Large Scale Central

Beware of AA NiMh batteries?

Recently I have had my second 2,500 mah, 14.4 volt, AA NiMH battery pack failure after less than 12 months use. Both customers were operating USA Trains GP38-2 locos. One was on board the loco, the other was in a trail car. Both were trickle charged only using the RCS charger I make. These chargers were designed for NiCd chemistry and not NiMh. Although it is possible that the chargers caused the failures, I doubt it because I have plenty of other customers who have the same packs and have not experienced any failures using the same chargers. The above is of concern to me, so I asked my battery supplier what the maximum current draw from these tabbed 2,500 mah AA Sanyo cells would be. The answer surprised me. Because of the physical construction of the cells, the maximum continuous draw is ½ an amp. They are designed to give a low current draw for a very long time compared to NiCd cells. They can withstand short 1 amp current draws but nothing more without causing irreparable damage to the cells. Sure, the NiMH cells will sustain the high current draw, BUT! this damage will drastically reduce the life of the cells from a claimed 500 recharges to possibly no more than a few dozen. Roughly the same current draw restrictions apply to AA NiCd cells as well. If you don’t believe me, go ask your battery supplier to put into writing that they can handle the draw you require from them. SO. For small locos that do not draw more than ½ amp total continuous, AA NiMh cells will be OK. For larger locos that can haul a lot of cars stick with cells that can handle the current. Here in Australia I cannot economically justify the odd sized cells you can get in the USA. They are hard to obtain and expensive. In Australia I recommend SuB C cells or larger. Either NiMh or NiCd. As an aside, NiCd’s last twice as long. I am currently installing two Sub C 7.2 volt 1700SCR twin stick packs in the USAT GP38-2. Pictures will follow shortly to show you how. The replacement batteries ahve been installed, the loco tested and delivered back to the owner. Firstly I removed two front stanchions from over the fuel tank. The holes in the floor show where they had been. I CA’ed small square plastic tubing to support the battery packs up off the chassis to allow wires to reach underneath. I then drilled four 3/16th’s holes to allow plastic zip ties to thread through the chassis.

The 2 x 7.2 volt 1700 SCR NiCd battery packs were tacked together with silicone roof and gutter sealant and mounted in place. The two plastic zip ties wre cinched up tight and the excess cut off.

I used an RCS Y Cable kit to join the two packs in series to get 14.4 volts and feed the power down into the fuel tank where the ON-OFF switch and sound system are located.

I too have had less thatn spectacular performance out of NiMH AAs course I guess ya get what ya pay for. A Big Honkin Shay with sound is just too much for 'em…

With that said…I went ahead and converted No9 to a NiCAD pack of identical Voltage (14.4v) thi afternoon and I see 100% improvement in performance…no voltage drops…the sound doesn;t cut out backing up into the Shop…she moves at a good clip and her lights remain bright consistently. Actual running time will have to wait til I finish the loop roundthe garden plot for an actual measurement…

In my experience, nicads seem to handle high discharge currents a little better than nickle metal hydrides. Likewise they seem to be more tolerant of a “float charge”, which is sort of what you get with a “trickle” charger after the battery is fully charged, i.e. nickle metal hydrides seem to be more sensitive to overcharging.

While having slightly greater power density, in my experience, nickle metal hydrides have not been the improvement over nicads as they have been touted.

Any current draw over 1/2 C seems to radically reduce the lifetimes of both of these. That’s why the portable drill manufacturers seem to make more money from selling batteries than the drill sets.

Regards, Greg

Some of you may remember me purchasing some batteries last year at Walmart.

You can see these are NiMH-9.6V, 1600 MilliAmp for the WCC RC cars/trucks/motorcycles I bought a few, they were on sale for $2.50…so what the heck… Here is one opened up…

My question is…do you think these would work in something like a Bachmann Saddletank, or a Mack Switcher? I assume they’d be too small for my Annie or 45 Tonner… I bought the Radio Shack Charger-to charge the “packs” If I could use them, can you defer to a charger for them (through my RCS/BIK of course). In the end if they are not gonna work…well, so goes Ebay…

If they don’t last very long, they’re certainly worth what you had invested in them. If you’re worried about current, put them in something smallish.

As an aside, last summer I measured an Aristo Dash 9 with 10 cars on level track with 16 1/2 ft diameter curves at about 1/2 amp. The lights were on but not the smoke.

Tony question. How do the R/C Car racing groups keep batteries usable? There batteries are quick charge/discharge. they will drain them in minutes and recharge them within 30 minutes. They do cost a premium, why? Can we use that type battery and charger of our garden trains?