Large Scale Central

Large Scale marketplace? What works?

General Discussion
#1

In context of the previous posting can Large Scale increase its market share: Are there successes in the unexpected marketing of large scale locos/rolling stock/track/starter-sets?

My long-time marketing suggestion has been selling large scale as “garden enhancements” via Home Depot, Costco, Loews, and nurseries. Trains do animate a yard – especially at night with passenger livery. How persuasive is “SEEING” Large Scale in a garden setting? Surely, any effort in those venues would include garden photos showing large scale in action – and at least a starter set on display even if static.

However, considering the numbers of open houses offered throughout the Los Angeles and San Diego counties by the four active Large Scale clubs, of what significance has there been in non-owner visitors returning to their homes ready to buy and build?
My guess is that influence has yet to be measured. Same for Garden Railways magazine as an instigator of users or is the magazine mainly a destination outcome for current enthusiasts?

Have any of you had experience with a non-RR or hobby shop venue being successful in selling large scale?

Wendell

#2

Sam’s Club and Target have both marketed large scale trains at Christmas time. Unfortunately, The units they have sold are Bachman sets with rail that can’t be used outdoors for any time, and the battery powered Lionel Polar Express trains which use plastic track. Although they might be fine for around the Christmas tree, they probably won’t encourage very many to establish outdoor layouts.

Jim Carter

#3

Jim-
Your conclusion makes sense. The Christmas tree train image is one still activated on at Christmas time. Now, how long the train at Christmas will last --who knows.
As to application to “animate” homeowner’s yards photos would be needed showing how the train can be “kept up” all year 'round – in the garden.
Wendell

#4

Wendell,

You said - “Have any of you had experience with a non-RR or hobby shop venue being successful in selling large scale?”

I think Watt’s, St. Aubin’s and Kidman’s have done very well in the nursery business, plus the Christmas store business. Is that what you were asking?

#5

Wendell,
an example of the difficulty in expanding the market is my city. Sydney, Australia is a city of nearly four million people. In this vast city which is considered by many to be one of the largest cities in the world, in so far as the area that the city occupies, there is one largescale dealer retailing new product (Bachmann, Aristo-Craft, USA Trains) and this business happens to be the distributor for Australia. If one wished to purchase new Marklin/LGB items, then the nearest retailer is also the Australian brandname distributor, located about two hours drive south of Sydney.

        How is the hobby to survive when the only relatively convenient outlet is the internet?  In fairness,  'O' scale is also similarly disadvantaged and considered to be a 'specialist' scale.  Other popular scales, such as 'N' and 'h.o.' are relatively well supported and thrive.  The only railroad hobby exhibition in Sydney happens once a year only and largescale exhibits are generally only one or two layouts per exhibition and they are fairly simple layouts designed to impress children.  The scale is indeed very poorly supported,  both by the public and by the retail sector.  Other east-coast capital cities, Melbourne and Brisbane are perhaps a little better consumer/retailer supported than my city.  I sell 'used' LGB largescale items every now and then on eBay and the bulk of the sales are to either Melbourne or Brisbane.  Very few sales (basically none) occur within my geographic region.  My state is the most densely populated in Australia and yet a retailer of largescale products would have a hard task making a living from retail sales.  I doubt that there would be more than 1000 people in Australia 'involved' in the hobby (population around 30 million) and perhaps only about two hundred in total who 'regularly' purchase items (say several pieces per year).

         The Christmas train idea has never been locally supported,  but who knows,  with the increase in popularity of Halloween,  trains around the tree may become a reality, but I will not be holding my breath waiting.   A local very large 'hypermarket' shopping centre,  many years ago (back in the 1990's) put in an overhead Christmas railroad (non-LGB) through part of the store,  maintained by a local hobby shop.  Apparently,  the required upkeep was immense and the overhead rail (raised about four to five metres) was cleaned everyday,  as the trains kept stalling due dirty railhead.  The display occurred one year only and was most likely considered a disaster by many.
#6

Ric,
You are accurate, all noted have a nursery business. However, a nursery with trains to “animate” the garden exclusively, without a marketing effort to sell via mail order business, was the example I was asking for e.g. imagine a Home Depot garden department with such a feature, etc.
Wendell

#7

I think the two biggest problems is:
1 - price of large scale. You really have to be into a hobby like this to really commit. Most people who see my layout love it and say I would love to do something like that. I try to lead them into the right direction to get started but it never goes beyond that. The reason is they just dont have that passion for trains like we do.
The second reason is time. The average American does not have the time to maintain a garden RR. Thats why the landscape business does so well. At least in my area. The average person in my area leaves for work 5-6Am and does not return home until 6-7 at night.
ONe could probably add a thrid reason, technology. I cant believe how many people today spend their free time on the computer or playing video games.

Advertising with displays at Lowes etc… would be a big seller but I think most people that tried to do their own layout because of what they saw wouls loose intrest within a year. It would be like the train around the tree. AFter a few years it looses its novelty. I think it would attract a few new people but most would loose that intrest.

#8

Two comments … We have an annual open house for the public, and this event gains us new members every year.

As to Garden Railways Magazine, getting a free trial issue got me started in the hobby (converted from indoor N-scale).

#9

I have had quite a bit of experience in this field and have seen the successes and the failures.
Maritime Hobby in Halifax, Nova Scotia is the largest hobby shop in a province of 6 million people. They carry a little of everything, crafts, puzzles, Ho, N, and radio control items. An optometrist in the area wanted to get into large scale and placed an $8,000 order for LGB track etc. The store still has a lot of G scale products but they sit on a shelf in their boxes and as a result it does not sell well.
Machan Home Hardware in Goderich Ont. is owned by a man that is a G scale hobbyist. Home Hardware is a franchise that allows the franchisee to set aside a portion of the store to sell a product line of their own. Steve Machan set up a table top display with Piko buildings and an overhead track. Both had trains running from the start and end of the day. Within 5 years there were two large scale clubs in the area and a number of people that had layouts in their front yard. Sales are always good, mainly due to the instore displays.
Westside Nurseries in Owen Sound, Ont. had a large scale club put up a display for the Xmas season. It sat on a 8x16’ table. Club members had two trains running and decorated with dioramas including buildings and figures. It ran for 5 weeks. After being removed the customers missed the trains and prompted the owners to sell G scale. One year later they now carry a line of LGB trains and had to increase the number of dwarf plants and types of small thyme plants.
These are only two examples, but I have seen many more. What I am saying is that G scale sells well as long as there is an example as to what it really looks like with regard to size. Once someone sees what they look like, especially if the engine is equipped w/sound, they are bitten with the large scale bug.
Regards, Dennis.

#10

I would think one major issue with a big box store doing this would be the lack of a knowledgeable person to answer questions. Short of hiring or getting a club to supply volunteers to answer questions I’m not sure it would do all that well. It’s hard enough at Lowe’s or Home Despot to find someone who is knowledgeable on their base products let alone something as exotic as large scale trains.