Large Scale Central

New Bachmann Shay Prototype?

Prototypes
#1

Yes. I know it’s basically a modified two truck Shay. Skip that bit.

I’ve been playing with www.shaylocomotives.com trying to find a prototype 36" gauge 3 truck shay with a similar cab and bunker.

I’m not having much luck.

Of particular note to me is that 1.) The cab on this particular model does not attach to the short bunker with a frame for a door (like the Heisler did) but the cab and bunker are seperate entities. 2.) The second (Center) truck is placed oddly, in that most of the Class C’s I’ve seen have the front journal about even with the steps to the cab (and in fact many have a step on the truck because of this) … on this model, the truck is shifted back somewhat. 3.) The rear bunker seems a bit off balance… having a lot more box ahead of the wheels than behind, with a long drawbar. Of course you could shorten the drawbar some (and, I guess the siphon pipe) but you’d have to shorten the driveline too…

Anyway before I start coming up with a list of mods for an engine I haven’t even really been able to plan for yet, I thought I’d ask… is there a prototype (preferably with a photo that can be easily looked at) that has all the features this model does, or are these conventions of curve friendliness, and re-use of current parts?

Note that I’m not being critical of Bachmann at all here… but would love to have a photo for comparison and detail purposes if a prototype actually exists.

Matthew (OV)

#2

REally Matt, there are no hard fast rules regarding Shays. The majority of them were custom builds, buit for the customers specific criteria, very few were ‘built for stock’. Coupled with the fact there are overall not a lot of good detailed pictures for alll of them. The Bmann model is a smallerish type critter, But from what I have seen is pretty true to general Shay practice. You are talking about a steel all wether cab vs a seperate cab and bunker…there are a lot of those out there…check out Cass sometime…and cabs were pretty muchexpendable…Cass No5 is rumored to have a steel cab for a scrapped out 4 Truck C&O Shay twice her size. Many of the C class Shays had the No2 truck offset to the rear a bit…Hard to go wrong in Shay Modeling…'Cept not to model at all!

#3

Ok, I’ll buy that nearly no two alike… But, take a look at this, recently released by B’mann:

Looks to me like it’d be a lot more comfortable if you shifted the third truck’s bunker frame to where it touched (or nearly so) the rear of the main frame, and shifted the second truck the same distance forward. Between the drive line changes and moving the bolster, this is probably impossible I know… but it looks … well, off balance. I just wondered if anyone knew of a 1:1 shay with a long drawbar and truck spacing like that… As to the all weather cab… now, there’s an idea. A good idea… and a bit out of my reach, for now! Maybe like Cass, someday it’ll have to be changed… :slight_smile: Matt

#4

For some odd reason it looks to me to be out of balance. Like the rear larger tender should be directly behind the cab and the frame extended a bit to hold it and the smaller tender moved back over the last truck.

I don’t doubt someone would do a bash that way…:wink:

#5

As an addendum… I found this:

http://www.shaylocomotives.com/data/lima2399/sn-1593.htm Pretty close if you shorten up the drawbar… the rear truck on the model is still a bit far aft, but not so much that it’s unreasonable. Note that that’s a 55-C even if the gauge is 1’8.5" too wide. So… with the usual drawbar shortening you find on most locomotives, maybe this one DOES work after all. Matthew (OV)

#6

Yeah there are a lot of them like that, and especially the ones with the third truck displaced waaaaay to the rear of the tank frame… The space between the frames is to allow for curvature ya know…even on the 1:1 jobs. Then there are the Shays with a huge space between the front truck adn the engine…then a short distance to the middle truck…then a moderate distance to the rear truck…Just how it is…and Unbalanced??? Well yeah a Shay is the epitome of unbalnced…

#7

#8

Here is a drawing of West Side Lumbers #15

While the center truck is as you mentioned aligned with the cab step, note that the spacing between the center truck and the cylinder assembly is very close and that the cylinder assembly sits farther forward which reduces the spacing between them and the front truck. These short spacings would require short couplings between them which would mean when the drive line is on the outside of one of our rather sharp scale curves that the slip joints would come out of their sockets. Been there, done that. This photo doesn’t show it well but I shortened the coupling between the cylinders and front truck on this one and as a result it will not do anything less than a 4 1/2’ radius curve or smaller than a #4 switch.

Note also that he tender tank is not centered on the rear truck and looks unbalanced and is also close coupled. I agree with Bart that it is that way to allow operation on typical model curves and yes, like most tender to loco couplings in this scale it would look better coupled closer and can be if your trackwork will allow. The front truck on #15 is also mounted closer to the pilot, another case of more clearance on the model for tight model curves.