Forum Sponsorsss


Forums Modeling Rolling stock
  • Topic: LGB cars with 1:20.3 locos?

    Back To Topics
    (0 rates)
    • December 29, 2020 7:47 PM EST
      • Kansas City, US-KS
         
      • Posts
        187
      • Thanks
        31
      • Thanked
        34

      LGB cars with 1:20.3 locos?

      I'm looking at getting another engine.  Since I doubt LGB will ever make another American Steam model, I have been looking at other brands.  Most of the ones I like are 1:20.3 scale.  But I have no experience with other brands.

      I do not need to buy any more cars right now.  How do the LGB cars look coupled with the 1:20.3 engines such as Bachmann's C-19?  

      ____________________________________

      The Rock Creek Railway runs mostly D&RGW steam era engines and rolling stock outside on 332 track.  I use NCE 10A DCC with Zimo decoders. 

    • December 30, 2020 1:04 AM EST
      • Fort Worth, Texas
         
      • Posts
        324
      • Thanks
        17
      • Thanked
        82

      I run only LGB engines, at this time I have two LGB Moguls, two LGB Alco's, and two #50 diesel switchers, all are repainted to my RR the Ft. Worth & South-Western. I only run LGB and USA Trains rolling stock, all are the 30ft. length, except for the LGB passenger cars which are longer, I would call these narrow gauge cars. So my scale is pretty much 1:22.5 and I don't purchase anything other then that scale, many railroaders mix scales, but for me I don't. I find the 1:20.3 just a little oversize for the LGB scale and the USA Trains at 1/29 scale to be a little under scale for my liking. I will say here that I'm a modeler first and a trains runner second, so you can see why I don't mix scales. I look at the LGB scale as pretty much a dead scale and don't expect to see anything produced in that scale again, I have the only American engines that LGB produced and all I can do is purchase one of the three and re-due it to my liking and that's what I have been doing. As far as how one scale looks to another scale I would watch some YouTube videos and you can see these engines and cars and decide for yourself. 

       

      trainman 

    • December 30, 2020 1:47 AM EST
      • Kailua, HI
         
      • Posts
        1,176
      • Thanks
        980
      • Thanked
        917

      Derailed,

       

      I think the answer will be:  "It Depends."  Below please find a picture from April B'mann's allegedly 1:20.3 scale 2-4-2 pulling an LGB coach and lowside gondola and a PIKO caboose:

      I think it looks OK, but maybe I can't see the flaws through the cargo.  The short movie shows the same loco pulling LGB, Delton, and PIKO:

       

      VideoB'mann 1:20.3 2-4-2 Pulling a Whole Bunch of Gummi-scale Stuff

       

      When our 4-6-0 Big Hauler deigns to work (no clue on its scale), it usually heads three LGB coaches.   This set up was good enough to get us into the last issue of Garden Railways, so I guess it looks OK!   Sorry for the shameless self promotion there...  Rather than further self-aggrandizement, I'll submit a quick video taken in July:

       

      Video B'mann 4-6-0 heads up three LGB coaches

       

      The B'mann sitting next to our LGB mogul, both leading strings of LGB cars, may also give you a sense of go / no-go:

      I think it is going to come down to your sense of aesthetic and desire to remain true to scale.  So far, LGB and B'mann's 1:20.3 stuff has played nicely in an visual sense for me, and both look fine next to our growing collection of 1:24-ish structures.  Your goals and capabilities may lead you to another conclusion.

       

      Have fun shopping!

       

      Eric

       

      This post was edited by Eric Mueller at December 30, 2020 11:37 AM EST
    • December 30, 2020 4:39 AM EST
      • Tingewick, Buckinghamshire
         
      • Posts
        253
      • Thanks
        36
      • Thanked
        33

      Derailed said:

      I'm looking at getting another engine.  Since I doubt LGB will ever make another American Steam model, I have been looking at other brands.  Most of the ones I like are 1:20.3 scale.  But I have no experience with other brands.

      I do not need to buy any more cars right now.  How do the LGB cars look coupled with the 1:20.3 engines such as Bachmann's C-19?  

       

       

      I run 1:20.3 (Fn3) extensively. While I would say LGB US Std Gauge outline stock will look very odd, as they are around 1:29, their US NG stock at around 1:22.5 may not look so bad. I would not personally want to do it but I have a theory that goes something like - If you do not know what the prototypes would have looked like in relation to each other then why worry. I have a number of "loads", like a 'dozer and tractor, that are 1:16 riding of 1:20.3 flat cars. Then there is always the Bachmann Annie, nominally scaled at 1:22.5 and their similarly scaled Big Hauler stock. I used to mix my RGS Annie with Fn3 K-27 and Connie in a long one up front, one the middle and one at the back Fn3 consist. Worked for me

       

      There is one series of nominally 1:24 cars that work quite well with Fn3 scaled product, at least to my eyes - USAT work series. I have their crane and tender, with a Woodland Scenics crew they look perfect with other true to scale 1:20.3 items. Max

    • December 30, 2020 7:38 AM EST
      • Chaco, Paraguay
         
      • Posts
        2,828
      • Thanks
        403
      • Thanked
        389

      two answers:

       

      1. do you put your LGB cars behind a Stainz? does that look ok to you?

      - the Stainz is closer to 1:19 than to 1:22.5 if one compares with the 1:1 prototype.

      (only thing in 1:22.5 is the engineer)

      so i think 1:20.3 models of smaller locos should do fine.

       

      2. during the first decades trains in northamerika consisted of loco, tender, flatcar (as protection for the following cars), than freight- or passenger- cars as needed.

      if you copy that, minor size-mismatches go unnoticed.

       

      and the bonus-answer: it is your railroad! do what you want! if others don't like it, they can do something that ends on "... off!"

      ____________________________________

       

      My Chaosplace ->  

    • December 30, 2020 11:37 AM EST
      • Kansas City, US-KS
         
      • Posts
        187
      • Thanks
        31
      • Thanked
        34

      I do not run a Stainz.  Only D&RGW steam era.  I have a Forney, two moguls and a first gen Mikado (I am worried about the expensive gear failure repair).  I know LGB wasn't too worried about scale.  For them, it was more about the aesthetics and functionality.  I am kinda the same way, so I have kept myself to LGB exclusively.  It has saved me money and storage space in the long run.  But I am itching for another engine larger than a Mogul.  I want the engines to not look out of place next to the others or with the cars.  I don't really have a lot of experience with seeing many prototypes side by side.  Part of the problem for me when watching videos is not being able to identify the brand of some of the cars and engines.       

      ____________________________________

      The Rock Creek Railway runs mostly D&RGW steam era engines and rolling stock outside on 332 track.  I use NCE 10A DCC with Zimo decoders. 

    • December 30, 2020 12:16 PM EST
      • Tingewick, Buckinghamshire
         
      • Posts
        253
      • Thanks
        36
      • Thanked
        33

      Hi "Derailed". Looking at your first post and now this second one I am not really sure what you are actually looking for, apart from a new loco. Is it just the D&RGW branding on locos you are looking for or models of locos that actually represent the types that were (prototypicaly) used on the D&RGW and, possibly its related narrow gauge sub divisions like the RGS.

       

      The main "G Scale" manufacturers will offer generic loco types with different, either prototypical or non prototypical, rail road branding to gain the widest and greatest possible sales potential for a specific and expensive to tool model. Nothing wrong there if that is your thing. Here is a Piko brand "G Scale" Mogul in the D&RGW livery made to run on LGB 45 mm gauged track systems.

       

       

      Bachmann's 4-6-0 "Annie" (also "Big Hauler" in an earlier guise) is a long standing and well known example of this type of sales driven by multiple railroad brandings on one model. There is a new version of this loco being released shortly, in D&RGW guise, that will look good size wise with your LGB stock and add some variety. The "Annie" is reputed to be either a 1:22.5 or 1:24 scale replica of a standard gauge Baldwin loco. Only thing is, the D&RGW never ran 4-6-0 type locos. As you can see offering size and scale matching advise is a minefield. Max

      This post was edited by Max Winter at December 30, 2020 12:54 PM EST
    • December 30, 2020 2:02 PM EST
      • Kansas City, US-KS
         
      • Posts
        187
      • Thanks
        31
      • Thanked
        34

      I am not worried if the D&RGW never ran that type of equipment.  I'm not recreating anything.  But I am looking to keep with Rio Grande name though, to keep the theme consistent.  Most models have the D&RGW name as it is pretty popular.  I am looking for something other than moguls, though as I already have two.  I know a 2-8-0 isn't too much different looking from the mogul but, it is what it is.  I do not like the Camelback.  I always thought that was an UGLY engine. 

       

      ____________________________________

      The Rock Creek Railway runs mostly D&RGW steam era engines and rolling stock outside on 332 track.  I use NCE 10A DCC with Zimo decoders. 

    • December 30, 2020 2:04 PM EST
      • Fort Myers Beach & Annapolis, Florida & Maryland
         
      • Posts
        2,912
      • Thanks
        167
      • Thanked
        709

      B'mann's allegedly 1:20.3 scale 2-4-2 pulling an LGB coach and lowside gondola and a PIKO caboose:

      Very much alleged. It is actually 1:22.5, like the rest of their "Big Hauler" range. No idea why they put it in a Spectrum box!  [Accucraft made a true Fn3 (1:20.3) version which is clearly larger.]

      How do the LGB cars look coupled with the 1:20.3 engines such as Bachmann's C-19? 

      Quite small.  Here's a pic of a typical 1:20 and 1:22.5 coach. The 1:20 is scale size, the 1:22.5 is shrunken and squashed and shorter than it should be.

       

       

      A much better combination is the 2-6-0/4-4-0 Spectrum locomotives which are 1:20 but the prototype is quite small so they look OK with smaller coaches. Here's a pic of a 2-6-0 and 2 Bachmann coaches (which are almost the same size as LGB.)

       

      This post was edited by Pete Thornton at December 30, 2020 3:30 PM EST
      ____________________________________

       

        Pete

    • December 30, 2020 2:16 PM EST
      • Kansas City, US-KS
         
      • Posts
        187
      • Thanks
        31
      • Thanked
        34

      I knew LGB shortened the cars to fit around R1s but man, what a difference in girth. 

      And I know the Mikado is much larger than a Mogul in real life.  LGB shrunk it down.  But it looks ok (to me) with the cars it is pulling and sitting next to the other engines.  The 1:29 engines don't look bad to me next to the 1:22 stuff.  I don't have any modern cars which to me look out of place next to my older era cars.  I bought a couple but sold them when I consolidated my name and time period.  Just wondering how the 1:20 stuff compared and it seems to be too big.  

      Thank you all.  I will steer away from the 1:20.3 engines and cars.  

      ____________________________________

      The Rock Creek Railway runs mostly D&RGW steam era engines and rolling stock outside on 332 track.  I use NCE 10A DCC with Zimo decoders. 

    • December 30, 2020 2:57 PM EST
      • Fort Worth, Texas
         
      • Posts
        324
      • Thanks
        17
      • Thanked
        82

      One thing to remember is the LGB Moguls are patterned from a standard gauge engine, the Denver, South Park, and Pacific, these engines were much taller then the D&RGW NG 2-8-0 Conidiations were, so running them together could look a little different, but I have seen them run together and I think you can get by with it, I would do it if that's what I wanted to do, were talking Bachmann C-19's here.  The problems arise with the diesels, nothing seems to fit with the LGB diesels, they seem to be on there own and other scales just don't work for me. It's possible that someday there might be an Fn3 diesel offered that might work with the LGB diesels, but I have not seen anything as of today, Fn3 is mainly NG steam for the biggest part, so I don't really look for any diesels in that scale. 

      trainman

      DSCN4117.JPG (2.71 Mb)
      This post was edited by John Lenheiser at December 30, 2020 2:59 PM EST
    • December 30, 2020 4:23 PM EST
      • Curmudgeon at Large, Lynn Haven, FL
         
      • Posts
        2,272
      • Thanks
        86
      • Thanked
        292

      It is my understanding the the 4-6-0 by Bachmann is a model loosley following an East Tennessee and Western North Carolina (Tweetsie) 3 foot narrow gauge locomotive. So in that respect proportions are correct, exact scale is another topic. In many respects Bachmann follows LGB in using a rubber ruler if you are interested in true scale fidelity.

       

      It is suggested that D&RGW did in fact run 4-6-0 locomotives as pictured here http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/locoPicture.aspx?id=208856. 

       

      To go to the OP's original question, a bit of research into historical railroad photographs you will find that rolling stock varied greatly is size and configuration in the early part of the 20th century. I didn't bookmark the photo, but on Shorpy there is a photograph of a rail yard which clearly demonstrates the variety of rail car sizes all mixed together.

       

      I am personally a narrow gauge freak. If it isn't narrow gauge, it isn't. I have K27s, 2-8-0 Connies, a 2-8-0 C19, early Shay, a Climax and a Heisler. I run all the various manufacturers (Bachmann, USA Trains, Aristo Craft, Lionel, Dalton, etc.) that all range in the 1:22.5 to 1:24 scale for the narrow gauge equipment, and 1:29 for Aristo Craft and some USA Trains. So long as you don't run 1:20.3 next to 1:29 rolling stock, they all mix well together.

      ____________________________________

      We don't stop playing with trains because we grow old, we grow old because we stop playing with trains.....

       

    • December 30, 2020 6:46 PM EST

      •  
      • Posts
        15,241
      • Thanks
        3,161
      • Thanked
        1,821

      Derailed said:

      I'm looking at getting another engine.  Since I doubt LGB will ever make another American Steam model, I have been looking at other brands.  Most of the ones I like are 1:20.3 scale.  But I have no experience with other brands.

      I do not need to buy any more cars right now.  How do the LGB cars look coupled with the 1:20.3 engines such as Bachmann's C-19?  

       

       

      Not my cup of tea and perhaps I missed it but I don't think so ....May I ask which LGB cars you are planning to couple with the American Steam model in 1:20th?

    • December 30, 2020 7:16 PM EST
      • Kansas City, US-KS
         
      • Posts
        187
      • Thanks
        31
      • Thanked
        34

      "which LGB cars you are planning to couple with the American Steam model in 1:20th"

      I have pretty much all the LGB American-style wood coaches and wood freight cars with the D&RGW livery.  No modern steel cars.  My layout is roughly set around 1900 in the west.  Some houses have "electric" lights but no automobiles or other modern items, horses and wagons only.  Cowboys and old-tyme ladies.   Wooden buildings, log cabin, teepees.  

      I'm not worried if the DRGW never ran a piece of equipment as long as it looks right.  ie. its not a European engine or wagon.  I don't know if they ever ran a Hudson but I would love to have a DRGW lettered Hudson (my favorite engine) on my layout.      

      This post was edited by Derailed at December 30, 2020 7:23 PM EST
      ____________________________________

      The Rock Creek Railway runs mostly D&RGW steam era engines and rolling stock outside on 332 track.  I use NCE 10A DCC with Zimo decoders. 

    • December 30, 2020 7:48 PM EST
      • Curmudgeon at Large, Lynn Haven, FL
         
      • Posts
        2,272
      • Thanks
        86
      • Thanked
        292

      Rooster said:
      Bob Cope said:

      It is my understanding the the 4-6-0 by Bachmann is a model loosley following an East Tennessee and Western North Carolina (Tweetsie) 3 foot narrow gauge locomotive. So in that respect proportions are correct, exact scale is another topic. In many respects Bachmann follows LGB in using a rubber ruler if you are interested in true scale fidelity.

       

      It is suggested that D&RGW did in fact run 4-6-0 locomotives as pictured here http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/locoPicture.aspx?id=208856. 

       

      To go to the OP's original question, a bit of research into historical railroad photographs you will find that rolling stock varied greatly is size and configuration in the early part of the 20th century. I didn't bookmark the photo, but on Shorpy there is a photograph of a rail yard which clearly demonstrates the variety of rail car sizes all mixed together.

       

      I am personally a narrow gauge freak. If it isn't narrow gauge, it isn't. I have K27s, 2-8-0 Connies, a 2-8-0 C19, early Shay, a Climax and a Heisler. I run all the various manufacturers (Bachmann, USA Trains, Aristo Craft, Lionel, Dalton, etc.) that all range in the 1:22.5 to 1:24 scale for the narrow gauge equipment, and 1:29 for Aristo Craft and some USA Trains. So long as you don't run 1:20.3 next to 1:29 rolling stock, they all mix well together.

       

      Ok

      I do hope BD removes post count from the new software

      ____________________________________

      We don't stop playing with trains because we grow old, we grow old because we stop playing with trains.....

       

    • December 31, 2020 8:17 AM EST
      • Fort Worth, Texas
         
      • Posts
        324
      • Thanks
        17
      • Thanked
        82

      Like I said in an earlier post, I'm all LGB American steam and diesel, I too have looked into the 1:20.3 scale for loco's and they just don't fit too well with the LGB scale. Probably the biggest reason is 1:20.3 scale is an exact scale and LGB is a rubber ruler scale. All being said here, for me the two don't mix that well. I do run USA Trains wood side boxcars and wood reefers, they match up to LGB and look pretty much the same size. I'd like to find something like a GP-9, or GP-20 to go with the LGB Alco's, but I don't think it will happen as LGB scale is pretty much dead as far as new production models. I think a lot about running trains has to do where you run them, on club layouts just about anything goes and looks ok, but for myself who is building a 3x24' switching layout and fully detailed all needs to be to somewhat to a scale that is uniform to the whole layout.

       

      trainman

    • December 31, 2020 12:17 PM EST
      • Fort Myers Beach & Annapolis, Florida & Maryland
         
      • Posts
        2,912
      • Thanks
        167
      • Thanked
        709

      Derailed said:

      . . .

      And I know the Mikado is much larger than a Mogul in real life.  LGB shrunk it down.  But it looks ok (to me) with the cars it is pulling and sitting next to the other engines.  The 1:29 engines don't look bad to me next to the 1:22 stuff.  I don't have any modern cars which to me look out of place next to my older era cars.  I bought a couple but sold them when I consolidated my name and time period.  Just wondering how the 1:20 stuff compared and it seems to be too big.  

      Thank you all.  I will steer away from the 1:20.3 engines and cars.  

      As you found, a 1/29th model of a 40' boxcar is the same physical size as a 1/22 scale model of a 30' boxcar. They can look fine together if you don't mind the ET&WNC markings next to a Soo Line car!

      This 1946 photo shows a wide variety of boxcar sizes and types.

       

      This post was edited by Pete Thornton at December 31, 2020 6:42 PM EST
      ____________________________________

       

        Pete

    • December 31, 2020 12:23 PM EST
      • Fort Myers Beach & Annapolis, Florida & Maryland
         
      • Posts
        2,912
      • Thanks
        167
      • Thanked
        709

      It is suggested that D&RGW did in fact run 4-6-0 locomotives as pictured here http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/locoPicture.aspx?id=208856.

      Many narrow gauge railroads had 4-6-0s. The East Broad Top had several, and the ET&WNC had more than just #12, I think. The latter is unusual in that it has equally-spaced drivers. Most had a big gap between the back pairs where the firebox sat.  This is the D&RGW Y-12 class:

       

       

      ____________________________________

       

        Pete

    • January 5, 2021 1:06 PM EST
      • Kansas City, US-KS
         
      • Posts
        187
      • Thanks
        31
      • Thanked
        34

      I always liked the looks of the Big Hauler engine, but until now I just thought they were junky toys as that is all I saw when I was growing up.  Apparently they have been improved significantly since then.  So I will add this engine to my want list.  I wish Barry still sold his upgraded engines or drives.  Seems I'm too late to that party.  :( 

      ____________________________________

      The Rock Creek Railway runs mostly D&RGW steam era engines and rolling stock outside on 332 track.  I use NCE 10A DCC with Zimo decoders. 

Forums Modeling Rolling stock

    Icon Legend

  • Topic has replies
    Hot topic
    Topic unread
    Topic doesn't have any replies
    Closed topic
    BBCode  is enabled
    HTML  is enabled

Add Reputation

Do you want to add reputation for this user by this post?

or cancel

Ads by Google