Large Scale Central

Live Steam forum

General Discussion
#12

If you wish to try live steam , this is a good starter model , by Roundhouse . I posted this here rather than in Live Steam because not a lot of people look there , it seems .

It is normally sold without a tender , and is not this colour , but you have to admit it’s a pretty little thing . The sharp eyed among you will notice a bit of damage , caused by working in steam and hitting the scenery . It is a lovely thing to drive , the radio control is very precise , notwithstanding the statement above–it was being “run-in” at the time . If you have any questions , please ask . I will do my best to help . We have one of these bought as a kit , if anyone is interested I can post some pics of it part built . Mike

#13

So , judging by the above post with pics of a starter steamer , nobody is interested .
Perhaps that is why nobody knows where the Live Steam forum is . Ah , well , I did try .

#14

Mike,

I look at all postings that are marked “new”. Even in “Live Steam”. I’ve got a 2 cylinder shay and a portable live steam track that we set up today for the weekends Ops Session. I enjoy all steam engines, but sometimes I don’t know enough to comment. :wink:

#15

Ok…so you asked…

I like live steam locomotives, BUT…

Thge idea of a locomotive, running on live steam just like the prototype is an interesting toy to own and operate. But there lies the problem for me…OPERATION.

This Saturday/Sunday, I will be in Syracuse to attend the big Model railroad show at the Fairgrounds.

Around Syracuse and Rochester there are a good number of live steam enthusiasts. All of them great people, who I consider as friends.
My problem is that after watching a Shay or any other live steamer run around in a tight circle for more than a few minutes is just plain boring. This seems to please most live steamers, but to my mind it is a big waste of a good loco’s potential.

I know that a live steamer will haul a good load and can take part in the operation of a railroad, but most live steamers seem more interested in just the operation of the loco on level track and little else.

So…I’ll drop in and socialize, but hanging around as a Shay makes it’s umpteenth trip around a 10 foot loop of track, with or without cars, would slowly cause me to drift off to sleep.

Just my observations…

#16

I’m like Ric, I read everything marked “new”…and when it comes to live steam, I don’t know enough to ask a question. I got to see my first live steamers in operation at Marty’s in September. I still don’t know enough to know if they are viable enough to be operable on a model railroad or if they are just an expensive novelty toy.

Also understand that being an American I find colorful British locomotives to be a novelty themselves…odd looking critters. Steam locomotives are suppose to be big, black and dirty. But I look…and have an interest. I currently have no desire to own foreign outline steam locomotives, but if you present something, I’ll look, and admire…and move on to things that are closer to my own interests. By all means post away. I’ll be reading it for sure.

Warren

#17

Interesting ,
It seems that I am not the only one to read all the “new” stuff as it gets posted .Simply because I like trains and am interested to see what others are doing with them .
But Fred’s answer is very welcome , particularly because he raises a point about steamers and their “operation”
Fred says that he loses interest in a steamer going round in circles . So do I . I also lose interest in electrics doing the same . But is this the whole story ? Do all of you think that steamers are just set up , put on the track and run until they pant to a stop from lack of steam ? Regrettably , this is the way a heck of a lot of people imagine Live Steam .
Well , I can tell you that I for one have never run a live steamer which has not got basic radio control over direction and speed .
A quick look in the cab of the red loco above should make you wonder what the heck is all the gubbery in the cab ? It’s the control system , my dears . So next time you see a steamer aimlessly circling ,ask its “driver” if that’s all it is going to do . It may encourage him/her to finish the job .
The other point , you don’t know what questions to ask .
OK , here’s a few .
Is it the model of a prototype ?
Why is it that pretty colour ?
What does Lautoka mean ? —if you don’t understand this question , you did not look at the model properly .

There , off the cuff , three relevant questions .
More ?
What scale is it ?
What guage is it ?
How does the water get boiled up ?

I think that most people are not too keen on live steam , full stop . Period .
Well , you really do not know what you are missing . I am fortunate enough to run live steam and other radio controlled stuff , the radio does as much as is required except in my case I hate the continuous noise that seems to come from every blasted loco at exhibitions , so have no whistle sounds on board . I have even strangled the whistle sounds on my Accucraft electric stuff , the baying of a howling banshee each time the loco even moves an inch is plain irritating .

Whatever , in answer to Bob’s question about a live steam forum , I think he has his answer . NFI .

And the answer to the unspoken question ----$ 1500 on the rails , boiling ,under control

#18

I love em…just don’t have the time to post at the moment - same manufacturer as Mike’s loco…

Neil.

#19

Ah, Mikey…you and I could really “Operate” a railway…!!!

Noise gets to me also… I’ll just have to convert you over to Highland Park, Laphroaig, and Sheep Dip…!!!

   Fr.Fred
#20

One of the problems with the live steam gang is the way they promote their segment of the hobby. Their trains are rarely seen on operating layouts. Almost always they are seen on portable layouts that are nothing more than a loop. They spend an unusual amount of time fiddling with the thing, and then run it around in a loop chasing it’s tail. :frowning:

Maybe if live steamers would portray their creations as working locomotives capable of being a useful piece of machinery there would be more interest.

I guess I don’t ask some questions because I don’t care. Scale and guage don’t matter…unless I’m interested in buying one. I find the colorful ones “cute” and “interesting” but that’s about all I can say. For instance, I’ve commented about Niel Hay’s yellow locomotive before. It’s a neat looking locomotive, but it’s so far out from what I model that I can only look, admire and move on. Another more realistic problem with live steam, the locomotives that I would really like are just so far out of my affordability range that it’s useless to even think about them. But, when someone posts pictures and an article about operating an EBT live steam Mike on their fully seniced layout, they will have my absolute undivided attention :smiley:

#21

I have just read the messages on this subject concerning live steam (and 7/8" scale). On my outfit there are just two locomotives, a live steamer and a i/c locomotive. This is really all that a small industrial railway would have or need. I myself run the live steam engine on my garden railway in a realistic manner (manual-no radio control) and it has been made to look realistic, i.e. grubby and work-used! The locomotives pictured on this line of messages look like they belong to a tourist line with a good supply of steam-cleaning equipment. Its up to the individual person how he shows his engines but I never saw locomotives like that when I was a kid! I am not sure if a 7/8" section would work on this group or for that matter a live steam group, as judging by the web site’s I have visited scattered through the various sections you mostly seem ‘G’ scale modellers with more or less ‘straight out of the box’. Every man can do his own thing the way he wants to but I think there is a very large gulf between 7/8" and live steam and the average modeller on Large Scale Central.

#22

Yeah Bill but they tolerate us weirdos…you really need to post some pics over in here Bill…

#23

Bill ,
Not tourist line , just models of "as delivered " locos . Just have a look at some of the cane lines , they were quite well cleaned , some of them . I dirty up my quarry stuff , that keeps me happy .
Weathering a live steamer is a bit of a waste if the weathering gets wiped off during maintenance .

#24

Egads, young William…

To suggest that anything I run is straight out of the box would be a loooooong stretch.
True; I don’t weather anything; depending on real weather, and use, to improve the appearances, along with loads of normal dust. None of my stuff ever gets on the track without a number of upgrades and changes, to say nothing of not using track power.
I’m a bit like you, in that I only have the locos that I need to operate the railroad. My line being a bit more like a moderate size NG pike; it does require about 6-8 locomotives in order to serve the needs of the on line customers and bridge route traffic.

You suggest that on this web site, you think we are more “Out-of-the-box” type model railroaders. NOT by a long shot.; as compared to most other groups. In fact a lot don’t spend a lot of time here; according to their comments to me; because we seem to be too in depth as modellers, for their tastes. Out-of-the-boxers or “OTBers” seem to congrigate over where they find comfort with others of their like, or on the Aristo , or B’mann sites.

#25

Ferd,

Do you think the statement was meant to be “out of the box” or “outside the box”? I feel most of us are sitting outside the box of normal large scale toy train people and criminy look at Bart. Do you think anyone could fit him in a box? Even custom made? I mean the dude is definetly “one of a kind”, a true prototype. :wink:

Mr. Reynolds, I am honored by your presence. I’m working toward the 7/8’s world, but its going to be a long journey. Right now, I haven’t made it to 1:20.3, but I have gotten past the 1:22.5. Kinda stuck in the middle there, right now. I would also like to have just two engines, I just can’t force meself to give up any of them.

But I certainly would also enjoy the posting of some of your pictures and it just makes our leader, Mr. Bob, get real excited about that stuff.

#26

An interesting discussion - I think I lie somewhere between the two camps.

Yes, my steamers are clean. That’s because they’re new…

They don’t get cleaned other than a wipe down, and will weather naturally as they get run - which is often! I appreciate the Brit outline is of little interest to many in the USA, but they are all trains. Besides, the ‘yellow’ one is Australian…

My line is simple, so not a lot of ‘operation’ in the USA sense can take place, but I don’t charge around in circles either. My r/c locos are VERY controllable, and I switch with the consists after a few ‘miles’ of running, and go the other way around, change the order of the cars, cut some out to leave in the passing siding, meet with another train (battery powered) etc. Not operation like I do with my HO (car cards, waybills etc) but not this high speed tail chasing some LS people go in for - don’t understand that myself! It seems much more prevalent in the USA than the UK - not sure why. The standard gauge 1 crowd in the UK do soo to go more for this approach though, the narrow gauge types seem to prefer a more realistic line, but that is not a general rule.

My line isn’t ‘scenic’ in the way an indoor line is - that just is not the point of a ‘garden railway(road)’ - it’s just a different way of doing things. There are several British lines that are very scenic that I have seen in the UK garden rail magazine though, it’s just not my bag. Too much maintenance, too little time!

A raised line also has some benefits for access - I carry some old injuries that sometimes restrict my movement, and others have more significant mobility problems - so you have to consider that too.

Similarly, the whole scale/gauge/prototype thing is another aspect of large scale that is a hot potato to say the least. The ‘G Scale Mad’ forum I post on in the UK (worth a look!) currently is debating this point! I am in the ‘rule 8’ camp - it’s my railroad, I’ll do what I like on it! My indoor HO line is pretty prototypical (New Haven, 1950’s) but outside, anything goes.

Oops, rambling now. I’ll go.

Must be Fr Fred’s holy water?

Neil.

#27

I think the waters are getting muddied here .
The weather or not to thing is not cofined to steam , live or dead .
Operations are not confined to other than steam .
Good English is not confined to Englishmen .
A lot of the foregoing arguments, points , whatever you like to call them transcend the Steam / Not Steam discussion .
Try to keep to why you don’t like / like / love / drink/ can’t stand the smell of / steam .
I like steam because it gives a loco model more life .
I like steam because it attracts more attention from children than electric propulsion .
I like steam because on a cold winter day , I can warm my hands on the loco , and see clouds of steam wafting away on the crisp air .
I like steam because even when it is stationary , a loco exudes power , steam escaping sizzling and bubbling around tiny leaks .

BUT , I also have a ratio of 150:1 electrically driven models over live steam models .

I think basically I just like trains .

If they sizzle and get hot , I like 'em a bit better .

#28
Ric Golding said:
Ferd,

Do you think the statement was meant to be “out of the box” or “outside the box”? I feel most of us are sitting outside the box of normal large scale toy train people and criminy look at Bart. Do you think anyone could fit him in a box? Even custom made? I mean the dude is definetly “one of a kind”, a true prototype!


Geeeeee, I resemble that remark!!!

#29

OK Mike:-

I like full size trains.

I like full size steam trains best.

I can’t afford a full size train.

Therefore:-

I have model trains.

I like model steam trains best.

I can’t afford a lot of them.

My steam/sparkie ratio is similar to yours!

I still like trains.

All of 'em.

(Well, except that GM train of the future thing…and that UP worm-like job).

:wink:

NH

#30

Neil , another true train man . Welcome .

#31

Sorry if I sound ignorant but when you say “post some pictures” do you mean as attachments on these messages or a file in this group?? I ask this as I do not see a clickable button on these reply pages to attach one of my many 7/8" pictures!