I am attempting to repaint a couple of LGB cars. I’ve cleaned them up and have sprayed white Rustoleum primer, the 2x coverage that says adheres to plastic. However when masking off areas and I cut the tape off with an exacto knife the primer is peeling right off…looking for solutions so I can continue the project.
Thanks,
Richard
Part of the answer might involve what you did to the LGB car plastic before applying paint to it, what was that?
Forrest, I removed all of the detail parts and then rinsed the bare car in warm water using a sponge. With it dry I sprayed two coats of primer each within an hour of each other as directed on the spray can directions.
Richard, you might have sanded the cars lightly to give the paint more “tooth.” And maybe wait a little longer before removing the tape. Some folks recommend waiting for the odor of the paint to go away. I usually don’t have the patience for that, though.
Dick, I painted the primer about a week ago and just started masking tonight. I’m using blue painters tape by 3M and creasing it in corners then cutting off the ends with a sharp exacto…I’m applying very little pressure if that helps at all to know.
I did think about sanding lightly but didn’t actually do it. I may try that. I want to get a good paint job done but am worried that if the primer isn’t solid on the surface I’ll problems later down the road with chipping, etc.
Richard Mynderup said:
… but am worried that if the primer isn’t solid on the surface I’ll problems later down the road with chipping, etc.
Oh, there’s no need to worry, it will happen.
Someone’s plastic primer in a spray can which I’m not going to go find right now to determine whether it is Krylon or Rustoleum mentioned wiping the plastic with a damp cloth of mineral spirits or something before spraying.
Looked up Rustoleum’s 2x primer direction on their website and that was not mentioned.
What they do say is,
TIP:
Some plastics made of polyethylene such as plastic storage containers are manufactured in a way that may hinder maximum paint adhesion.
and
NOTE:
On plastic maximum paint adhesion and durability is achieved in 5-7 days.
which plays well with this;
Dick, I painted the primer about a week ago and just started masking tonight.
Which brings up question of what specific plastic did LGB use.
I scrub my stuff with Bon ami or Commit cleanser-to clean the surface and “break” the surface of the paint that is already on the cars. As for “plastic” paints, I have had limited success with them. I just use the regular Krylon primer. Maybe it attacks the plastic just a little, but if it does, its not enough to notice.
I used a sandblaster on my LGB plastics and then rinse them and place them in my dishwasher. Paint sticks great when doing this.
SO, just like when gluing LGB plastic, a rough surface plus very clean makes for great paint or glue contact.
Richard
I have had the same issue as you on both plastic and metal. Unfortunately there is no 100% guarantee. The best luck I have had is with extreme preparation.
I think everyone above has the right idea. A thorough washing with a good oil dissolving soap (I use Dawn) in conjunction with a mild abrasive. I often use toothpaste (one of the gritty ones like Crest regular) but have had good results from Comet and Bon Ami cleansers. A final wipe with rubbing alcohol or enamel reducer should get you as clean a surface as possible.
As for paint I prefer Krylon for colors but use Rustoleum for primer when needed.
I know the can says 5-7 days but I generally let a project sit for a month or more. I am a proponent of the “if you can smell it it ain’t cured” crowd.
When taping off I use 1/4 chart tape. You get this stuff at Michael’s or at Office Max. It is barely sticky but leaves a fine edge. Don’t stretch it as you unroll it. It will want to shrink back causing it to come loose. Unroll the length you need by letting it hang and then carefully place it on the item. I then put the masking tape on the chart tape usually with paper towel for the rest of the mask. This way nothing with a really strong adhesive ever touches the model.
Hope this helps and I am looking forward to seeing your creation.
Well over the years I have painted a bunch of my train stuff I mean 40+ years and have always used Krylon spray paint the original paint didn’t have primer in it like the new stuff does and the only time I used primer was just for color. Found that the major portion of LGB stuff is colored plastic with no paint and is important to wash the mold release agent off before painting and I use Dawn. Tamiya makes an excellent masking tape for models in at least 2 different widths that wont pull up previous paint, new or old. I found that smooth surfaces glue better than ruff but what ever you are happy with is fine and for LGB, Kalamazoo, REA, USA Pola and piko I use model masters, and Tamiya wicking cement and have had great luck with both, you just have to support (clamp) the pieces until the glue dries as it melts the parts into 1. I’ve also used a CA type that also melts but has the advantage of being fast that is sold by ACE hardware and made by “surehold” called plastic surgery and is very cheap. Bill
Yeah…I’m going to have to go back to the drawing board and try and remove all the primer. I started by taking the blue painters tape where I had masked and most of the primer peeled right off with it. I’ll get everything good and clean and washed as some of you had suggested and see if I have better luck.
I appreciate the tips and tricks and suggestions!
Richard
Oh dear, Richard, getting that thing stripped is going to be a job.
And that brings up the paint stripping question …
Back to talking spray can primers:
I’ve never had something from LGB and whatever plastic is their favorite flavor, but have painted Bachmann, HLW, G scale trains, other scale trains, model rockets, wargame miniatures, and plastic models, in their various plastics, styrene, ABS, polycarbonate, polyester resin, and who knows what else. (but nothing in a spray can sticks reliably to those little 1/72, 1/76, OO/HO scale army guys from Airfix, they are polyethelyene or something like it)
My 3 favorite hardware store or automotive store spray can primers are, in no particular order: a white colored one from Rustoleum they call a Bonding Primer; good old cheap flat white enamel from Walmart’s store brand works surprisingly well for me, and both Krylon and Rustoleum have played well chemically on top of it; and, then, yes, it says “Filler Primer” but Duplicolor’s automotive primer in grey has worked well for me and gone on pleasantly thinly for something named “filler”.
Back to surface prep, sometime way back, late 1970s, early 1980s, I got started scrubbing models and miniatures with a soft tooth brush and things like Clorox’s Soft Scrub cleanser or other brand equivalents.
If I had the health and money I’d get a couple LGB cars to experiment on myself. (if I had the health and money there are a lot of things I get or do, but that’s a topic for another place and time)
For stripping plastic in the past I have used good old fashioned brake fluid, I have never had it attack plastic but sure as hell lifts paint.
I have just painted an LGB coach body I just rubbed it lightly with fine sand paper then applied a cheap spray can primer then over coated it with some left over paint I used to spray my aluminium flyscreens.
Have you considered a plastic etch primer possibly like this one its used to prime plastic car bumpers. https://www.plastikote.com/products/Primer/Etching-Primer.html or this one https://www.plastikote.com/products/Primer/Plastic-Primer.html
Ditch the rustoleum and get krylon …release agents have nothing to do with it because the car was already painted at the factory so this is a repaint.I’m sure it’s washed fine and yes perhaps some sanding tooth would make it better but I doubt it. If you would like to try a test on the other cars stick one in the fridge overnight and see if the primer cures/adheres.
Well, this hobby is proving be a lot about trial and error and learning…
I have two of these LGB cars…both purchased at the same time. After reading about mold release agents from some of you I decided to try putting on masking tape on the second car. I ripped the tape off and the primer paint did not come off like the first car. I then remembered when I got home and opened both up I was surprised that one was dirty/dusty like it had been on display. The other was pristine. So I’m now wondering if the dirty/dusty one had been cleaned at some prior time. I will continue to do a little tape test on the second car but the paint so far does not come off…hopefully I’m able solve this through simply stripping the first car back to original paint and then cleaning the heck out of it before applying new primer.
Will certainly let you know what I find out.
Richard
Good luck
On facebook there are several guys that dip their locomotive shells and cars in 91% alcohol for about 24 hours or so to remove the old paint before repainting them.
A couple of tips -
Avoid most household branded detergents when cleaning prior to painting, they contain oils and other surfactants that will leave a residue that will act as a barrier to paints. There is a UK brand of washing up liquid that uses the slogan - “The hands that do dished can be soft as your face…” How ? Lanolin. In the UK we have a basic unbranded household cleaning agent called “washing soda” (not the caustic kind!). If you are going to wash the surface use this.
The other tip is regards to mild abrasives, like toothpaste, the problem with some of these is that rather than abrading the surface you end up polishing it - car paint restorers fall into this group too. MicroScale make a product sold as plastic polish that is this stuff repackaged at a massive profit. Use a 1000 - 1200 grade/grit wet and dry to “key” the surface to be painted.
Some of those mild abrasives, yes. Things like the cleanser I mentioned will visibly un-polish transparent parts, and observably destroy the reflective shine of plastic model parts fresh out of the box.
Oh! On the alcohol - if you have done kitbashing or scratchbuilding with acrylic plastics, it is understood that alcohols and acrylic plastics get along rather poorly.
I can’t remember they exact whys and wherefores of it but the info is out there on the web.