Large Scale Central

East Broad Top will not run this Summer

General Discussion
#1

Straight from their Facebook page:

“Well here it is. The railroad will NOT run this summer. Things could not be worked out between Mr. Kovalchick and EBTPA. We will still be offering tours of the shops and round house for groups of 20 or more people but they must call the station and make arrangments for that at 814-447-3011.This does not mean that the railroad will not open back up next year, we will be looking at all the possibilities to try and reopen in 2013. We will keep you posted as to what is going on with the railroad as the year goes by. DBG”

Bummer :frowning:
I’m late to the party, as usual. Was hoping to go this summer.
Ralph

#2

Whaa?

#3

Work is still going on at the railroad–the FEBT has a long list of projects in the works, and the Kovalchicks (owners) just dumped a bunch of their own money into getting the blacksmith shop raised up and leveled. Still, there was a bunch of momentum building for the railroad that just got derailed. I gotta think the folks at the Rockhill Trolley Museum are none-too-pleased that something couldn’t have been worked out. At the very least, if the parties knew things weren’t likely to reach agreement, that a proper “Plan B” could have been put into place.

Later,

K

#4

What is the problem?

#5

EBTPA’s 3 year agreement with a purchase option ran out. All anyone knows is that the parties (owner Vs. operator) could not come to an agreement to renew or extend the operator’s agreement. If Stanley Hall was still alive and capable of working I’m pretty sure they would have re-opened as owner-operator.

It’s really a shame they can’t put together a Plan B for this year. There are people at the railroad capable of handling the day-to-day without the EBTPA. Even if they were to open late it would be better than not opening at all.

Shoot - I’d quit my jobs and move to Orby to run the place if they would have me :slight_smile:

#6

More alphabet soup.

Could we lose the acronyms, just this once, please? I’ve gone to the trouble of reading this whole page, a complete waste of time, just because someone was too lazy to spell out, just once, what all that alphabet soup stands for. I can easily figure out half of it, because I’ve known EBT since I was a kid. I know the rest is going to be obvious, AFTER we’ve seen it the first time. But not until then.

Cut us some slack here, guys!

#7

Sometimes it is as easy as Google (in this case) or any other search engine. http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&aq=hts&oq=&ie=UTF-8&rlz=1T4ACEW_enUS337US338&q=EBTPA
edit to include 9th item down.
and it takes you a bit of effort, but as I was taught early on…if you don’t know something look it up.

#8
John Le Forestier said:
More alphabet soup.

Could we lose the acronyms, just this once, please? I’ve gone to the trouble of reading this whole page, a complete waste of time, just because someone was too lazy to spell out, just once, what all that alphabet soup stands for. I can easily figure out half of it, because I’ve known EBT since I was a kid. I know the rest is going to be obvious, AFTER we’ve seen it the first time. But not until then.

Cut us some slack here, guys!


Take it down a notch, John. Ask, don’t insult.

#9
Bob McCown said:
Take it down a notch, John. Ask, don't insult.
I'm still fed up but I hear you Bob.
#10

Well John,
Hollywood(are nicknames OK?) gave you the skinny on EBTPA. EBTPA was used in my post, as it was a direct quote.
FEBT is the Friends of the EBT.

Knowing what the initials stand for, doesn’t really matter to the story. What’s important, is that the East Broad Top RR will not run this summer :wink:
Ralph

#11

It all depends on what one is reading it for, Ralph. The title already told me that much.

I read the thing to try and figure out what was happening, who was who, what the interactions are that are going on there and so on - as much as I could learn. Finances, ownership, community support, and a host of other matters. So the initials did matter to me, that’s why I expressed my frustration after all.

Many, many preservation railways around the world do manage to run successfully. I was wondering if some of the challenges they have faced in the past and perhaps some of the lessons they have learned might be applicable in this case.

But the more I read, obviously, the more I felt thwarted in my desire to understand what was going on behind the headline.

Now, I appreciate your posting this news, and I appreciate your getting back to me like this, but I’m quite sure you didn’t mean anyone to read it all only to end up perplexed and frustrated.

I believe it is quite easy to make one’s writing crystal clear, and like most people, I prefer to read things that are clear.

Again, I appreciate your effort, I really do, and I’ve pretty much got over it all by now… :slight_smile:

Some of the guys call Dave Marconi Hollywood. I still have to get used to it though.

Then there’s Alleywood, Mik’s article, a favourite of mine … Cheers!

#12
John Le Forestier said:
Some of the guys call Dave Marconi Hollywood. I still have to get used to it though. !
You done figured out who Rooster was though! ;)
#13

I know what FEBT & EBTPA stand for. But it doesn’t help me understand the complex arrangement between the two groups and the ownership :wink:
Ralph

#14
Ralph Berg said:
I know what FEBT & EBTPA stand for. But it doesn't help me understand the complex arrangement between the two groups and the ownership ;) Ralph
I think it's pretty obvious from this decision that the two groups don't understand either. Being shut down for only one year will put them back 5 years or more on the marketing momentum they had gained. The Preservation Association finally did some things to market the ride to the general public, and it was starting to work. Thomas trains and Polar Express this past season were huge successes which had the rail-fans grinning because they could see that money was coming in.
#15

The FEBT (Friends of the East Broad Top) has no dog in this fight; rather we’re quite powerless and sitting on the sidelines scratching our heads as much as anyone over this–and thankful that things are still such that we’re able to do the restoration work we’ve been doing. Given that the EBTPA (…preservation association) is still involved in the operations–if not running the trains themselves, it really confuses the relationship and any clarity as to what’s actually going on. It was the preservation association that got the grant for the work up in Mt. Union, so I’d imagine they’d have to remain in the picture to some degree to see that money come to fruition. Again, that’s speculation–I’m not sure the particulars of the grant.

It will be interesting to see how this one plays out. Eight or so years ago, the Coloardo Historical Society dumped Lindsay Ashby as the operator of the G’town loop, after 20+ years of operation. That was a decidedly UGLY divorce, with one side claiming the railroad was shutting down, and the other scrambling to find motive power so it could run the next year. If that wasn’t enough, the new operators had significant mechanical difficulties with the locos they did get, so things were hit-and-miss for the next few seasons as well. They’re doing okay, but I don’t think they’ve still yet fully recovered from the few years of speculative operations. Hopefully the EBT and EBTPA can get things going here soon, perhaps even salvage something of this year’s operating season. Momentum is a hard thing to recapture.

Later,

K

#16

Kevin and Jon-
Is the revenue opportunity lost from not running a minor argument for compromise?
The apparent compelling public interest in trains ultimately leads to “when can I ride?”
The Railroad Days weekend in Fullerton, Calif., drew over 30,000 and nothing moved. If there had been advertised loco movement on a siding, attendance figures would have increased dramatically.
Wendell

#17

The Durango & Silverton were taken over by American Heritage Railways, among others.
The C&T is under new management as well.
Maybe the owner of the EBT should do the same, if the logistics of running a tourist line
(insurance, scheduling, maintenance, etc,) is too much for him.

http://americanheritagerailways.com/

#18

Not know hardly anything about the operations of the EBT, anything I say is speculation.

However, it seems to me there is at least two people on each side of the fight that have their heads so far up in the air they cant see past their own noses. Pride ruins a lot of great ideas.

I went on the EBT website, I was trying to figure out what actually ran there. The description of all the locomotives kind of left it as nothing is running.

#19

David Russell said:
You done figured out who Rooster was though!:wink:

His dancing with the stars routine did it. :rolleyes:

(http://i.picasion.com/pic51/b5be90103c86129764a4d209b727911c.gif)

#20

Wendel, I really don’t know the answer to that. The railroad never has been a big (or even small) money-maker, though my understanding is that the revenue from the past 3 years was certainly an improvement over years past. I was told (2nd-hand) that they were running in the black for the first time in a long while, but can’t verify that. That could also mean they didn’t spend a ton of money that perhaps had been spent in previous years, or who knows what the accounting was. Regardless, no trains running is not good for business–heck, even bring the speeders out for a weekend event or something like that. Those are a kick in the pants to ride (literally and figuratively). You gotta do something to keep people interested.

Jake, the only operable steamer there is #15. It was rebuilt 7 or 8 years ago, but don’t know where it stands relative to its periodic FRA-mandated (or whoever-mandated) inspection. #14 is technically operable, but needs its inspection/certification, and there’s presumably going to be some work involved in getting that done or they’d likely have done it already. The rest of the mikes are ostensibly stuffed and mounted at this point, needing probably 7-figures to restore each to service.

Later,

K