Joe, Pete was referring to my locomotives - 4 USAT GP-9’s, 1 USAT FA/FB set, 1 USAT NW-2, 2 LGB Moguls, 1 cable car, and a Partridge in a pear tree.
For what it’s worth, Michael, I have the Revolution Train Engineer 2.4 and it works well for me and has actually more features than I know how to use. I don’t have anything to compare it to, but I like it just fine.
So, on the things desired and priorities, recently in this thread you said sound was not so important, but this is from the first post:
"Caveat here is the limited amount of diesel files available (one or two generic ones) so adding a Phoenix sound card with it’s large diesel sound library may be necessary. "
So, how important sound is would make a big difference in the decision. So, if it’s not so important as you last posted, get the Revo… If it is important your diesels sound different, go the Revo DCC or one of the flavors of AirWire, although my recommendation there is use DCC decoders for either way, simpler to install and more “consistent” in terms of installations.
Greg
Greg, to be clear, sound is of utmost importance to me. I have to make a decision between the following (assuming I buy a Train Engineer 2.4 transmitter). I already have an Airwire transmitter. So in each loco, I would have either:
-
Airwire Drop-in decoder, Phoenix sound card, and battery. Expensive.
-
Revolution 2.4 receiver (w/built-in sound), and battery. Relatively inexpensive compared to #1.
-
Revolution 2.4 receiver (built-in sound disconnected), Phoenix sound card, battery. A little less expensive than #1 but still expensive.
Phoenix currently has a much larger diesel/steam sound library specific to each type locomotive. Revo only has a couple of generic ones, and Navin at Revolution can’t guarantee any new diesel sounds in the near future. Knob/push buttons vs. push buttons for forward and reverse. Understanding the “pay for whatcha get” philosophy, those are my options.
Maybe I’m just too damn picky and should just go “Eenie meenie miney mo” between the two, select one and call it a day, eh?
Michael,
If you like the Airwire / Phoenix combo but the cost is an issue; one option would be to install the Airwire and battery now, then and add the Phoenix at a later date. It won’t get you sound right away, but you will have it in the long run. None of it is complicated to hook up, especially if you are using a drop in board.
Chris
Chris Kieffer said:
Michael,
If you like the Airwire / Phoenix combo but the cost is an issue; one option would be to install the Airwire and battery now, then and add the Phoenix at a later date. It won’t get you sound right away, but you will have it in the long run. None of it is complicated to hook up, especially if you are using a drop in board.
Chris
Chris, I’ve thought of that, and you’re probably right. While I would like to have each engine completely retrofitted one by one, I think I have no recourse but to do a little at a time. This ain’t a poor man’s hobby by no means. (http://www.largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-surprised.gif)
You could also consider setting up semi permanent consists to start with, only using one Phoenix sound card and running a speaker in both locos from it.
Michael Kirrene said:
Chris Kieffer said:
Michael,
If you like the Airwire / Phoenix combo but the cost is an issue; one option would be to install the Airwire and battery now, then and add the Phoenix at a later date. It won’t get you sound right away, but you will have it in the long run. None of it is complicated to hook up, especially if you are using a drop in board.
Chris
Chris, I’ve thought of that, and you’re probably right. While I would like to have each engine completely retrofitted one by one, I think I have no recourse but to do a little at a time. This ain’t a poor man’s hobby by no means. (http://www.largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-surprised.gif)
Welcome to G $cale!
John, a lotta you guys that have been around a long time use the same thing you started out with. What are you using to run your trains out there amongst the Rattlesnakes?
Michael, If you go with Airwire,you could go with a Tsunami sound decoder or TCS WOW sound board. I run Airwire and that’s the route I have gone. I feel some of the other sound system companies are offering more than the Phoenix systems do. I can get a Wow sound or Tsunami sound decoder for around $100. It comes already loaded With options Phoenix doesn’t offer. The only down fall is they aren’t as loud as the Phoenix can get. That works for me.I have Phoenix systems in several locos with Airwire also. They work well together.
I have a USAT GP9 with an Airwire G3 Dropin, and no sound. I use an older throttle. My only complaint is that the system loses synch every now and again.
I have a Dash 9, and 2 SD45s with REVO II, and I sometimes use the sound, but on the lowest level. It seems that I can control them from the next county. My complaint with this setup stems from the cheap speakers spec’d by Aristo. After awhile, the sound degenerates to white noise. Someday, I’ll survey the speakers, but, today is not that day.
I like both.
Michael Kirrene said:
Greg, to be clear, sound is of utmost importance to me. I have to make a decision between the following (assuming I buy a Train Engineer 2.4 transmitter). I already have an Airwire transmitter. So in each loco, I would have either:
Airwire Drop-in decoder, Phoenix sound card, and battery. Expensive.
Revolution 2.4 receiver (w/built-in sound), and battery. Relatively inexpensive compared to #1.
Revolution 2.4 receiver (built-in sound disconnected), Phoenix sound card, battery. A little less expensive than #1 but still expensive.
Phoenix currently has a much larger diesel/steam sound library specific to each type locomotive. Revo only has a couple of generic ones, and Navin at Revolution can’t guarantee any new diesel sounds in the near future. Knob/push buttons vs. push buttons for forward and reverse. Understanding the “pay for whatcha get” philosophy, those are my options.
Maybe I’m just too damn picky and should just go “Eenie meenie miney mo” between the two, select one and call it a day, eh?
Well, I’ve not been successful to get this point across, but with your response above, I want to be sure that you “get” what I am telling you.
First, sound quality is of top priority to me too.
So I just want you to be aware that your “top” solution is NOT the “top” solution in terms of sound quality.
Using a system where the motor controls come from one board and the sound from another will NEVER (there is a technical exception, but you SUSI guys please keep your mouths shut for now), repeat NEVER be as good as a solution where the motor controls and the sound controls are from the SAME board, i.e. the same microprocessor controls both.
The most realistic sound systems are where the sound system tracks the motor speed tightly, but where the load on the locomotive ALSO modifies the sound output.
You can only do this with a single “decoder” that controls both motor and sound, thus my continued suggestion that you either use the Airwire system + Convrtr + DCC decoder OR Revolution DCC system + DCC decoder.
In terms of sound quality, you cannot match that level of realism with the Airwire with the G2/3 motor driver and a sound card OR an add on sound unit to the “standard” Revolution system.
In terms of cost, these 2 alternatives cost pretty close to your 2 first suggestions.
Greg (trying to help)
FWIW, I use the revo system. I have it in 8 loco’s (3 steam and 5 diesel) all on one transmitter. I can run 1,2, and 3 trains all on the same track at the same time by switching from cab to cab. I can also run consists using more than one locomotive. Yes the sound system sucks, but you can add other sound systems. I am currently looking at adding a Phoenix sound card in one to see how it works. However other than satisfying me most people at our open houses or module meets do not know the difference. When I run my trains at our module events, I do hand the controls over to some children (with their parents approval) to run the trains and blow the whistle. The revo gives you the options to set the max speed and increase or decrease the amount of throttle. If I did not have that programed in then I would not trust the kids with the controls. For a child that does not have a train but is interested it is usually the highlight of the day for them. I have not used the other system so I cannot chime in on it.
Thank you, Colin. Another good post with useful content. (https://www.largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-smile.gif)
todd whittier said:
Michael, If you go with Airwire,you could go with a Tsunami sound decoder or TCS WOW sound board. I run Airwire and that’s the route I have gone. I feel some of the other sound system companies are offering more than the Phoenix systems do. I can get a Wow sound or Tsunami sound decoder for around $100. It comes already loaded With options Phoenix doesn’t offer. The only down fall is they aren’t as loud as the Phoenix can get. That works for me.I have Phoenix systems in several locos with Airwire also. They work well together.
Todd I just checked out the TCS WOW, and you’re right - Phoenix isn’t the only game in town. Their EMD 567 and 645 16-bit diesel sounds are right up my alley for my Geeps, FA/B and NW-2 engines. Seems like their products cater more to the HO guys, which is understandable. Too bad the TCS WOW isn’t loud, though, like the Phoenix.
Remember to look closely at the sound specs. Many units state 1, 2, 0r 3 watts but that is to a 4 ohm speaker. when using an 8 ohm speaker you will never get 3 watts audio. ASlso baffle the speaker to prevent the sound from the rear mixing to the front. I use yogurt cups lined with foam glued to the back of the speaker and the improvement is awesome!!
Also make sure the speaker can drive the sound out with little or no interference. I hollow out the grill of the Davenports , glue matching ribbon to the backside, then add the baffled speaker which is just foam glued around the rear of the speaker.
Michael Kirrene said:
Too bad the TCS WOW isn’t loud, though, like the Phoenix.
I don’t run my Phoenix anywhere near max volume. It gets annoying really quick being that loud.
I would like to reinforce what Dan said (or I think he said). Proper selection of speakers and enclosures will normally make ANY system loud enough.
Recently I have been adding enclosures to all my locos, and we have some good bolt in ones for USA Trains that make a huge difference in sound. I would submit you don’t have to worry about volume between sound systems at this point.
Some pages on speaker enclosures in USAT locos:
Greg
Michael Kirrene said:
John, a lotta you guys that have been around a long time use the same thing you started out with. What are you using to run your trains out there amongst the Rattlesnakes?
But Sir, you requested I not post in your OP.
My moma didn’t raise no derailleur! I use batteries and R/C from Del at that funny named place. I can say no more.
I ended up turning the sound down, only activated for visitors.
Lately I’ve had 3 amorous Toadus Hornius being naughty in public!
Ha! gotcha! To be fair Michael, you did ask a question of a person who was technically prohibited from answering (https://www.largescalecentral.com/externals/tinymce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-tongue-out.gif)
