Here are photos of one of ours.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/6bydilic4byrkkf/20151004_001516.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/i69ntehgarrocd1/20151004_001558.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/8jdl94h8njg2zp7/2018-02-19%2022.49.41.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/abspkw64b9kovhl/20171003_214947.jpg?dl=0
Duplicate post again. Disregard.
Ted,
This motor pictured in your previous post is the exact one I replaced before in my current Dash 9 after it overheated.
Ken
stock motor… see this thread https://www.largescalecentral.com/forums/topic/27326/aristocraft-bnsf-dash-9-motor-failure/view/page/3
greg
Apologies on the wierd posts, I gotta have my phone checked out, i am beginning to believe it’s got serious issues. The motors that I currently have in some of my late equipment match the motor in Ted’s 5th photo from the top, so maybe they actually are the same motors? I should ask Navin about all of this. Also the motor Ted shows in the above reply is identical to the one I had to replace recently in my BNSF swoosh Dash 9 locomotive which is also very up to date. I just wonder if the 12 volt has a 24 volt max and is labeled differently. I am just navigating blind here but I am going to ask Navin about all of this.
I’m just a little too curious now!
Ken
Thank you every one for all your help.
I send a message to Clay asking him if he is willing to sell me one or two motor.
Francois
Clay said you got ahold of him, good luck!
Ken
Hi,
Just buy 2 motor for my Aristocraft dash 9 from Clay. So i will have a extra motor for future repair. Thank to everybody for the help with there photos and advice. It was very helpful. So the CP dash 9 will be back on rail for the spring.
Francois
Fantastic! It’s a really nice locomotive. We have one of the 80 Aristocraft originally produced also and I’m sure glad you were able to get what was necessary to get it back on the rails.
Have fun! Ken
Ken Mathews/Imagination Station Kids On Track said:
Snip… I just wonder if the 12 volt has a 24 volt max and is labeled differently. I am just navigating blind here but I am going to ask Navin about all of this.
I’m just a little too curious now!..Snip
Ken
Ken, Please let us know what you find out about the motor ratings. Since Greg E. questioned why so many of these removed motors are available, the idea crossed my mind if they were maybe wrongly rated ones that were caught and replaced at the factory and then the removed ones offered on the open market.
Thank you,
-Ted
Clay’s motors are OEM and were removed from new Dash 9’s that were stripped of power components to be used as NON-powered dummies. These engines were originally from Dennis Sirrines, Palo Verde and Southwestern Railroad in Arizona.
Michael
Ted, Michael, LSC Members,
Just spoke to Navin for about a half hour and he said to let you know that there were 5 versions of the Dash 9/SD 45 drive and the second version had 12 volt motors.
He doesn’t understand why but thinks it could have been a mistake in China. He says that it doesn’t really matter that much, except for the fact that you can’t over stress the drives with 12 volt motors or they can overheat and burn out, especially with high power transformers. He said the solution to the version 2 drives is to run 2 or more locomotives together on long trains, sharp curves and grades. He says to tell everyone that there are no more Dash 9 motors as he has either given them away or sold them.
He says you can run the 24 volt and the 12 volt motors in the same drive but he doesn’t know the long term results. He does know they will work together, however, it is better, if possible, to at least have matching motors in each separate drive. So it is OK to have 1 drive with 12 volt motors and one drive with 24 volt but he doesn’t know long term (even though they run great together) how good it is to have a mismatch of 12/24 volt in one drive, although a lot of people have done it with no problems. As mentioned above though you can’t over stress locomotives with 12 volt motors by pulling heavy grades, sharp curves and/or to long of a train.
He says, the newer Dash 9’s and SD 45’s have the 24 volt motors (as did version 1) and the problem is there is no way to tell which versions are #2 or which are newer without disassembly and motor winding tests or by a visual observation of the motors that actually say they are 12 volt. (because it is not printed on every 12 volt motor they used)
He says that the Canadian locomotives are all supposed to have 24 volt motors.
So now we have to get motors from outside sources for these locomotives, however, Navin still has gears, gearboxes, screws, washers, springs, ball bearings, axles, wheels, mounting screws and full drive assembly plastic boxes available.
I didn’t ask about other items like electronic boards, switches, lights, handrails and other cosmetic parts but I have a feeling were on our own for most of that.
Hope this helps.
Ken
Michael & Ken,
Thanks for the reply.
Interesting info. from Navin seems to confirm suspicion of motor ratings vs. stress possibles in Aristo’s SD45 & Dash-9 3 axle truck locos. I wonder about the E8/9s if they were produced with 12V rated motors.
Much appreciated,
-Ted
Didn’t ask about them but I am willing to bet it’s the same.
Just my thoughts though!
Ken
I don’t think the E8’s have 12v motors because they run so slow. 12v motors should run a lot faster for the same voltage. I have almost 24v on the rails.
Greg
The E8/9s I have run the same “slow speed” as my SD45s & Dash-9s. The gearing being the same on all is likely the reason.
-Ted
Have not seen the connections in the trucks but could it be the 24v motors are in parallel and the 12 volt are in series? think you could tell by the amp draw?
The motor block electrical strapping is such that the motors are in parallel.
-Ted
These DC electric motors typically have a pretty wide VOLTAGE operating range. Generally 50% less than nominal voltage ratings and maybe 25% over the nominal rating.
I like 12V motors for trains, if you provide 12V or thereabouts the motor will operate at or near its peak efficiency! How often do you run at 24V? I’m a battery guy 12V is ideal IMO, low cell count, efficient operation = low current draw with minimal heat gain. I use 14.4V Li-Po batteries in most circumstances.
With all the electrical losses associated with track power, I’d suggest 12V motors are a good choice therein as well. I believe most model railroads (engines) experience voltage degradation and or inadequate current sources under load exasperated by the aforementioned electrical losses.
The four essential facts that dictate the basic properties of a DC motor:
Michael
PWM… so if you have a motor driver I would submit you want the higher voltage motor for safety…
The speeds may be proportional but not linear.
Greg