Large Scale Central

Choosing a first live steamer

Electronics Live Steam
#1

The cat is out of the bag. Marilyn told me today she had planned on buying me a live steamer for Christmas. She has been talking with Ric to get advice and he suggested it probably wouldn’t be smart to surprise me with something. So now she wants to know what I want. Not easy since I’ve never seriously considered a purchase.

So those of you with some first hand knowledge, would you be willing to help a noob make an educated decision on what to buy? Here is some background that will probably help focus in on some suggestions…

My outdoor track has one pretty steep grade (near 4%), but wide curves. The indoor section is nearly dead flat but has tighter curves - a 5Ft. Radius loop & less in some sidings.

I don’t stick to any one scale, but I’m trying not to buy or build anything that isn’t 1:29 Std. Gauge or 1:20.3 Narrow gauge.

My fancy doesn’t run toward European outline nor mainline steam so I think that probably rules out the Ruby and Aristo’s steamer. Most of what I already own in sparky steam is small and/or narrow gauge. I have no 1:29 steam, only early diesels.

Operationally I don’t run in circles. In fact I presently don’t even have a true loop. I like to do switching, but that’s not requirement in a steamer. R/C control is on my wish list, but again not a requirement.

So - have at it :smiley:

Jon

#2

I don’t consider myself an expert…but I’m gonna give you my advise any how. From all you have said I would think the Accucraft Shay would be the way to go. It comes in the correct scale (1:20.3) can handle tight curves and is geared to take steep hills. Most rod live steamers would choke on the 4% grade. Outside of Aristo’s Mike there are no other 1:29 live steamers. Standard gauge in live steam is generally 1:32. Most narrow gauge (1:20.3) rod live steamers are too large for your curves.

#3

Jon, I have to agree with Warren on this one. I’m not an expert by any means, but I don’t see where you could go wrong with the Shay. Besides, Ric and Doug each have one and they can probably give you loads of advice on how it operates. From what I’ve seen of it at Fred’s it’s a great running engine. The only other engine I would suggest they don’t make anymore and that’s the one I have . For a one of a kind engine it was fairly cheap.

#4

I also agree (and not an expert either). The two cylinder Shay was my first locomotive. Very easy to fire and will take your grades very easily. You may not want to run it in the house as it dribbles as it runs down the track. Another good reason to get the Shay (Accucraft) is their great after sale assistance. Cliff is always available to answer any questions and give good advice. Nick Jr

#5

Shay!

Not sure about running it inside, but it sure does well on my grades outside. It’s fairly easy to reach in and move the Johnson bar to change direction. Easier still if you leave the roof off. If you go with a rod engine, plan on R/C, as you’ll need it for the grades. For live steam, it’s the down grades that are the killers - there’s no brakes! The two cylinder shay seems to be the favorite over the three cylinder version. It runs well out of the box.

#6

My first live steamer was an Accucraft 3 cyl. Shay. Also purchased for me by my wife Linda at the 1st MWLSTS.

As a beginners loco the Shay has no equal! Grades up or down are of no concern, unlike rod engines. The two cylinder is probably your best choice as they have an excellent reputation and running characteristics. You can run them out of the box and then when comfortable there are some tweaks you can perform to make them run even better.

I wrote a review of my 3 cyl Shay here on LSC. You should be able to locate it and get more info on that model. I learned a tremendous amount getting the 3 cylinder. During most of the time I wished I had the two!

However having made the journey I learned far more on this path and am very happy with it.

Andre’

#7

Thanks for all the comments.

I’ve seen Ric and Doug’s Shays run at Fred’s. Was quite impressed at how well they performed on Fred’s layout and that they were able to double head them without too much trouble. I had a feeling that was the direction I had pointed myself with my wish list.

Andre - I’ll look for your review, thanks.

Jon

#8

Is the 2 Cyl. Shay currently available? I’ve not found it listed at Ridge Road and have seen some posts that say the first run sold out.

Having a hard time deciding on the version. The open cab is interesting, but a little early for me. The Mich-Cal is a bit more modern and offers some hiding places for electronics.

Jon

#9

Jon,
I had heard that there was a second run. Give Royce a call: Evenings & Weekends 703.799.9643 http://www.quisenberrystation.com/

#10

I know the 3 cyl has pretty short run times, due to a small gas tank, have not heard about the two but sure like the looks of it!
Jerry

#11
Jerry Barnes said:
I know the 3 cyl has pretty short run times, due to a small gas tank, have not heard about the two but sure like the looks of it! Jerry
Dougald and I have both carried out the double-sized gas tank conversions to our three-cylinder Shays, extending the run times to at least 45/50 minutes, dependent on the weather and load. It is also a good idea to revise the rather generous lube system to a finer feed type as made by David Bailey over here in yUK to ensure adequate flow over the extended running period. A third and very necessary addition is to install a Goodall valve water feeder - the loco, which effectively has three of the later and larger version 'Ruby' cylinders, is a real water hog.

Apart from a few Youtube appearances of my model, our esteemed co-steamer Tom LaPointe has posted an excellent primer [sorry, steam joke] on getting the thing going on Youtube - a ‘must-look’ for any noob.

Besp

tac

#12

Discussion of this topic has completely dried up at home. Royce was listing the 2-Cyl as in-stock on his website and I gave Marilyn his contact info. I did notice a new unfamiliar box at the top of the attic stairs yesterday and was told not to go up there.

I have seen Tom’s YouTube videos. Good stuff.

Does the 2 Cyl. need any of these mods? I’ve heard that in the stock configuration it does right well.

There won’t be any outdoor steaming until after the January thaw. We had 6 inches of snow last week that was covered by two inches of sleet yesterday and freezing rain last night. What you end up with is block ice on the ground. Last year I tried and chip it away from the track but did quite a bit of damage. I won’t do that again.

I don’t quite have a circle indoors, just a balloon track. Despite the oil and water mess I’ll bet it gets steamed on before spring.

Jon

#13

The only “mod” I made was to add Accucraft couplers. It comes with link & pin, but all of my cars are equipped with Accucraft couplers. I painted the roof, removed the lettering and added my own. Toned down the gloss a bit. She runs great out of the box. I did get a case of fuel from Royce, as well as an adapter for the fuel cans which makes filling up a lot easier. If you have a place to run inside, she should run just fine…but it can get messy. I’ve got oil stains on my trestle where I start her up…

#14

Minimal modifications to mine. I get 35 minutes to a filling of fuel and give the tank about 50 squirts every 10 minutes. Always have water left when it runs out of fuel. Refires pretty fast once you have it all warmed up.

#15
Ric Golding said:
Minimal modifications to mine. I get 35 minutes to a filling of fuel and give the tank about 50 squirts every 10 minutes. Always have water left when it runs out of fuel. Refires pretty fast once you have it all warmed up.
All true stuff, Ric - The two-cylinder version is prolly Accucraft's 'model T Ford' - any colour 'slong as it's black, and goes on the button most any weather.

I’ve seen a good few, but never seen one that didn’t work out of the box, unlike my three-cylinder version, that had the trucks on almost 3/8" offset and not matching the frame bolsters…it tacked around the layout like a small sailboat until corrected with a LOT of work from Rod Blakeman here in yUK.

The only reason I got the three-cylinder version was that the guy ten minutes ahead of me in the exhibition had bought the last two-cylinder version, and I got a good price as compensation. Still, I am very fond of it - lots of views on Youtube, too, and it’s a real hauler that never fails to attract attention from the visitors to the line I run on. ‘Wossat?’ is the most common question I get. And a good one from a ten-year old young man - ‘why does it only have an engine down the one side?’

My next job is to mess/clutter mine up with all kinds of add-on crap - brass castings of course, it do get v. hot.

Best

tac.ovgrs.org

#16

I did add a ‘spitolator’ (spelled wrong I am sure) designed by Bruce. Took all the Snap and Pop out of the locomotive. It also keeps the top of my loco (and everyone else’s close by) from being covered with oil and water spitting out of the stack. Very happy with the mod. Nick Jr

#17

Thanks guys for the continued confidence in the 2 Cyl. I’m pretty sure I’ll be happy with it.

Nick - Where can I find details on the “Spitolator” - Sounds perfect for indoor running.

Jon

#18

Jon, I can’t find the article right now, I am sure others on this forum read about it and made one, please help out here, I will continue to look for it. But be aware, all the junk that would have normally come out the stack is now dribbling on your track and everything under it. I take no credit for the design, I coppied it. It is like the muffler of a car. The exhaust from the cylinders enters the ‘muffler’ on the back side set near the bottom, the oil drops out and some water condenses. It the steam exits the other side near the top and goes out the stack. There is a drain pipe that lets the junk dribble out under the loco. Nick Jr

#19
Nick Peluso Jr said:
I did add a 'spitolator'
I note in Garden Railways, Dec 2007 issue, page 103. A "spittoon" for preventing spitting from the stack. Might prove useful.
#20

Nick how is that Shay? I have thought about it but thats as far as it has gone. Later RJD