Large Scale Central

Arch Bar Truck

Modeling
#1

http://largescalecentral.com/albums/view/12199#/albums/photo/view/album_id/12199/photo_id/108725

So I am thinking about making these trucks. They are wood beam arch bars. Now I don’t know much about these. I do have a line drawing of this truck. but I am having a bit of trouble understanding what I am looking at. Do they have springs on both sides? or is one side sprung and the other side hinged? The way the drawing looks it is only hinged on one side. I will post the drawing when I get access to it. Can someone explain the anatomy of the of a wood beam arch bar to me.

Also what is the necessity of having a real sprung truck on our models? If it needs to be sprung can I get little leaf springs or make them?

devon

#2

Your link is to a private page I can’t see.

No, you don’t need springs in your truck, but they’re nice.

Always seems to me that you want your train somewhat floppy. Follows bad track better that way.

#3

I can’t see the photo (says it’s a private album), but you don’t need sprung trucks in large scale. Many trucks are rigid. The trick is making sure they have enough play to handle twists in the track. That means one truck being able to pivot around the kingpin, and rock up and down as well as side to side. The other truck should be able to pivot and rock up and down, but not side to side. This gives you what amounts to a 3-point suspension, which is very stable.

Sprung trucks are nice, but the springs on a lot of the sprung trucks I’ve seen are really too stiff to actually serve any intended purpose. Even on the trucks I have that are sprung, I try to maintain the 3-point suspension mentioned above so they track well.

BTW, if you want sprung trucks, there’s a guy on ebay selling Delton truck parts (4’ wheelbase in 1:20.3). I use Hartford Products’ .154" springs in them and Bachmann 31mm wheels. You could also use Sierra Valley steel wheels.

Later,

K

#4

Ok I had set everything to just me. Wasn’t thinking when I did it. I am new bear with me. You should be able to see it now.

#5

The idea would be to make them. As long as they don’t need t be sprung I think I can do it. These particular ones used leaf springs as opposed to coils which prompted me to ask. They seem a simple enough design that if they could be rigid (not mounted rigid, but the truck itself being all glued together) I could make them out of brass bar stock and a piece of styrene for the bolster. I just think it would enhance the detail and be fun to make.

#6

Yes, they would have springs on both sides of the truck if that is what you mean. They look like leaf springs, so they would be symmetrical, with a hinge pin outside and inside of the side frame.

The concept of sprung trucks in model railroading will draw out all kinds of answers. I like my trucks more ridged, they seam to track better for me. Others will say the opposite, that sprung trucks track better. Its all in what works for you.

#7

David Maynard said:

Yes, they would have springs on both sides of the truck if that is what you mean. They look like leaf springs, so they would be symmetrical, with a hinge pin outside and inside of the side frame.

The concept of sprung trucks in model railroading will draw out all kinds of answers. I like my trucks more ridged, they seam to track better for me. Others will say the opposite, that sprung trucks track better. Its all in what works for you.

thanks david,
I did finally figure out that they were sprung on both sides of the truck which is what I assumed but the drawing had me second guessing myself. I’ll include it here when I get home and maybe someone can walk me through it.

#8

The pic shows what appears to me to be either passenger trucks, or caboose trucks. Some RRs put older Passenger trucks under their caboose to give a “softer ride” for the crew.

These are the trucks that I cast for myself.

#9

Dave Taylor said:

The pic shows what appears to me to be either passenger trucks, or caboose trucks. Some RRs put older Passenger trucks under their caboose to give a “softer ride” for the crew.

These are the trucks that I cast for myself.

Actually these are brand new tender trucks. This is the Baldwin builders photo. It is the same locomotive that is my Avatar.
Yours are nice castings. If I decide not to build these from brass bar stock and a real wood beam I might just ask you to pour me a couple sets :-).

My idea if I decide to do it is actually build them like they would really be built. Use brass bar stock and a piece of red wood for the beam. Use some 00-9 bolts and make them as authentic as possible. I am kid of a glutton that way. I haven’t committed to this yet, thought.

#10

Ok I have a question. Why when I quote someone does my response show up in the white box as if it is part of their post.

#11

Devon Sinsley said:

Dave Taylor said:

The pic shows what appears to me to be either passenger trucks, or caboose trucks. Some RRs put older Passenger trucks under their caboose to give a “softer ride” for the crew.

These are the trucks that I cast for myself.

Actually these are brand new tender trucks. This is the Baldwin builders photo. It is the same locomotive that is my Avatar.
Yours are nice castings. If I decide not to build these from brass bar stock and a real wood beam I might just ask you to pour me a couple sets :-).

My idea if I decide to do it is actually build them like they would really be built. Use brass bar stock and a piece of red wood for the beam. Use some 00-9 bolts and make them as authentic as possible. I am kid of a glutton that way. I haven’t committed to this yet, thought.

Actually these are brand new tender trucks. This is the Baldwin builders photo. It is the same locomotive that is my Avatar.
Yours are nice castings. If I decide not to build these from brass bar stock and a real wood beam I might just ask you to pour me a couple sets (http://largescalecentral.com/application/modules/Chat/externals/images/smile.png).

My idea if I decide to do it is actually build them like they would really be built. Use brass bar stock and a piece of red wood for the beam. Use some 00-9 bolts and make them as authentic as possible. I am kid of a glutton that way. I haven’t committed to this yet, thought.

#12

Ok figured it out

#13

Here is the Diagram of the wood bolster arch bar I want to duplicate.

http://largescalecentral.com/albums/photo/view/album_id/12199/photo_id/108742

No how do I post the picture itself here instead of a link?

#14

If you are going to build those out of brass and redwood are you going to put real springs on them?

#15

#16

Devon Sinsley said:

Here is the Diagram of the wood bolster arch bar I want to duplicate.

http://largescalecentral.com/albums/photo/view/album_id/12199/photo_id/108742

No how do I post the picture itself here instead of a link?

In the post reply box there is a click box with a tree in it, third from the right, top row. Click on it, paste the URL of your photo in the first space, click the do-it-button, and, voila!

#17

Doug Arnold said:
If you are going to build those out of brass and redwood are you going to put real springs on them?

Doug that’s the rub. The prototype truck is a leaf spring affair. Unless I can figure out how to make real leaf springs (I am not sure I want to) then I would either have to sacrifice authenticity for practicality and put in coils or I leave it unsprung (is that a word). That’s why I asked the question on whether or not sprung trucks were deemed necessary. In HO I have used both and see little difference in actual ride. So far the only replies to that question have been that unsprung works fine. So right now I am thinking to make them rigid (not sprung).

#18

I agree. I have an old LGB cattle car that has sprung trucks and I can’t tell any difference. I think we’re the only one that might notice. And the word is Might!

#19

Doug Arnold said:
I agree. I have an old LGB cattle car that has sprung trucks and I can’t tell any difference. I think we’re the only one that might notice. And the word is Might!

The only reason, and I mean that seriously, that I switched to sprung trucks in HO was because they looked better in my opinion.

#20

Sprung Trucks:

I too used sprung trucks on my HO equipment because it looked better. And I use them, when I can find them, on the Fn3 (Large Scale) equipment. Why, because they track better! Fewer derailments.

The original supplier was Delton who got gobbled up by Aristo Craft and they did continue to make them for a while and then stopped! And now they too are gone!

The last group I found on eBay I bought on the spot. For springs I use Precision Scale No. 360. Axle sets are getting harder to find do to business and age of those running them. This I understand but I feel there are sales to be made. I am hoping one of our own with a 3 D Printer can maybe do some in the plastic part of the operation!

Paul Austin