Large Scale Central

Let's get serious for a minute

General Discussion
#21

Paul,

Those delightful little communities of cardboard boxes and tarpaper shacks weren’t called “Hoovervilles” for nothing. Just ask some of the people that were there. I think you are taking a lesson from the Liberals (my apologies Tony) and just seeing the part you want to see although I think you are definately right in your assessment of the present Congress. I’ve had several interesting exchanges with Mike O’Malley accusing him of this very thing. I call it “wearing blinders”.

I have no more desire to see a Demo victory in this election than you do. I do not trust the Obama-Pelosi-Reid-Kerry-Gore-etc. camp at all. In addition being an Independent I do not want to see one party, either party, in complete control of both houses of Congress and the Presidency all at once.

There is one heart-warming benefit of being an Independent; I get to argue with everybody. hehe!

Tony,
I believe Hoover did make some half-hearted proposals that were too little too late but the Republican mantra of the time was to let the markets run their course, oppose unionization and worker’s rights, protect private property (i.e. corporate property with troops if necessary) and “The business of America is business”. This isn’t evil but is decidedly one sided.

#22

Ladies and gentlemen; Who do you think wrote the history of that period? It sure as hell was not those who lived it! It was those who won the control and the money! And they were in power for many years after that! Mr. Walsham, remember the winner’s write the history.

Paul

#23

Paul,

I’m sorry but by your definition all history is false unless you agree with it. In every conflict there’s a winner and a loser and certainly initially at least there’s spin involved but unless you’re in a totalitarian regime eventually other versions come out. To not believe the written history of the period simply because the country was under control of an opposition party leaves you with no history at all. From whom can you ascertain the happenings and reasons of the times?

I have read heavily for example on WWII. I was always puzzled at how a cultured country like Germany could fall under the sway of an evil dictator like Hitler. I read a lot that was interpreted from German and was written by those that were actually there. I even trained with some ex-Hitler Youth when I was in the Air Force. Put together with info from our side a pretty clear picture emerged. I’m not trying to discuss Hitler but I found out enough at least to understand without condoning what happened at least in general. This would not have been possible if the “winners” only wrote the history. History is an ongoing adventure and not some stagnant thing that remains forever static and unchangeable. Remember too that there have been quite a number of Republican administrations in the interim that if, as you say the winners write the history, could have as easily rewritten it then.

As an Inde-dogone-pendent my biggest concern in this present election hasn’t been with the right-left rhetoric, we should expect that, but rather with the fact that we seem to be losing sight of the very most important thing of all…our right to be on the left or right or neither as we choose.

I have my political preferences just like everyone else but I’m not going to be lead around in blinders only seeing and hearing those things that appeal to me at the time. None of the candidates are perfect and neither are we and you can find fault with literally anyone if that’s the goal.

#24
E. Paul Austin said:
Ladies and gentlemen; Who do you think wrote the history of that period? It sure as hell was not those who lived it! It was those who won the control and the money! And they were in power for many years after that! Mr. Walsham, remember the winner's write the history.

Paul


Thanks for the above but it doesn’t answer the question.

Can you provide the evidence that Hoover actually proposed a solution and if so what happened to the proposals?

#25
Brian Donovan said:
TonyWalsham said:
Why is it that profits are privatised and the losses have to be socialised?
I agree. Let the government take over Mobil Exxon as a counterbalance.

-Brian :stuck_out_tongue:


That would certainly solve the problem in a very BIG WAY! :lol: :lol:

#26
TonyWalsham said:
Can you provide the evidence that Hoover actually proposed a solution and if so what happened to the proposals?
Citing the Reconstruction Finance Corporation as a "solution" is stretching it, but it was an attempt by Hoover to assist large corporations. Hoover also supported loans to groups of farmers (not individuals). Neither measure was effectual.

The Hawley-Smoot tariff, one of the highest in US history, was also conceived as part of the “solution”. Hoover had his doubts, but he went along with the proposal. The tariff probably made matters worse - a lot worse.

Hoover did support an increase in spending on public works, but it was small compared to the infrastructure programs FDR initiated.

Hoover foresaw the effects of speculation (i.e., banks lending with little prospect of repayment, effectively gambling with depositors’ money) in the mid-20s, and spoke out against it. Soon after he became President, he berated Wall Street about the big banks’ lending practices, but his remonstrations were greeted with defiance and derision.

Hoover was dead-set against any measure that aided individual US citizens. The philosophical position that the Federal government has no role to play in alleviating the hardship and suffering of its citizens tends to be most associated with his memory.

It is arguable that Hoover did more than any previous President to address the issues a “bust” brings in a boom-and-bust business cycle. However, that is more a commentary on the inaction of his predecessors than an endorsement of the solutions he put forward.

#27

Thank you Dave.

My knowledge has been greatly enhanced.

#28

Ladies and Gentlemen; I do beleive Dave has most of it, except for the do nothing congress.

How ever we should all note that when you loan money for what ever to people who will be unable to pay it back (have one of those bums now) you are throwing good money away, might as well give it to charity! That is what S&Ls where doing at the behest of the White House and Congress in the 90’s! And of course we now get to pay for the bail out of this MAJOR screw up by those in power!

I say turn them ALL out of office and and let work in the world they have created!

Keep your powder dry you wll need it soon!

Paul

#29

[i]

E. Paul Austin said:
Ladies and Gentlemen; I do beleive Dave has most of it, except for the do nothing congress.

How ever we should all note that when you loan money for what ever to people who will be unable to pay it back (have one of those bums now) you are throwing good money away, might as well give it to charity! That is what S&Ls where doing at the behest of the White House and Congress in the 90’s! And of course we now get to pay for the bail out of this MAJOR screw up by those in power!

I say turn them ALL out of office and and let work in the world they have created!

Keep your powder dry you wll need it soon!

Paul


[/i]

I sure hear you there Paul. Personally I think one term is enough for any political office. Professional politicians only acquire experience in getting re-elected, gathering money and favors and getting used to being part of the power structure. They spend precious little time in solving the problems of the citizen. It is the rare politician indeed that puts country and citizen above party except to pay it lip service.

And as I always say, it’s an incompetent politician indeed that can’t steal enough or acquire enough favors in one term to set himself up for life. No reason to give him a second chance. Until then we are mostly relegated to voting for the lesser of two evils.

#30

The Senate should be kept in constant session for at least a couple of reasons. One, they like to talk. Two, they think they are saying something important and nobody really wants to tell them they are worthless. Three, if they were locked in a single room with their only contact being from the other Senators, they would be doing the Country a service. Now after having those doors locked for about 6 months, probably most of the problems would be solved. The public would not have had to hear it. And with a little luck they would all be dead. That part is questionable, because a number of them are known cannibals. (No disrespect meant toward self-respecting carnivores) Part of the problem is some of them are already dead, but just don’t know to lie down. So, now after that 6 months, we send people in to clean up the hazardous waste and ask for another 100 volunteers to be the new Senators and then we start the process again.

This process could also be used as a great incentive for the House to start doing the people’s business. If not, we could elect them Senators.

They all just need the proper incentive.

#31

Why do you tink we sent Tennis Shoe Patty and her side-kick Maria Can’t-Well all the way across the country?

We sent them there to get them as far away from Washington State as possible, figuring that if’n they was there, they couldn’t do much harm to the good folks back home! :lol: :stuck_out_tongue:

Ok, ok, so I stole the ideer from Mammy Yokum, but I stole it fair and square, I did!

#32
Steve Featherkile said:
...........

Sheesh! What are you thinking, man? :lol:


What do you mean thinking, that was strictly intuition! :lol: It gets worse when I start thinking! :stuck_out_tongue: :stuck_out_tongue: :smiley: