Large Scale Central

Dave Watts: LGB parts questions

General Discussion
#1

On January 20, Dave Watts sent me responses to questions I asked regarding the availability of LGB parts from an outsource. Here are his responses:

Wendell: Does the list of parts outsourced include: loco shoes, brushes, light bulbs, smoke units, cleaning wheels, magnets, and motors?
Dave: There may have been changes since the December Garden RR ad was sent to Marc Horovitz.

(Here is a summary his product availability sent by e-mail. He stated that all of these products are from the identical manufacturer. I removed the prices to stay consistent with the purpose of this posting.)

63218 LGB loco shoes, the newer “waffle” shoe, a pair, is now available in a four-pack
63110 LGB short carbon brushes is now available in an 8 pack
63120 LGB 4 short and 4 long brushes are now available as an 8 pack – can be 8 long ones in pack.
68501 LGB yellow tinted 18 volt screw-in bulb - single or in package of 25
68502 LGB screw-in bulb with socket and wires sold each and in a two pack
68511 LGB 10 clear 5 volt plug-in micro bulbs
68513 LGB 10 clear 24 volt plug-in micro bulbs
LGB 19 volt clear micro bulbs, not before available, in a 10 pack
65853 LGB 5 volt smoke unit
65553 LGB 24 volt smoke unit
67005 LGB track cleaning pad replacements for LGB 50050 in a 4 pack.
67267 LGB track cleaning wheels for 20670 locomotive in 4 pack
LGB track cleaning pad replacement for LGB 50040 now available - price not set.
17010 LGB activation magnet as a pair.
Motors are unfortunately not available.

Wendell: Is it accurate the parts purchased will not be in LGB brand packaging.
Dave: That is correct. They could not be packaged in LGB brand packaging as that would be a violation of trademark laws, but there is not exclusivity to these manufacturer’s selling their wares in other packaging.

Wendell: Are there other out-sourced parts you have planned to have produced and wish announced?
Dave: Yes, there are several very exciting products now available. We have secured a cache of the LGB 55021 and 55027 loco decoders as well as the extremely rare LGB 55024 individual turnout decoders.
We also have the unbelievable smoking units from the LGB 24812 Harz chuffing locomotives, which were offered immediately before LGB went out of business. We are testing them to retrofit them into other LGB locomotives. These iunits actually have a fan that turns on and off with the chuffing beats of the locomotive…most exciting!

Wendell: Is there any conflict with LGB of American re: your outsourcing?
Dave: None, as these are the manufacturers that had previously supplied LGB and when LGB went out of business their old contracts were nuill and void allowing these manufacturers to sell directly to anyone. Things may change in the future with Marklin coming on board, but only time will tell. Buy them while they are available, better a decoder in the hand then one in the factory!

Very best wishes,
Dave

#2

Re: Dave Watt’s responses to my question concerning LGB of America – is there a conflict of interest – I am curious as to LGB of America offering the same LGB OEM parts. Anyone with information as to whether LGB of America is distributing to dealers these same parts? Dave did not offer his source, nor did I ask,

If, in fact, LGB of America is not the supplier, I would find that information puzzling.
Wendell

#3

Wendell,

Those parts have been available from a number of dealers in EU. No reason why a US dealer with good connections couldn’t get them from the same source.
Not likely that a German parts mfg would have an exclusive with a US distributor. It’s the “not all eggs in one basket” precaution, backed up by what the parts suppliers experienced with EPL and probably know of the LGBoA background. :wink: :slight_smile:

#4

HJ-
As of continued curiosity, if LGB of America did not respond to this need to promote and distribute these basic LGB replaceables, what then is their role in this hobby? They have the LGB title.

What do you know of LGB of America’s current status? Has Marklin possibly disavowed them of being Marklin’s LGB image in America both as a distributor and user of the LGB name?

Wendell

#5

Not that I have any need at all, but I did notice an advertiser in the last few issues of GR say that they were the OEM of many LGB parts and were now selling direct. I don’t recall the name of the company, but the ad was big enough to be seen.

Jon

#6

I believe that was Massoth…or however you spell it.

#7

When I was there over the Thanksgiving holiday, Dave was stocking the Massoth product so as to fill in the gaps till LGB gets itself back up to speed. I get almost 99% of my LGB thru Dave and have known him for many years. My folks live about 45min from the store and we will be as well this spring. Cheers Mike and Michele T

#8

Yes, the company source is Massoth, a German company with a division in the USA.
Apparently, and I am making a good guess from a Massoth brochure, Massoth makes the sound systems for LGB and are still doing so. The other products noted by Dave Watts (Watts Trainshop) may be outsourced by Massoth – I think their forte is electrical.

Wendell

#9
Wendell Hanks said:
Yes, the company source is Massoth, a German company with a division in the USA. Apparently, and I am making a good guess from a Massoth brochure, Massoth makes the sound systems for LGB and are still doing so. The other products noted by Dave Watts (Watts Trainshop) may be outsourced by Massoth -- I think their forte is electrical.

Wendell


Wendell,

Massoth produced the complete LGB-MTS system from implementation 2 on, decoders, central units etc. etc. all according to EPL’s specs. Theit own Dimax control is relatively recent. By all appearances a result of seeing where the demand was which EPL had no intention to fill.

It’s that “you snooze, you loose” thingy.

It will be very interesting to see what Massoth presents at the 2008 NTF! Remember they submitted a last minute bid for the insolvency assets of EPL. Makes you wonder what’s cooking in that corner?!!? :wink: :slight_smile: :wink:

#10

HJ-
The corner may have very few chefs. My guess is the menu for Massoth products is clearly being advertised – and the pricing is also available to those who respond to the Garden RR ad as I did. Watts’pricing is equal or slightly under Massoth.

Now, what is the status of LGB of America? Will they be known as G-45 if their LGB distribution status is nullified by Marklin? I’m guessing that status was and still is tenuous. That’s a guess. They likely were wise in taking on other products. I doubt they would have needed to do so if they knew they were to be America’s sole LGB distributor for all of Marklin’s LGB products — that’s assurance locked up in a contract with corporate hugs 'n kisses.

To return to the Massoth topic: What do you know of the status of LGB of America and its relationship, if any, to Massoth? Is it possible that LGB of America IS the distributor of Massoth? If so, what’s the strategy from selling direct from Massoth to Garden RR mag readers?

??

Wendell

#11
Wendell Hanks said:
HJ- The corner may have very few chefs. My guess is the menu for Massoth products is clearly being advertised -- and the pricing is also available to those who respond to the Garden RR ad as I did. Watts'pricing is equal or slightly under Massoth.

Now, what is the status of LGB of America? Will they be known as G-45 if their LGB distribution status is nullified by Marklin? I’m guessing that status was and still is tenuous. That’s a guess. They likely were wise in taking on other products. I doubt they would have needed to do so if they knew they were to be America’s sole LGB distributor for all of Marklin’s LGB products — that’s assurance locked up in a contract with corporate hugs 'n kisses.

To return to the Massoth topic: What do you know of the status of LGB of America and its relationship, if any, to Massoth? Is it possible that LGB of America IS the distributor of Massoth? If so, what’s the strategy from selling direct from Massoth to Garden RR mag readers?

??

Wendell


Wendell,

The tendency of European mfgs - in most industries - is to start their own distribution if the volume can justify it. Two examples: ESU and Massoth in the DCC field.

Another general trend is: severe restrictions on distribution of competitors’ products.

The rest should be selfevident!

#12

HJ-
Translation: LGB of America is not active with LGB products.
Wendell

#13
Wendell Hanks said:
HJ- Translation: LGB of America is not active with LGB products. Wendell
Wendell,

Not necessarily the case, there probably are a few other matters that play into the mix. :wink: :slight_smile: :wink:

#14

I believe I saw on another website, Marklin site if I remember correctly, that Marklin/LGB had just signed an agreement with LGBoA to continue as they were, providing LGB trains to the USA. I do find it weird that they use the LGBoA name and distribute more than LGB trains. Just gonna have to sit back and see what shakes out. I am not worried, Dave Watts is both a LGB and a Marklin dealer, so he is good to go and thats where almost all my stuff comes from. I love going to his shop, its a black friday tradition to stop there, last few years just for trains, but I will get the family xmas tree next year there as we will be living in Kokomo, just 45min to the north. Cheers from snowy Erie PA Mike and Michele T

#15
Mike Toney said:
I believe I saw on another website, Marklin site if I remember correctly, that Marklin/LGB had just signed an agreement with LGBoA to continue as they were, providing LGB trains to the USA. I do find it weird that they use the LGBoA name and distribute more than LGB trains. Just gonna have to sit back and see what shakes out. I am not worried, Dave Watts is both a LGB and a Marklin dealer, so he is good to go and thats where almost all my stuff comes from. I love going to his shop, its a black friday tradition to stop there, last few years just for trains, but I will get the family xmas tree next year there as we will be living in Kokomo, just 45min to the north. Cheers from snowy Erie PA Mike and Michele T
Hi all,

Partial quote from the NEWS page of the GARTENBAHNprofi

GBp said:
...............................

Auch der LGB-Katalog 2008 enthält (wie sein Vorgänger von 2007) keine US-Neuheiten, da die Vertragsverhandlungen mit der LGB of Amercia bislang noch nicht abgeschlossen sind. Eine 2007 geschlossene Vereinbarung zur Zusammenarbeit ist nach Informationen des Gartenbahn Profi zum Jahreswechsel zunächst ausgelaufen. Märklin/LGB wolle sich dazu erst äußern, wenn die Unterschriften auf dem Papier stünden.


HJ translates:

HJ said:
...............

Also, the 2008 LGB catalogue (like the predecessor from 2007) contains no New Items for USA, because the negotiations with LGBoA have not been concluded. The distribution agreement that was in place expired at the end of 2007 according to information GARTENBAHNprofi received. Märklin/LGB® intends to only comment on the matter once the signatures are on an agreement.


That much for verbal or other agreements; the info is brand new from Märklin’s LGB® presentation of New Items on 2008/01/28.

:wink: :slight_smile: :slight_smile:

#16

I have a favourite set up to run that page automatically through google language tools and it wasn’t there this morning when I last checked! Hot off the press! Rgds Les

#17
LES DITTRICH said:
I have a favourite set up to run that page automatically through google language tools and it wasn't there this morning when I last checked! Hot off the press! Rgds Les
Hi Les,

Yep, very hot off the press. :wink: :smiley: :wink:

#18

And the spin has already begun :lol: :lol: Quite uncanny how predictable some people are! :wink: :lol:

#19

I suppose the trolls at the Feud are starting to foam at the mouth…:smiley:

#20
Warren Mumpower said:
I suppose the trolls at the Feud are starting to foam at the mouth....:D
The Gartenbahn comments are still there today. Garden Railroader had an anouncement in the last issue about a distribution agreement, but that could be months old and only now making it into the rag. Lets see, if Gartenbahn is correct about no new US LGB for 2008, Hmmm... I suspect if true, foaming at the mouth, or full on panic attacks? The withdrawal symptoms will come later...