Large Scale Central

A tale of two houses

House #1

A 20 room mansion with 8 bathrooms, a pool, a pool house, and a separate
guest house, all heated by gas. In one month this residence consumes more
energy than the average American household does in a year. The average bill
for electricity and natural gas runs over $2400. In natural gas alone, this
property consumes more than 20 times the national average for an American
home. This house is not situated in a Northern or Midwestern “snow belt”
area. It’s in the South.

   ~~~

House #2

Designed by an architecture professor at a leading national university, this
house incorporates every “green” feature current home construction can
provide. The house is 4,000 square feet with 4 bedrooms and is nestled on a
high prairie in the American southwest. A central closet in the house holds
geothermal heat-pumps drawing ground water through pipes sunk 300 feet into
the ground. The water, usually 67 degrees F., heats the house in the winter
and cools it in the summer. The system uses no fossil fuels such as oil or
natural gas and it consumes one-quarter electricity required for a
conventional heating/cooling system. Rainwater from the roof is collected
and funneled into a 25,000 gallon underground cistern. Wastewater from
showers, sinks and toilets goes into underground purifying tanks and then
into the cistern. The collected water then irrigates the land surrounding
the house. Surrounding flowers and shrubs native to the area enable the
property to blend into the surrounding rural landscape.

HOUSE #1 is outside of Nashville, Tennessee; it is the abode of the
“environmentalist” Al Gore.

HOUSE #2 is on a ranch near Crawford, Texas; it is the residence of the
President of the United States, George W. Bush.

An “inconvenient truth”?

Steve:

Great information. I’d really like to use this. Can you please supply the resource?

Thanks,

Jerry Bowers
(Vast Right Wing Co-Conspirator)

When you do comparisons, be sure you look into usages beyond just living quarters…such as businesses that are run from these homes…number of employees there and how long they are there each day. You also might want to do a check to see a % of improvement in usage of resources each has undergone in the last 5 or so years. You might also want to average in the energy usage of 1600 Pennsylvania St. while Dubya lives there. If you are going to spread “Inconvenient Truth”, get the WHOLE story and not distort it to suit your agenda.

Who was it that said, “there are lies, damn lies, and statistics.”?

Gore’s house is in an old section of Nashville, and–presumably–was built in an era before “green” building was in fashion. Anyone who lives in an older house knows how leaky and inefficient “vintage” construction inherently is. He (his staff) has made changes to improve the energy efficiency of the property. Nashville’s climate is inherently hot and muggy in the summer, and chilly in the winter, making it inherently one of the more energy-using regions in the country. Gore also houses his staff–full time–at the residence. Now, Gore could choose to live in a more “green” house, but before you cast too many stones, ask yourself if you’d be willing to give up the comforts you have around you just to live in a “greener” house.

Bush’s residence was built in 2000, using the most modern construction techniques available. The 1600 acre property was purchased in 1999, during W’s presidential campaign. Critics argue that it was done to give W a “down home” background. Take that for what it is–one interpretation of a series of actions. He didn’t live there prior to the election. Regardless of the motivations for the move, if you’ve ever been through Crawford–especially prior to 2000–you best not have blinked. A “metropolis” it ain’t. The Bush property’s location pretty much mandates some form of green construction. Recycling the wastewater is the alternative to building a simple septic tank. Tapping into geothermal energy is also a no-brainer if such energy exists to tap into. (The exact square-footage of Bush’s Crawford ranch is uncertain. On-line estimates have it from anywhere from 4,000 to 10,000 square feet, roughly the same size as Gore’s place.) Bush’s property also includes a pool.

(As an aside, compare Gore’s Nashville residence to the Bush family’s “compound” in Maine, or their Houston residence.)

Now, I no more believe “An Inconvenient Truth” than I believe Tony Snow. But before one starts heaping hypocritical labels around, one needs to look at more than just lies, damn lies, and statistics.

Later,

K

Steve Featherkile said:
House #1

A 20 room mansion with 8 bathrooms, a pool, a pool house, and a separate
guest house, all heated by gas. In one month this residence consumes more
energy than the average American household does in a year. The average bill
for electricity and natural gas runs over $2400. In natural gas alone, this
property consumes more than 20 times the national average for an American
home. This house is not situated in a Northern or Midwestern “snow belt”
area. It’s in the South.

   ~~~

House #2

Designed by an architecture professor at a leading national university, this
house incorporates every “green” feature current home construction can
provide. The house is 4,000 square feet with 4 bedrooms and is nestled on a
high prairie in the American southwest. A central closet in the house holds
geothermal heat-pumps drawing ground water through pipes sunk 300 feet into
the ground. The water, usually 67 degrees F., heats the house in the winter
and cools it in the summer. The system uses no fossil fuels such as oil or
natural gas and it consumes one-quarter electricity required for a
conventional heating/cooling system. Rainwater from the roof is collected
and funneled into a 25,000 gallon underground cistern. Wastewater from
showers, sinks and toilets goes into underground purifying tanks and then
into the cistern. The collected water then irrigates the land surrounding
the house. Surrounding flowers and shrubs native to the area enable the
property to blend into the surrounding rural landscape.

HOUSE #1 is outside of Nashville, Tennessee; it is the abode of the
“environmentalist” Al Gore.

HOUSE #2 is on a ranch near Crawford, Texas; it is the residence of the
President of the United States, George W. Bush.

An “inconvenient truth”?


It is heartwarming for this longtime, leftwing, pinko, liberal, tree hugging Greenie to see that the leader of the Free World is acknowledging the reality of Global Warming and Climate Change as portrayed in the “Inconvenient Truth”. It is even more pleasing to see that G W Bush is embracing and putting into effect at least some of the practices long espoused by the Green movement.

I am certain that once the current administration realises, like Big Arnie has in CA, that you can save the World and make a bunch of money at the same time, Dubya will make his position even more credible, by encouraging his administration to adopt laws that will encourage/force the rest of society to adopt the same planet saving ideas as he is showing in Crawford.
.

First, Dubya has to come to the understanding that “voluntary” will never work for Big Business. They will cut corners, cheat, pollute and do anything else to cut corners and make a dime for themselves.

Well, I will finally admit that global warming is here.

In one of the hottest corners of the state, in the middle of August, it got all the way up to 76 F today, and will get down to 36 F tonight.

Yessir, global warming is upon us.

Oh, yeah, where are all those her-i-caines :smiley: that were supposed to happen? Hmmmmmmm?

Global warming, my a$$!

Just another ploy to raise our taxes, doncha know.

Steve Featherkile said:
Well, I will finally admit that global warming is here.

In one of the hottest corners of the state, in the middle of August, it got all the way up to 76 F today, and will get down to 36 F tonight.

Yessir, global warming is upon us.

Oh, yeah, where are all those her-i-caines :smiley: that were supposed to happen? Hmmmmmmm?

Global warming, my a$$!

Just another ploy to raise our taxes, doncha know.


So, does that mean you don’t really agree with Dubya and his Green credentials after all, and you only put up the story of the two houses to have a partisan party political shot at Al Gore?

Remember the ventilators from the now defunct company?? The Republicans have their share of ventilators too. :smiley:

Gentlemen,
Global warming is the least of your environmental concerns.
Right now, the unexplained loss of honey bees should be a top priority, since almost 35% of the food we consume relies exclusively on the little honey bee for pollination.
In my flower and fruit garden, I have noticed a dramatic decrease! My ornamental onions are usually covered with bees. This year there were only a few. My wife grows a sunflower patch for winter bird food. And this year there are only a few bees. I doubt she will get any seeds this year. My next door neighbor only got 1/3 or less apples on his trees this year.
Think about it…

TOG

It never ceases to amaze me that some people take it upon themselves to act as advocates for the energy industry as soon as anyone mentions global warming. They take a single cool day as proof of the fallacy of a global phenomenon and then resort to making personal attacks on Al Gore in the apparent belief that he is somehow connected to the phenomenon. They also seem threatened by the possibility of having a car or a fridge that costs half as much to run, apparently because they enjoy giving money to oil companies. If these people are going to fight to defend the profits of energy companies, they should at least be on the payroll. If not, then they are suckers.

When I think about the pick-up trucks in the 60s and early 70s, I note that today’s trucks are better in every measurable way. Today’s trucks are bigger, more luxurious, more powerful, and use about half the fuel. A lot of this increased efficiency is due to the introduction of legislation to limit fuel consumption and pollution.

The oil/vehicle companies will not do this of their own accord. It’s simply not in their interest to have us using less fuel. Their greed knows no bounds and certainly takes precedence over the welfare of the human race or the planet. And when we ask the government to legislate more efficient standards for vehicles and appliances, the volunteer energy company advocates jump in and claim it’s a government plot to raise taxes.

Personally, I want vehicles and appliances that use half the energy. I’d even prefer to pay half the money to energy companies and the other half in taxes rather than paying all to the energy companies. With taxes, at least, I see some return: roads, schools, libraries, etc.

I just don’t see a down side to recognising global warming and acting accordingly.

John Bouck said:
Gentlemen, Global warming is the least of your environmental concerns. Right now, the unexplained loss of honey bees should be a top priority, since almost 35% of the food we consume relies exclusively on the little honey bee for pollination.
Do we know yet that the decline in the bee population is not related to climate change?

My suspicion, for which I have zero evidence, is that the sudden widespread use of radio transmitters (ie. cell phones) may have something to do with it.

TonyWalsham said:
Steve Featherkile said:
Well, I will finally admit that global warming is here.

In one of the hottest corners of the state, in the middle of August, it got all the way up to 76 F today, and will get down to 36 F tonight.

Yessir, global warming is upon us.

Oh, yeah, where are all those her-i-caines :smiley: that were supposed to happen? Hmmmmmmm?

Global warming, my a$$!

Just another ploy to raise our taxes, doncha know.


So, does that mean you don’t really agree with Dubya and his Green credentials after all, and you only put up the story of the two houses to have a partisan party political shot at Al Gore?

Tony, you found me out!

I’m still waiting for the debate to occur.

Warren Mumpower said:
Remember the ventilators from the now defunct company?? The Republicans have their share of ventilators too. :D
Whew! Blow wind, blow!

Blow, wind! come, wrack! At least we’ll die with harness on our back.

:lol:

John Bouck said:
Gentlemen, Global warming is the least of your environmental concerns. Right now, the unexplained loss of honey bees should be a top priority, since almost 35% of the food we consume relies exclusively on the little honey bee for pollination. In my flower and fruit garden, I have noticed a dramatic decrease! My ornamental onions are usually covered with bees. This year there were only a few. My wife grows a sunflower patch for winter bird food. And this year there are only a few bees. I doubt she will get any seeds this year. My next door neighbor only got 1/3 or less apples on his trees this year. Think about it...................

TOG


John, the scientists say that the bees are suffering from a cyclical infestation of mites. It happens infrequently, but this this seems to be the year.

I agree, it is a problem, but I suspect that they will be back full force next year.

Steve Featherkile said:
Warren Mumpower said:
Remember the ventilators from the now defunct company?? The Republicans have their share of ventilators too. :D
Whew! Blow wind, blow!

Blow, wind! come, wrack! At least we’ll die with harness on our back.

:lol:


Steve :lol:

Are you at it again??? there is a gale of hot air coming up the Valley!! :lol: I was hoping for some moderate weather for the weekend! No such luck, Steve is at it again! :smiley: :smiley: :lol:

Kevin Morris said:
It never ceases to amaze me that some people take it upon themselves to act as advocates for the energy industry as soon as anyone mentions global warming. They take a single cool day as proof of the fallacy of a global phenomenon and then resort to making personal attacks on Al Gore in the apparent belief that he is somehow connected to the phenomenon. They also seem threatened by the possibility of having a car or a fridge that costs half as much to run, apparently because they enjoy giving money to oil companies. If these people are going to fight to defend the profits of energy companies, they should at least be on the payroll. If not, then they are suckers.

When I think about the pick-up trucks in the 60s and early 70s, I note that today’s trucks are better in every measurable way. Today’s trucks are bigger, more luxurious, more powerful, and use about half the fuel. A lot of this increased efficiency is due to the introduction of legislation to limit fuel consumption and pollution.

The oil/vehicle companies will not do this of their own accord. It’s simply not in their interest to have us using less fuel. Their greed knows no bounds and certainly takes precedence over the welfare of the human race or the planet. And when we ask the government to legislate more efficient standards for vehicles and appliances, the volunteer energy company advocates jump in and claim it’s a government plot to raise taxes.

Personally, I want vehicles and appliances that use half the energy. I’d even prefer to pay half the money to energy companies and the other half in taxes rather than paying all to the energy companies. With taxes, at least, I see some return: roads, schools, libraries, etc.

I just don’t see a down side to recognising global warming and acting accordingly.


Kevin, I see that you drank the Kool-Aid.

Who is acting as an advocate for the energy industry? I am as pissed off as you at the price gouging going on.

That said, where are the greenies advocating nuclear energy? “Oh,” they say, “it is too dangerous!” Well, tell that to the coal miners in West Virginia and Indiana. How many people have died in the last month at a nuclear power plant? Zero! How many have ever died anywhere outside of the former Soviet Union as a result of Nuclear Power? Zero! How many die each year digging coal out of the mountains each year? The reason the greenies can speak against nuclear power is because they know that they will never have to work in a coal mine.

I’m all in favor of having appliances and automobiles that use half the energy, as long as I don’t have to pay more than twice the “savings” up front in increased retail costs.

Regarding increased taxes and roads, that doesn’t happen much around here. We in Spokane are not in the “Peoples Republic of Seattle.” We don’t get muck benefit from our gas tax dollars.

The down side to recognizing global warming and acting accordingly, is what if the Kool-Aid drinkers are wrong? Algore says that the debate is over. There never was a debate. Whenever someone asks him to explain his positions, he ducks out the back door. When are we really going to have that debate?

When you go back and look at the scientific predictions that were made about “Global Warming” back in the late 80’s and early 90s, none of those predictions have taken place! I challenge you to name one of the original predictions that have occurred.

1934 was the warmest year on record. How does that play into your “Global Warming” scenario?

Yesterdays coolness was not an isolated event. The same thing occurred last year. By mid August, the temps had cooled to 70s and low 80s, with freezing lows by late August. I see that the same thing seems to be happening again this year. When I was growing up, and even just a few years ago, mid-August was high 90’s and low 100’s around these parts. But I guess global warming is causing this, right?

Even if “Global Warming” were happening, man has nothing to do with it. We could not influence global climate even if we put our best scientists and all of our global treasure on the problem. Do you remember Mt Pinatoubo back in 1990 or so? More greenhouse gases were passed into the atmosphere by that one event than man has put into the atmosphere, ever!

Do you realize that water vapor makes up 98% of the so called greenhouse gases? The noxious gases that the greenies are so worried about make up 0.4%. You can look that up, if you like.

Ok, soap box off. I’ve run out of steam. Oh, no! I am responsible for part of that 98%

I’ll go to my room, now.

Steve Featherkile said:
TonyWalsham said:
Steve Featherkile said:
Well, I will finally admit that global warming is here.

In one of the hottest corners of the state, in the middle of August, it got all the way up to 76 F today, and will get down to 36 F tonight.

Yessir, global warming is upon us.

Oh, yeah, where are all those her-i-caines :smiley: that were supposed to happen? Hmmmmmmm?

Global warming, my a$$!

Just another ploy to raise our taxes, doncha know.


So, does that mean you don’t really agree with Dubya and his Green credentials after all, and you only put up the story of the two houses to have a partisan party political shot at Al Gore?

Tony, you found me out!

I’m still waiting for the debate to occur.


You are bit slow my lad.

The debate is over.
It seems even your beloved Dubya has seen the light.
It took an Austrian ex body builder to show him the way.

Or is big Arnie really a closet Democrat? :wink:

Hans-Joerg Mueller said:
Steve :lol:

Are you at it again??? there is a gale of hot air coming up the Valley!! :lol: I was hoping for some moderate weather for the weekend! No such luck, Steve is at it again! :smiley: :smiley: :lol:


Oh, dear. I’ve been hulled between wind and water.

HJ, things were just too peaceful around here. I had to stir the pot.

The devil made me do it!

:smiley:

TonyWalsham said:
Steve Featherkile said:
TonyWalsham said:
So, does that mean you don't really agree with Dubya and his Green credentials after all, and you only put up the story of the two houses to have a partisan party political shot at Al Gore?
Tony, you found me out!

I’m still waiting for the debate to occur.


You are bit slow my lad.

The debate is over.
It seems even your beloved Dubya has seen the light.
It took an Austrian ex body builder to show him the way.

Or is big Arnie really a closet Democrat? :wink:


Arnie is a member of the Kennedy clan. Follow the money. He is out of the closet.

The debate has not occurred. So, if it has never happened, how can it be over? Only in a Kool-Aid drinkers mind, I guess.

I, too live in an environmentally sound house. It is even recycled. Its first life was as a WWII barracks. It was purchased for a dollar (they went further, back then), moved on site, taken down to its bones and rebuild as a solar friendly home. I have natural heating a cooling from underground piping. Demand hot water. Wrap around porch that keeps the sun out in supper, and allows it in during winter. No windows on the North side.

I’m all in favor of saving a buck whenever I can.

So, it would seem, is W.

Algore, one would think, would set the example, but so far, he has failed miserably.