Large Scale Central

New Aristo steam sounds

General Discussion
#21

Dear All,

Small speakers (and small speaker boxes) are limited to higher frequencies.

The human ear wants to hear lows, too, to balance it out:

Lowest freq. (Hz) X Highest freq. (Hz) = 400,000 (Hz squared)

20 20,000
40 10,000
80 5,000
160 2,500 This is near the telephone frequency range, which is not tiring to your ears.

Your ears tire from the high frequency TSSS, TSSS, TSSS of the chuff, so you reach to turn the volume down, or the switch to turn it off.

Low frequency sound sources are hard to pinpoint with your ears, so you could put a woofer or sub-woofer under your train table.

You would then have to transmit the bass signal from each loco to it. (Multi-channel radio?)

I’m guessing a system like that has already been invented.

Another thing that bugs my ears: Horn speakers in PA systems.

They are efficient, but have a nasty spike at a single frequency (from the horn’s shape and size).

Rant off.

Hope this helps.

Sincerely,

Joe Satnik

#22

I don’t know why people deliberately spread misinformation about the price. (I’m saying this because this is not the first time I have had to confront a particular person on this exact issue on an open forum)

in a 6 pack, the street price of the older revolutions was about 65 bucks, they are now about 85 … that is NOT a 5 dollar increase. 85 - 65 is $20…

I found a trainworld listing for $402 for a 6 pack of the old style… RLD has the new ones for $510

By the way, $20 is about a 33% price increase.

Not saying it’s not worth the extra 1/3 price increase, but it’s a flat out lie that it’s only a $5 increase, it’s $20.

Greg

#23

I bought a set of 6 of the old style on March 30th of this year. I tried to order from Trainworld as they had the lowest price listed ($439). They didn’t have any, but said they could order them but that was the old price and the new one was about $480. I ended up ordering from Robby because he had them in-stock for ~$470. The next day Aristo changed their prices and I think the price dropped about $20. So I’d say going from $75 to $85 for pretty good sound is more than worth it.

#24

Sound is not always enjoyed by everyone. There are some of us that find that there is a very fine line between sound/music, and noise.

When you have a problem, it usually is caused by the volume, at which some people set their sound at. When it is set too high, for some, it becomes initating noise.

Another problem is contiuous repitition, of a noise. Hearing is a personal thing. Not everyone appreciates some of the noises coming from the systems available today, not because they are trying to cause trouble, but because they cause pain. Old age is sometimes a factor in hearing, and everyone gets there sooner or later. So; please, set your sound systems to a level, that takes into consideration, the pain it can inflict on others.

#25

Jon:

Robby’s price is $510, just looked at it on his web site… http://rldhobbies.com/crestelectronics.aspx

seriously, prices for stuff when it’s not available for sale mean nothing

I gave examples on what the old stuff actually sold for and what the new stuff is actually selling for now.

… and Aristo jacked prices just before the new product came out… so that’s a bit of a smoke screen.

Fred:

Cannot agree more… was discussing this am exactly what you are stating. I found that the same “track” repeating over and over, and with a monotonous sound level became obnoxious. I had adjustable “mute” volume on my units, the new ones have a continuously variable remote volume.

Greg

#26
Fred Mills said:
...So; please, set your sound systems to a level, that takes into consideration, the pain it can inflict on others.
I have to laugh a bit at this...Probably the real reason I will never buy a Poenix sound system...My computer has a pretty decent set of speakers and a small amp. Do you know what happens when the Phoenix site loads up in your browser? I hate sites that do that, my ears bled for a week! :D
#27

Just think…what about just going out to hear a good bit of entertainment these days…it seems that “The Louder The Better” is the trend. I seldom if ever go to an outdoor concert, especially if I see them setting up giant speakers…my frail ears couldn’t take it…and they call that being entertained…egads

I’m buying shares in a hearing aid company, and fast…

#28
Fred Mills said:
Just think....what about just going out to hear a good bit of entertainment these days.....it seems that "The Louder The Better" is the trend. I seldom if ever go to an outdoor concert, especially if I see them setting up giant speakers.....my frail ears couldn't take it....and they call that being entertained.....egads

I’m buying shares in a hearing aid company, and fast…


Padre, you’d be wasting your money. Invest in ear plugs instead. :lol:

#29

I bought one of the receivers with generic diesel sounds. In my train workshop it sounded better than any of the videos I have watched, although it was too loud even at the lowest setting. My shop is only 10 x 13 feet.

On Tuesday, the diesel and receiver were sold to the owner of the Freight House Restaurant in Ogdensburg. It sounded better there on the overhead railway, but was too loud except at the lowest volume. Even Fred, who is deaf from years of working printing presses, found it too loud at the medium or high setting.

I missed not being able to control the horn and bell manually. I understand this may be a future improvement along with volume control, but I certainly do not expect those changes by the next delivery that may occur in late February.

I also bought the receiver with generic steam sounds, but have not received it yet. I bought the magnet as well, as I could not tell from the video whether or not it made for a more believable chuff rate. I assume it will sound like the receiver we heard at the ECLSTS a year and half ago. It was too loud, but sounded better than the video. The chuff in the video sounds like the old Pacific sound card: bang, bang, bang instead of chuff, chuff, chuff. The whistle also sounds screechy like the PRR sound bite at Phoenix Sound.

http://www.phoenixsound.com/library/am_steam/prr.htm

As a Pacific was used to demonstrate the sound, I wonder if the old style speaker that came with the vintage Pacifics was used. I just restored a 1994 Pacific, and the speaker in it was not of good quality. I removed it when I installed battery power and radio control, but left room for a better speaker.

When I receive the receiver with steams sounds, I will see if I can put together a video review of it. It’s snowing here so I won’t be able to run it on our club railway, but I may set it up on a test stand outside.

I think these receivers with sound will sell well to the technophobic. Although they are many competent modelers on this forum, you have to remember that Aristo-Craft could not sell their simple buildings as kits. But a lot of garden railroaders were willing to pay twice the price to buy them ready built and plop them on their layouts.

#30
Fred Mills said:
Sound is not always enjoyed by everyone. There are some of us that find that there is a very fine line between sound/music, and noise.

When you have a problem, it usually is caused by the volume, at which some people set their sound at. When it is set too high, for some, it becomes initating noise.

Another problem is contiuous repitition, of a noise. Hearing is a personal thing. Not everyone appreciates some of the noises coming from the systems available today, not because they are trying to cause trouble, but because they cause pain. Old age is sometimes a factor in hearing, and everyone gets there sooner or later. So; please, set your sound systems to a level, that takes into consideration, the pain it can inflict on others.


I could not agree with you more Fred. You would never hear the snow falling on my last video if I ran a sound unit. I enjoy the sound of falling snow much better (shut up Rooster) Why buy a sound system when you can get a live steam train that has a much more soothing sound.

#31
Tim Brien said:
The voice over sounds like the British academic Stephen Hawkins.
You mean Stephen Hawking's voice synthesizer.

tac

#32
Shawn said:
I could not agree with you more Fred. You would never hear the snow falling on my last video if I ran a sound unit. I enjoy the sound of falling snow much better (shut up Rooster) Why buy a sound system when you can get a live steam train that has a much more soothing sound.
Hmmmm .... how about a muffled train whistle in the mountains while the snow is falling in big fat flakes? Hard to beat that with silence.

@ Rooster Doubt that you can hear snow falling? The other day, as I was driving through the rain going up the mountain, the rain turned to snow and it sure made a distinct noise as it hit the windshield.

#33

TONY, I find your comments about your competition not only inaccurate, But TOTALLY OFFENSIVE. This is a user forum to exchange ideas and experiences, not the place to promote your products by attempting to mislead members about your competition. You do not see others knocking your products here. It is called professionalism.

#34
thomas prevost said:
TONY, I find your comments about your competition not only inaccurate, But TOTALLY OFFENSIVE. This is a user forum to exchange ideas and experiences, not the place to promote your products by attempting to mislead members about your competition. You do not see others knocking your products here. It is called professionalism.
Why are you offended??? The comments weren't directed at you... or were they?

Hmmmmmmm.

Ventilator, anyone?

#35

Thomas.
I did not knock the product. I don’t make sound systems. I merely commented on the way it is being marketed. So precisely where have I been misleading?
After all, why would I be worried about a PRICE RISE of a competitors product? That can only be a good thing for me.

#36

No more ventilator comments, eh? That’s all part of the ‘be nice’…

#37

The part I find confusing from a business sense is that while not all operators favour sound, the addition of sound is a compulsory ‘option’. Thus one has to fork out for a new receiver, complete with optional sound and then turn it off. For a company reigning in costs, this seems a strange business model. Others have commented how it is a simple operation to ‘download’ the sound files to the receiver, so why not make the supposedly optional sound available at point of sale?

The Revolution receiver has received very high praise from its users, but I am sure that not all will be happy with the quality of the optional sound included at additional cost. This unnecessarily drives up the price of the item in relation to its competitors. If one wants a generic sound for minimal cost then no doubt this setup is ideal, but many operators are very choosy when it comes to sound quality and this is a sound that will not appeal to this end of the market as firstly, it is non type specific and secondly the operator has no control over it. The file as heard also shows the file originator has little knowledge of railroad standard practice or just views the file as a very basic setup just to appease the masses.

I find it hard to believe that two years development time and the sound is basically the same quality as initially heard. If included free of charge then no argument, but the consumer is paying for the option of being able to turn off something not wanted in the first instance. However, we have been down this road before. Look to the USA Trains die-cast switcher with onboard sound files. I have not heard a favourable comment on the sound quality of this very expensive locomotive.

#38
tac said:
Tim Brien said:
The voice over sounds like the British academic Stephen Hawkins.
You mean Stephen Hawking's voice synthesizer.

tac


Terry,
perhaps the synthesiser comes from the same factory as the steam sound files.

#39
Tim Brien said:
The part I find confusing from a business sense is that while not all operators favour sound, the addition of sound is a compulsory 'option'. Thus one has to fork out for a new receiver, complete with optional sound and then turn it off. For a company reigning in costs, this seems a strange business model...
From a business point of view it actually makes a lot of sense. The car industry learned a long time ago that narrowing the number of options, while 'packaging' many popular ones keeps part cost down and profits up. I think Aristo feels stocking two receivers where one will do makes good sense. One production run, one stock number, no running out of one while having a surplus of another.

As an operator, you don’t have to ‘turn it off’ because it does not come with a speaker.

Speculation on my part, but it is a common practice.

#40

Mark,
the retailer is not required to stock both sound and non-sound receivers. Several have commented on the apparent ease of downloading the sound file to the receiver board, so if sound was required the seller would uplift the file for the additional cost.

    The additional cost of sound could have been simply incorporated in a manufacturer price hike, thus the sound feature would be at 'no additional cost' and thus a 'bargain' (and beyond criticism).  To raise the price to include the compulsory sound feature is a turn off for me. If you pay for it or are expected to do so then you reserve the right to criticise the feature.