Large Scale Central

Hold on to Your Vintage JBLs - End of an Era

Other Hobbies
#1

From the JBL Forum 3/17/16

JBL (Harman Luxury) laid off 3 more employees yesterday. Their seniority totaled over 70 years. The big hit was Jerry Moro. Jerry’s work is legendary and his transducers have been featured in most of my designs for years. He also has done transducers for Revel, JBL automotive product, some really fine subs used by Synthesis and JBL Pro just to name a few of his many, many accomplishments over the years. His latest products, not yet to market, are a pair of stunning in wall systems using a compression driver and horn. They still fit into a standard 4" wall. I worked with him on these products a bit before my demise. They are absolutely outstanding.

So this brings an end to any world class engineers at JBL. Jerry and I were the last two. There are only 3 guys left and although they are competent, they are no where near the knowledge, success or capability of what they just dumped. The senior Model maker left last week to go elsewhere which means that Consumer no longer has any model making capabilities, either.

It appears that this is the end for JBL was we have known it. The Lab equipment is in total disarray with much of it not working properly. If it weren’t for Professional’s need for and use of the lab, I doubt that it would function at all. There will be no more internal transducer development, no world class engineers, no more internal model making capabilities and no more real JBL product. It is just going to be me-too product copied from somebody else and designed and manufactured in China or equivalent.

Hold on to your Vintage products and hope that you can find a way to get parts when things wear out. None of this will involve Harman any longer!

#2

Ah, um, oh. So another company goes downhill all in the name of saving a few bucks. The bean counters need to learn that the bottom line is important, but it isn’t the end all, be all, that they think it is. Without customer service, customers eventually go away. Without customers, there is no company.

Sadly, I have seen that scenario play out too many times. In fact, that is part of the reason I just changed jobs. The company that I just left, is beginning to care more about saving a few dollars, then providing customers with the service that their customers expect and deserve.

#3

I didn’t realize that simply posting some bad news to “Other Hobbies” was enough to loose all respect.

What does that say about the Reputation system? (http://largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-undecided.gif)

#4

Hmmm,

I didn’t read anything you wrote that I thought warranted a neg rep.

I wouldn’t let it bother you.

#5

Personal vendetta I guess.

#6

Vendetta, wasn’t that small sporty type car?

#7

#8

Let’s bring this closer to home.

Not only were JBLs used in studio monitors and public address systems, they were used in traffic signals, fog horns, and even railway signals.

These are the same tweeters that JBL put in their vintage studio monitors being used by “General Railway Signal Company.” I’m thinking that these are extremely rare, but only in its “foilcal.” They are on the 'bay and the other is missing the foilcal. (Even says made by JBL.)

BTW, I have the home version of the 4333s with custom crossovers that I made.

#9

Back in the day in the hood with the band …pretty sure we had JBL stage monitors (not positive) but I know we used Crest Amplifiers like Lewis did.

(http://www.largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-wink.gif)

#10

It’s sad when when one of the largest audio (and video) manufacturers in the country goes under. Usually the company’s R&D costs become too expensive or they’re no longer innovative and can’t keep up with the latest technologies, or their manufacturing is sub contracted or farmed out to another country where there’s cheap labor or the product quality diminishes or their customer service is lousy or…all of the above. They just struggle to compete and stay above water until they file for bankruptcy or are picked up by a competitor.

I still have a pair of JBL 4311’s and a pair of L-100’s in storage. The foam grills have deteriorated, but the last time I had them hooked up they sounded just like they did when I bought them in the early 70’s. Damn good speakers with very good components. JBL’s drivers were put together very well and when you heard the name “JBL” you knew their speakers were known for good bass response.

Looks like Klipsch is now the longest standing American speaker manufacturer. I hope the John B. Lansing company will prevail.

#11

I made an epic JBL score on ebay the other day!

I found an original 2420 diaphragm for the LE85/2420 compression driver. This little piece of formed aluminum with a voice coil would sell for ~$30-$40 in the early '70s. They were replaced later in the '70s by the 2421 then the 2425 which is made of titanium.

I’ve been looking for one of these literally for years and to the right people, this can easily fetch >$500.

The seller has it in a 2421 box and had it mis-labeled in the ad as a 2412, transposing the numbers. To the knowlegable in the subject matter, this looks nothing like a 2412. (http://largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-wink.gif)

No one even bid on it other than me and I got it for the $65 minimum. Looking at the pictures, it is well worth the risk that it works. That is mostly deteriorated foam on the terminals used on the inside of the back covers of the drivers.

My theory is that someone blew out a 2420 diaphragm and could no longer get them so changed out the pair for a matched set of 2421s, and put the good 2420 away in the box. At least, that’s what I would have done and anyone else I know of who is into vintage JBLs.

This is the original 2420 diaphragm I won. Note the factory markings where someone went to the trouble to get the shims just so to ensure perfect alignment of the voice coil. No one goes to those extremes and they stopped that sort of thing a long time ago. The 2420s have a warmer sound than the later 2421 and 2425 diamond surround diaphragms. I currently have 2420s in my left and right channels and a 2421 in my center channel, so they will finally all match.

Today I got an email from the seller that in fact the diaphragm was mislabeled and is “in fact a 2421” and if I want to cancel the sale, he would be OK with that. I told him YES I wanted it and what it really is, how it probably came to be, and treat it with care. He probably sh–.

It only looks like aluminum but is actually made of unobtanium:

Replacement aftermarket 2421 (originals are no longer available):

2425 in titanium, some still avaliable at $200-250 each:

These are the 2412s that it was listed as:

#12

Cool. Back in the day (pre 80’s) I owned a small pro audio shop. I did my own re-coning on Altec and JBL drivers and swapped out many a diaphragm. I probably had those 2420’s 6 or 8 deep and sold them for well under $50 installed. I don’t recall shims in the diaphragm kits but we used them in bass drivers to keep the coil centered while the surround was glued in. They got pulled out before gluing on the dust cap.

Unfortunately when we closed the shop and moved East I sold off all of the Altec and JBL stuff except fro a couple of Altec amps that I still have.

#13

WOW!!!

I’ve come to find that this is a major historical score and it may be worth far more in a museum than in my center channel.

This from one of the historians on the JBL Forum:

Just a tiny bit of trivia… this diaphragm is the lineal descendant of Jim Lansing’s D175 diaphragm of 1947. Examples of the early ones all show a tiny flaw from the two part mold. There is a tiny chip near the apex of one of the triangular tangents, creating a small “caved in” spot. All D175 diaphragms I have seen through at least 1952 or so reveal this flaw, indicating that they were all pressed in Jim Lansing’s original handmade tool for this diaphragm. I have several such pressings (never built into complete diaphragms) that were given to me by the Lansing family. Most are a little beat up as they used them for Christmas tree decorations in the 1950s!

#14

duplicate post

#15

The diaphragm arrived in what looks like perfect shape. It does not display the marking of the original 1947 mold, so will go in my center channel as planned are all.

Aluminum being formed:

Formed aluminum. Note that the peak of the lower tangent has a distinct dimple indicating the original mold.