Large Scale Central

Aster/LGB White Pass mike #73

Modeling Rolling stock
#41
John Bouck said:
TAC - Drop it off at TOC's for a complete rework. Then I'll pick it up and use it until you come back next year. Just like building a hot rod: New motor, gears, etc. TOG
That's a good idea - he do live not far from our homebase in Plantlord - Puyallup is it? A quick vleep up the highway and there y'are.

And for our friend from Rastatt - the Aster/LGB mike is electronically-governed to a scale speed of 28mph - the top speed of the real thing, that’s why it doesn’t zoom along like the ‘Flying Hamburger’.

Anyhow - to all on the forum and those misfortunates who do not as yet share our passions and foibles -

A Merry Christmas and a Happy and Prosperous New Year!!!

from

tac, mrs tac, ig, crow and erl the lobster

#42
John Bouck said:
Markus, A mike is not made to climb mountains! That is the job for the geared locomotives.

TAC
Drop it off at TOC’s for a complete rework. Then I’ll pick it up and use it until you come back next year.
Just like building a hot rod: New motor, gears, etc.

TOG


John, please call me Michael. Markus is my family-name. But don’t worry, you are not the first who is mixing up my names… :-))

The prototype of the Mikado #73 ran from Skagway to Bennet, didn’t it? So why should not my loco climb my mountains?
I have some more locos, which really can climb mountains and pull many waggons (Bachmann Shay, Climax, Heissler, Consolidation). I only want to see the Mikado pull three Bachmann-White-Pass-passenger-waggons, not more. My layout will be reconstructed in spring with a 7-Meters-Trestle-Pony- and -Deck-Truss-bridge-combination to flatten the stepest part of the track. Hopefully then the Mikado will manage it.

Merry Christmas!
Michael

#43

I don’t have one of these locos, but the thread is very interesting.

I was wondering what “weak” means. If the gears strip because they cannot handle the load, I understand.

Sounds like the problem is more severe. I sort of follow the “flexing” chassis causing trouble, would love to see the articulated mechanism. Is it swiveling of the chassis to handle sharp curves?

The thing that prompted me to post was the information about the drivetrain can be repaired, but still weak.

Is that the motor and drive mechanism is also not able to pull substantial loads?

Just curious, not trying to rub salt in the wounds!

Regards, Greg

#44
Greg Elmassian said:
I was wondering what "weak" means. If the gears strip because they cannot handle the load, I understand.

Regards, Greg


Hi, Greg,
you don’t rub salt in the wounds (We say exactly the same in German)…
I’ll try to explain, what I meant, but it’s difficult to say it in English.
My first impression was, that the motor of this loco is really weak, because the loco plus tender did not manage to climb even the tiniest hill on my layout.
Then I saw, that the loco lost grip. When checking the problem at LGB-service you could see, that the two parts of the 4-axle-mechanism where not aligned.
Pooh, how shall I explain the problem (What about your German??)?
The Aster-people modified these parts and did it wrong, so that the axles loose contact to the track.
The solution could be now, that the original LGB-parts would work properly and even when climbing up a hill the wheels will not loose contact to the track.
Let’s see.
I’ll report, when I get my loco back in January.
Regards and seasons greetings
Michael

#45

<John, please call me Michael. Markus is my family-name. But don’t worry, you are not the first who is mixing up my names… >

Oops, Sorry Michael.
I didn’t know you had geared locos as well.
It’s just that I’ve seen so many layouts where the owners try to cram as much trackage as they can in a small space, and the results are 4+ % grades. This isn’t too good for rod engines, especially with curves in the grades.
Just my humble opinion…:slight_smile: :slight_smile:
jb

#46

Greg - most of the questions you have asked can be answered by reading my first explanatory post on the faults with this expensive toy.

Remember that LGB insists that ALL its locomotives should be able to negotiate R1 track, just in case your five-year-olds are going to run your $5000 loco around the settee and under the TV.

The plastic mike and the WP mike share the same mechanism as far as the basic design is concerned - one where the chassis hinges in the middle and the side rods are slotted to compensate for the movement.

I was not aware that Aster had done anything except make the very fine bodywork, at least, according to Aster.

The 22 pound-weight Aster model has a real problem hauling a long consist, but then, the real thing didn’t haul long trains anyhow.

I maintain that the main problem is one of keeping all the drive wheels on the track - mine only has half of them on the track at any one time due to the ‘flex’ in the chassis - see my initial post on the bendy chassis.

It is, in anycase, moot. I will not be going to Nuremburg - three countries and 1500km away, anytime soon, or in the near future - it would cost me a great deal of funds to do so, and sending the loco would also cost a capacious amount of money, too.

So now I’m stuck with a very expensive POS - great to look at, but as useful as a chocolate fire-guard.

tac

#47

Tac, lets talk about this when you get back from your travels. Since you are nt intending to run on risible radii (that took some thought), maybe a replacement laser cut rigid job would do the trick. It seems to me that there is little “collectable value” in a unit that is inherently flawed.

Cheers

#48
Terry A de C Foley said:
So now I'm stuck with a very expensive POS - great to look at, but as useful as a chocolate fire-guard.

tac
www.ovgrs.org


TAC

OK here’s another idea, strip the motor out of there and get a Shovelnose Diesel to pull the steamer and the train. :wink: :slight_smile: They do that on the proto, don’t they??

YEP I know, it’s Duck time!

#49
Terry A de C Foley said:
... Remember that LGB insists that ALL its locomotives should be able to negotiate R1 track, just in case your five-year-olds are going to run your $5000 loco around the settee and under the TV.

The plastic mike and the WP mike share the same mechanism as far as the basic design is concerned - one where the chassis hinges in the middle and the side rods are slotted to compensate for the movement.

I was not aware that Aster had done anything except make the very fine bodywork, at least, according to Aster.

The 22 pound-weight Aster model has a real problem hauling a long consist, but then, the real thing didn’t haul long trains anyhow.

I maintain that the main problem is one of keeping all the drive wheels on the track - mine only has half of them on the track at any one time due to the ‘flex’ in the chassis - see my initial post on the bendy chassis. …

tac
www.ovgrs.org


Terry, sorry to hear about your #73. I gave this problem a careful consideration, and I think I have a solution. If you are not concerned with R1 rule, why not apply some superglue to the hinges in the middle - this will prevent the chassis from bending;-))), and the problem should be solved!! More seriously, I think that if the problem is as you described to Tamada-san at the Kichijoji meeting, ie. that the middle wheels go up, this essentially means that the motor blocks are not supported in the right place (middle of each block seems like the appropriate place for support). I have never unpacked my own #73 hoping that I will find a fool greater than myself who will buy it from me still in the original box. This is why I do not know how the motor blocks are supported. If you could send me a photo that would help me think about it - I am not aware of any #73 around here to be inspected (perhaps Aster warned local customers not to buy that piece of junk…). I also do not think Aster had anything to do with the drive. The drives were made by Aster in first four Limited Edition locomotives. I only have three of them and there is nothing wrong with them, in fact it would be difficult to find a better one than that on the K-28. 2-10-2 has problems due to the plastic wheels of poor quality, they are not Aster’s though. Starting from the NG13, LGB insisted on their own drives, apparently they felt they should blame Aster for the troubles with the Harz. But the all plastic drives on the NG13 are OK. The first total failure is the #73. So why don’t you bring your dead one here, I am sure we will fix it with Tamada-san, best wishes from TOkyo, Zubi

#50

Good news from Germany:
This morning I got an email-message from the LGB-service, that my loco is now repaired and pulls four (!) waggons on a rough test-track with a steep hill (more then 3%).
They changed the mechanism against a new one from the ‘plastic’ mike and now it seems to work.
That sounds great and I will pick it up next week. Meanwhile I rebuilt my layout and brought the grade down to something like 3%. Now, let’s hope, this beautiful loco will climb my hills also.

Regards from Germany
Michael

#51

Do let us know how it works.

#52

Post deleted.

#53
Quote:
...Dear Mr Michael - please be advised that your 3% grade is still one degree steeper than the steepest maximum gradient recommended for a model adhesion locomotive that is not geared like a Shay...
Over on this side of the pond, the general recommendation is 4% or less for grades. I like to recommend 2% or less for live steam railroads, though Jack Verducci's railroad seems to put the nail in that coffin, also. Technically speaking, all of our locomotives (with the exception of rod-driven live steamers) are geared locos, so grades up to 4% aren't really an issue. Naturally, it's always best to keep your grades to a minimum, but a 4% grade isn't anything to worry about.

Later,

K

#54

And it works…

Just back from Nuremberg, where I collected my #73, I want to report that it works now perfectly.
They have a pretty steep test-track there (much more then 4%!), even in a curve with radius 1, and the loco pulls four 4-axle-passenger-waggons without any problem up the hill.
They added two rubberrings to the front wheels, replaced some parts (don’t ask me what exactly…), added extra wiring to the tender, where they replaced the axles by the one with the electric pick-ups and it now really pulls like the prototype.
So, I’m completely happy with this solution now and whenever it stops raining here, I will place this fine loco on my layout and watch it pulling four waggons and more up my own ‘White Pass’ just like the prototype still does.
Greeting from Germany
Michael

#55

Now you have to post pictures…:slight_smile:

#56

All hail the fallen flags… lol