Large Scale Central

Letting the kids run your trains

General Discussion
#1

I was reporting on the York Show in the Conventions, Shows and Clubs area and Fred made a statement.

“Thanks for posting the pics Ric - it was “nice” of you to let “the kids” operate the Timesaver.”

Noel Widdfield and I have been working on an article about this on another site. We talked about it at Perry with the idea we would take more pictures at York. I’d like your input and if its something that might be usable I might include part of it in the article.

I replied to Fred’s posting with this -

"You are going to see a few of us beating the drum about this on this site and others. You can’t imagine the smile you can put on a little kid’s face by just letting him push the button to blow the whistle. What harm is it to let a child bring a train into a station or position the water hatch under the spout of a water tank? These kids are the future of the hobby, but if all we do is allow them to look and never touch, they’ll go play with a video game or something else instead of trains.

The kids say they have fun running the trains, but I have more fun than they do by showing them how its done. We use a regular HO transformer with the Train Engineer for the switching layout and turn the throttle down to 50%. We 've never had equipment damaged and we’ve made a lot of smiles."

To that John R. replied -

“Ric I think that was the only thing
anyone could touch and I agree with you the
kids catch on fast. But it made their mom and dads
think they were old enough to play with them too”

So now you are up to date on the discussion. Actually, one of the clubs did have a small circle of tracks that the kids could work the throttle on, but the thought pattern is “why don’t we let the kids blow the whistle, bring a train into a station or start it up prototypically”?

Are we that selfish that we won’t share our fun? Do you think the kids are going to break something? I’ve seen a lot of old men do that, by falling asleep while they are suppose to be watching the throttle or slamming it all to a halt causing massive derailments.

Could I get your guys opinions and then have a discussion on this? Thank You.

#2

Whenever we setup at shows, I usually try to have my R/C locomotives there so the kids (and wives) can do just that. I’ve put the throttle in mama-san’s hands and told her how to operate it, and then watched the smile grow. She and husband walkaway, with her usually saying something like, "Now I know why you enjoy it so much. Lets build a layout in the…

The smiles that the kids get are to die for!

#3

Steve,

Thanks for offering input. I have seen a large scale club set up with a very enjoyable layout on the floor. It gathers the kids like crazy to sit on the floor and watch it. But the operators sit across the layout and put themselves in a position, so nobody can talk to them. I guess they enjoy running their trains, but I feel they portray an attitude that they should not be bothered and don’t want to talk to anyone. I don’t think they promote the hobby. I doubt if they even care what my opinion is. That’s fine.

#4

heres my response…saw it on MLS first

I began my venture with my kids in mind and that is why I did the HLW Mack for Luke’s Bday…A different Mack for the Christmas Tree with LGB cars…

As bad as I want a Connie and Shay…I will forgo that to buy stuff the kids can play with…there is plenty of time for me to play later…

Actually I think I have decided to have 2 different scales on the RR…Fn3 for me (when/where I can afford) and 1:2X something for the boys and now gurl!

cale

I think it’d suck to have a cool train in my yard and not be able to play with it, 'cause daddy said not to touch!

…there should be boundaries and I think its a good way to teach those to the kids, but don’t block it off completely…they’ll go inside and watch the Wiggles or something else stupid…

#5

I belong to the same club that Steve Featherkile does and unfortunately most of the club members prefer to isolate themselves from the public. I tried to get them to operate outside the layout so they could be more in contact with the public, but failed. :frowning: They just prefer the wall. We also have one member that goes absolutely ballistic if a kid gets too close to any of his trains. When the majority of the club is a bunch of old geezers it becomes more of a brag session rather than promoting the hobby. :frowning: I’ve been watching when we were at shows and have found that all kids love trains. The girls are in fact more intensely interested than most boys. The boys like them and will watch, but when the parents say it’s time to go, they go. But the girls will get so into them that they have to be dragged off kicking and screaming. I’ve seen this happen on several occasions. I do have a small portable layout of my own that I take to shows. I still need to get it RC equipped so I can let kids of all ages run the trains.

#6

My grandson Aaron (age two, going on three) comes to visit every Friday. First thing, he heads for the “train room.” Of course he runs the trains, and I wouldn’t have it any other way! The smiles on our faces (his and mine) tell all…

He’s an old hand at this by now, aligning the routes carefully and handling the remote with aplomb. I have no doubt at all that he will grow gracefully into this hobby. But then, we started “training” him on proper operating procedures very early in his career:

A few broken handrails, easily fixed, is a very small price to pay for this much joy… Dawg :cool:

#7

Well, when my 6yo daughter comes over, the first thing she does is chuck all the accumulated mail off the layout and start up the train.

When the 14YO daughter was in preschool, we went in with the trains one day, set up a couple loops, had a short presentation with question and answer time, then let all the kids take turns playing with them for a couple hours.----By the time the 6YO got to preschool you had to have child abuse clearances to go in like that (which cost more than I was willing to pay for 1 day), so we didn’t.

BTW: IMO the ABSOLUTE best train item for a public show (even better than Thomas) is the Lehmann bubble car…It brings a great big smile to just about everybody’s face (Except maybe those grouchy old “serious” train modellers)

#8

One of the reasons I chose the system I did 15+ years ago, was I knew I’d have the technically inept running at the railroad I envisaged.
That, and the fact that I am more than technically adept, but don’t want to have to mess with technology when supposedly running trains to have “fun”.

A side bonus has been kids.
I thought the 3 year old who lived behind us was amazing, at 3-1/2 he was doing wayfreights.

But last year, a fellow in our Church got his reserve unit called to Iraq, so one day we asked his wife and 3 kids to come over.
The little one was 2, Binky stuck in his face, we dragged out the Delton Doozie, turned it on, showed him how to make it “go” and more importantly, “stop”.
He ran non-stop for two hours. Couldn’t pry the controller out of his hands.
You should have seen the look on his face when, after an hour, we showed him how to blow the horn.

My only issue is they seem to think my 27’ long trestle is a “Jungle Jim”.

Due to certain limitations I have developed, I have become somewhat of a hermit, as far as going places (done my last Garden Railway Convention at Sacramento) but we are open to run every first and third Fridays, sometimes going on for 8 hours+.

TOC

#9

Last month our local club had a swap meet at a historic depot, and the guy who organized it brought out a portable On30 “Inglenook Siding” layout. Anyone could try it, and the kids loved it.

Once I get my layout running, I want the grandkids to be able to play with it as much as possible whenever they are here. I’m not too concerned about the rolling stock yet since I don’t have much and what I have is all pretty cheap stuff and nothing scratchbuilt yet. Later on, I can always keep the cheap and durable stuff around for the kids, and run the more fragile/expensive items myself.

A bigger concern for me is the fragility of trestles, bridges and structures – especially since the space limitations of my layout makes it impossible to keep these out of reach. And I like doing finely detailed scratchbuilt structures. So I’ll just have to teach the kids to be careful, and steel myself for the occasional “oops”.

I can also keep a small temporary layout of sectional track on the patio so even the youngest can “play trains” without risk to the structures on the permanent layout.

#10

To quote myself over in the “ECLSTS Party Report” thread…

Jon Radder said:
Ric's expanded Timesaver + Inglenook layout looked great. Give him a couple of years and he'll fill the entire alcove with a point-to-point railroad in modules. One thing very different about Ric's layout is that it is close to the ground. Children can see what is going on and it is the only layout in the hall where a child can take the control and run "the job". By the smiles on their faces, and the amount of time they stuck with it, it's easy to see that if introduced properly, children enjoy operations as much or more than roundy-round. JR
The point I was trying to make above is how simple operations seem to keep a kid's interest much longer than just having speed control of a train going in circles. Even on a circular layout having some flats with "stuff" to load on and off and places to pick up and deliver the "Stuff" can give many hours of enjoyment to a youngster.

So yes, let kids run your layouts - but give them something to do besides just start and stop the train and they will stick with it.

JR

#11

Jon,

My point on letting the kids start and stop the trains is just something that could be done on any layout, even the ones that we saw at York. I’m not asking people to rebuild their layouts so kids can run them. Just let the kids run the layout that is already built. The GGRC modular layout has a two track mainline going in either direction. I occasionally disrupt the mind numbing roundy-rounds by doing some switching with a battery operated radio controlled engine, and forcing someone to remove themselves from the self-induced trance they are in, to change the setting on a throttle at the control stands. I have pictures of four guys sitting by the throttles and all four of them asleep. You can ask Andy C., some days it gets pretty amusing. I’ve been told the train show is a pretty great place to catch a nap without the wife yelling at you. :wink:

We are going to try to get the kids at train shows more involved, but I think most of the guys will just step back and not get involved, themselves. We’ll see. The idea actually got a pretty good reception when brought up at a recent meeting.

#12

I guess I wasn’t clear -

Your method does get the kids much more involved than just stop and start. They have to change directions, hook on (couple) and listen for direction from the conductor. They are definitely involved and part of the action, far more than just handling a speed control.

I guess what I am trying to say is it takes more than saying “here kid, you wanna run the train?”

Jon

#13

I won’t let the ““old guys”” run my trains anymore… As Ric mentioned, they fall asleep at the controls…

The kids are amazed when you ask, “want to run the train??” The parents sometimes go into shock… It’s amazing…

It takes just a bit of explaining the train engineer functions to them, and paying attention to them to see if they comprehended the buttons… You also have to refresh their memory at times, that this is not a video game controller… Ric has been trying to install in them, one hand to hold the controller and one hand to push the buttons… Works great, once you tie up that one hand holding the controller, takes both thumbs out of action…

The thing about working with Ric on the Timesaver is the enjoyment the kids have operating the layout… Once they get somewhat proficient on the controls, then you can tell where the cars go, and kind of watch they do it…

The Amusing part of the club layout at the shows now, is watching the guys fall asleep, while monitoring the layout… A totally different atmosphere from working with the timesaver with Ric…

#14

I live on main street in a small touristy town. We have lots of street walkers(not that kind) that love my layout around our Victorian home. Whenever I can, I let the children and sometimes adults use the RCS remote. Sometimes I link two transmitter to the same engine to have a emergency stop. I tell them a little about the engines and what I’ve built. I also ask where should the track go next. You can really see the gears get going then. I want the kids to like the railroad so when they are teens they don’t trash it.

#15

I don’t call her my JRVP fer nuttin…this is from October of 1998…gosh just a little over 2 y/o and she was running trains then…most of the train running I’ve done since, she’s been a part of!

Geeze guys, y’all watched her grow up…does this make anyone but me feel OLD???

#16

Ric, I think it’s great that you would let the kids have some fun with the trains. One of the things I’ve done since starting my new job at the school is run an HO scale train club. I didn’t think it would generate any interest but on the first night we had so many kids show up I had to split the club into two clubs! We even hosted our own train show this February with a good turnout even though the weather was terrible. I have a couple of threads going on another web site but don’t think I should post them here.

Jon.

#17

Last Year I was running the club layout by myself at a local trains show. Many of the members of the club don’t want the kids to run the trains or get too close. The phrase of " Please don’t touch", although appropiate at times, tends to be used too much in my opinion.
Any way, my 10 year old nephew and his younger sisters came to the show and wanted to run the trains. I let them, but, told them to keep it under the 70 mark printed on the transformers. Before I could stop him, he was running all over the show telling kids to come and run the trains at the G scale layout.
I had a line that stretched clear around the layout which was about 20X40.
What I thought could have been a disaster ended up being the most fun I have had at any show.
There was not one derailment while the kids were running trains. The smiles on everyones faces were as big as their faces would allow.
I just thought I would pass this on. It really worked well.
David

#18

Dave and All,

That is the type of thing I’m talking about. If you don’t want the kids to touch or like with Live Steam, its dangerous. You need to keep the people of all ages away. But what I’m talking about is giving the kids and adults that are not already involved in the hobby, a chance to control a train.

The scenario would go something like. Your passenger train is at the station on the outside track. Slowly take it out of the staion up to notch 5. Don’t go above that. As the train goes around the display layout you tell the operator to pay attention to what the club members are telling you to do. Now as you approach the water tower slowly bring the train to a stop, so the water hatch is right under the spout. Stop there for one minute. Now slowly pull up to the station platform to allow the loading and unloading of passengers. Maybe you could present them with a simple certificate of completion and, of course, have club membership information on the bottom of the form.

All opinions are welcome and quite valid. This may turn into a nightmare, where you later on have to constantly tell people, “Sorry this didn’t work out and we can’t let you do this anymore.”

That’s why I asked the question. It works for me with my switching layout, but I want to make sure it is okay for our club layout before I get us in a nightmare situation.

Otherwise we can continue to just have old men fall asleep at the transformers and continue on as we have for years.

#19

I think we are stuck with the old men here in Spokane. We can’t even get younger adults interested. They can’t hear the “sales pitch” over the snoring. :frowning:

#20
Ric Golding said:
... This may turn into a nightmare, where you later on have to constantly tell people, "Sorry this didn't work out and we can't let you do this anymore."
Years ago, we did allow the small fry to run Thomas at shows; we used an egg timer (sand glass) to allot time shares. The small fry loved it (they liked watching the egg timer, too). Unfortunately, it became a shoving match when slightly older kids joined the line -- no parents in sight. And then there was the mother who loudly insisted I was being unfair to little Johnnie by telling him his time was up (he'd had a double share, as it was, and was holding up the line, and I won't repeat the words she used). After one particularly strenuous occasion, sadly involving an under-supervised and over-enthusiastic Cub pack, my wife and I got tired of being cast as bad cop. No more young drivers. However, we do allow the small kids to touch -- most of them are very gentle, and we've had very little damage, none lasting -- and we slow or stop the trains for Papa or Mama to take photos with Johnnie (or, increasingly, Janie). And we talk to anyone. Now that I have a double-track show layout, I am thinking of buying an Aristo Basic TE, and letting younger children have a go on one line. We still have the egg timer somewhere. For one reason or another, we don't get out to as many shows as I would like, but that's another story.