Large Scale Central

Battery Life?

Electronics Power and Sound
#1

Hi all,

I finished a section of the new RR and fired up the Connie; Airwire, Phoenix, Battery, and set off up the hill.

Right away as I increased speed the sound started lowering and finally stopped as I increased the throttle more.

I noticed that even at full throttle the speed was not what it should be, cranked to 28 and barely moving along up the

2 % with 2 cars and caboose.

As I decreased the speed to almost a stop the sound started picking back up to set volume. Same thing going back down the hill but to a lesser degree

Well, I thought, been a while since I charged the battery must be low. I ran back into shop and put it on the charger. It charged for 18 minutes to 224 mah and shut off. Hummm that’s odd, I re-set the charger and it went for 42 minutes and 460 mah and shut off. That didn’t seem right for a 3300mah battery.

I fired up the engine and ran it just back and forth in the shop (it has started raining again) and it seemed fine with that light load.

Started wondering if the battery was failing, can’t be that old, just built that loco 4-5 years ago. So I looked up the paperwork, hmmmm Jan 2007 it Was put in service, little longer ago than I thought, and of course it sat idle (with just an occasional charge) for over 2 years while we moved and rebuilt.

So all this long winded story is leading up to is a couple of questions.

1- How long do these batteries last ( these are NimH) ?

2- Should I consider LI if I replace?

Thanks for any insight.

Rick

#2

My uneducated response says cycle through a few more times, fully discharging and recharging. I’ve had NiMH for years sit, and charge for 12 hours and than last for a 3 hour run. If it didn’t hold the charge, I just recharged it. I’m sure Tony, or someone else with more knowledge can tell you more.

#3

Craig Townsend said:
My uneducated response says cycle through a few more times, filling discharging and recharging. I’ve had NiMH for years sit, and charge for 12 hours and than last for a 3 hour run. If it didn’t hold the charge, I just recharged it. I’m sure Tony, or someone else with more knowledge can tell you more.

Yup, worth a try.

#4

1- How long do these batteries last ( these are NimH) ?

2- Should I consider LI if I replace?

I’m surprised they still work at all. If I neglect my NiMH batteries and don’t charge/discharge or use them for 6 months, they are dead and gone. I find I have to charge them every couple of months.

I replaced the NiMH in one loco with couple of Li packs in the hopes that they will still be alive when I return from Florida. Yes, absolutely consider Li replacements if they don’t recover. You’ll find they are more expensive but smaller and lighter. A new charger will be required, and make sure they have built-in PCB protection. [When these batteries get low, they just shut off. No crawling home!] Also note that Li cells are 3.2V not 1.2V so they are different sizes.

#5

LiIon packs with PCBs can go bust as well if not maintained. The packs with PCB (I wouldn’t recommend any other) will self discharge over time due the small load of the PCB circuit. I’ve lost quite a few because I just left them sit for months, perhaps years, without charging. Best to use a smart charge to discharge, then charge in Storage mode. In the future I’ll do this every 3 months when storing packs.

#6

Thanks for the input guys,

I was able to run the loco this morning pulling the same cars it was running at about 10-11 on the throttle instead of 28 and I had full sound, so it seems everything is aces. I am going to run it through a couple of discharge-charge cycles and see if that brings it back up to the 3 hours plus running time that I am used to with it.

If it doesn’t come back and I have to replace it I don’t think I have any room to gripe. After all 10 years on a battery, how could I complain. I wish the ones in my travel trailer lasted as well(http://www.largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-foot-in-mouth.gif).

Pete,

I have LI in my 3 truck Shay that I built (seems like just the other day) and right now it is on the charger because it is completely flat. This will be the third time on the charger in the last 6 months (+or-) with very little to no running time, I am wondering about it’s life as well.

Again thanks

Rick

#7

I have recovered a few battery packs by discharging, as far as I can, and recharging them. They were NiMh and NiCads, not any of the newer type ones. But I also have failed at recovering the packs that way. So give it a try, it might work.

#8

Hi Guys, those that will be attending the ECLSTS in York, PA, stop by my booth to see a new line of Lithium batteries from MTO. These packs are made using Samsung cells but each one is matched/balanced. Also they use a new PCM board that provides more protection. Besides overcharging/over discharging cutoff now each pack has full short circuit protection with recovery. No more dead packs from shorts. I will demonstrate this short to recover capability at the show. With this new PCM the shelf life is up to 12 months between charges. These packs meet military grade specs.

See you at the show.

Don

#9

I have Gel cells that are dated, 1996, still holding on…although I have “Lost” a few dated 1994…they don’t last forever…!!

Fred Mills

#10

I used to use nimh batteries in my trains years ago before I switched everything over to li-ion batteries. I find the li-ion batteries give a much longer run time with the same size battery, as one would expect. But I also find that the self discharge rate is much slower with the li-ion batteries. I monitor my batteries when not in use, and they can go at least 6 months before needing a recharging, often longer. As far as life goes, I find my li-ion batteries last at least 5 years, some longer.

Ed

#11

Yeah, I pull a locomotive out that’s equipped with Tenergy li-ion batteries after it’s been sitting around for months and BOOOM! it runs like nothing ever happened. You couldn’t pay me to use track power…I shouldn’t have said that, I should NOT have said that!!!

#12