t find this! I wonder if there’s a name for this style of switch? I looked around a bit, couldn’t find that either.

I agree, what I thought was a pivoting plate may have been a spreader, with another one near the stubs. And the far ends could have been loosely clamped to the incoming rails.

#6

Thanks Al, makes sense.

I’d guess though that the rails pivoted at their far ends, because though they’re small, I doubt they easily bent without (like regular stub switches) something like a harp stand. That’s also a long ways to bend rails, vs. a regular stub switch which involves a frog.

#7

Cliff, Train Li sold this 5 way and 3 way, then they only carried the 3 way, and now they don’t have it anymore… great space saver…

It came from Europe, someone still sells them, but I think you were more interested in how it worked as opposed to buying one right?

Greg

#8

I don’t think they bent the rails as much as moved them as needed.

(https://wnhpc.com/wnhpcphoto0183-m.jpg)

Image result for Sutro tunnel entrance

Too expensive to get so fancy…

Image result for Sutro tunnel entrance

Cliff see the mule behind the passenger car? Last pic

#9

Well, the rails bent as you moved the switch. Semantics.

#10

Be nice or…

Labor was cheaper than fancy switches. Nothing bent, rails lifted and replaced, they probably had lengths for each config.

4 wheel carts will bounce around sharp angle corners.

I have never seen a full size selector switch, I consider it a fake switch for toy trains.

#11

Greg Elmassian said:

Cliff, Train Li sold this 5 way and 3 way, then they only carried the 3 way, and now they don’t have it anymore… great space saver…

It came from Europe, someone still sells them, but I think you were more interested in how it worked as opposed to buying one right?

Greg

Thanks Greg, and right, just how it worked.

#12

John Caughey said:

Be nice or…

Labor was cheaper than fancy switches. Nothing bent, rails lifted and replaced, they probably had lengths for each config.

4 wheel carts will bounce around sharp angle corners.

I have never seen a full size selector switch, I consider it a fake switch for toy trains.

Ah, “selector.” I was thinking “vector,” but now I think TL or someone called them “sector.” Didn’t another John (on MLS) make something like that for his engine shed? But I haven’t seen a proto for it either.

#13

John Caughey said:

I don’t think they bent the rails as much as moved them as needed.

Too expensive to get so fancy…

Image result for Sutro tunnel entrance

Cliff see the mule behind the passenger car? Last pic

Great pics John, thanks for putting them up. Yep, I see the “mule,” though that one was pedal-powered I think, haha! I believe the pic was taken during initial construction, that is, before the portal was made (and therefore while they still used real mules for the tough work).

#14

Cliff Jennings said:

John Caughey said:

I don’t think they bent the rails as much as moved them as needed.

Too expensive to get so fancy…

Image result for Sutro tunnel entrance

Cliff see the mule behind the passenger car? Last pic

Great pics John, thanks for putting them up. Yep, I see the “mule,” though that one was pedal-powered I think, haha! I believe the pic was taken during initial construction, that is, before the portal was made (and therefore while they still used real mules for the tough work).

Cliff, I see a new model in your future … a pedal powered passenger car … I have popcorn and coke at the ready, let me know what time the show starts (http://www.largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-wink.gif)

#15

Cliff Jennings said:

I ran across this photo of the entrance to Sutro Tunnel (Dayton, NV), which I was able to visit last October. The track was mainly for hauling out dirt and hauling in men & timbers & etc. during the tunnel’s construction, and maintaining the tunnel after that.

The track switch caught my eye, and I can’t see how it worked. A 3-way stub of course, and it looks like the moving rails slid on some boards. I could easily be wrong, but the thing seems too short to bend the rails. Further back, there might be a pivot plate for the rails. But if so, how was that joint made? Can’t picture moving a loaded cart with the rails, like that vector-plate thing (I forget what those were called).

Any thoughts on how this worked?

Cliff

A kind of rough “Sector Plate”?

Pivot at end nearest tunnel mouth moved by moving the boards.

They are popular in the smaller scales as space savers especially with shelf layouts aka “planks” in UK.

http://www.carendt.com/micro-layout-design-gallery/layouts-using-sector-plates/

#16

Found the picture of the Train-Li 3 way sector/stub switch:

#17

Greg, thanks for posting that. In the 5-way, it looked like the moving rails were loosely joined to the incoming track, with enough length to not make the loco jump. In the 3-way though, which seems shorter, those rails sure look curved. Very interesting.

In this Sutro situation, I’m inclined to agree with John, in that they weren’t bending the rails for switching, due to short rail length, lack of harp stand or other means of bending leverage, and the general sloppiness / temporary nature of the track used on this site. But, analogous to that 5-way sector switch you showed Greg, it looks like they used those spreaders between the rails in at least two positions, and just let them slide over, not worrying about the bump at the change of angle.

Thanks guys for helping me think this thing through. I have a couple of friends working on this site’s restoration. They’ve got rail lying around everywhere, but it’s been torn up for decades, so they’re happy to gain any further insights on how the track was laid out. When I saw this photo, I wanted to forward it to them with a brief bit of opinion on how the thing might have worked. So thanks Greg, John and Al, much appreciated.

#18

Cliff Jennings said:

Thanks guys for helping me think this thing through. I have a couple of friends working on this site’s restoration. They’ve got rail lying around everywhere

Look hard at the rail and see if it’s stamped…guessing 80lb rail or less.

#19

(https://www.largescalecentral.com/albums/photo/view/album_id/11669/photo_id/102231)Train-i's 5 way switch

#20

Not made any more at least that I can see. There are somevGetmsn and Swiss that made all manner of tracks so it is possible.

Thought this was neat device.