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    • September 28, 2019 7:47 AM EDT
      • Your Host in Littleton, MA
         
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      Continuing

      As you all know, I dont get to visit the site daily, with my job, so I have the weekend to attend to the site.

       

      Last night and this morning I take a look and there are a couple dozen reports, from several different members, for harassment, spamming nonsense, and general incivility toward other members.

       

      This is the same old saw, a handful of people are using LSC to stalk, annoy, harass, and generally just be assholes to each other, despite my asking you all to knock it off.

       

      It stops now.  I am *DONE* providing a forum for you guys to crap in.

       

      I have to renew the site in about six weeks (to the tune of a few thousand dollars).  If, in two weeks, it hasnt stopped, 100%, I will shut down LSC, and return anyone's donations from the last six months if they want it back.

      This post was edited by Bob McCown at September 30, 2019 10:29 AM EDT
      ____________________________________

      Bob, your Site Host and Benevolent Dictator.

    • September 28, 2019 10:14 AM EDT
      • Saint Helena, CALIFORNIA
         
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      It would be greatly appreciated if you banish just the "assholes" rather than a complete shutdown!  You know that baby and bathwater thing.

      This post was edited by Mark Hadler at September 28, 2019 10:52 PM EDT
    • September 28, 2019 12:26 PM EDT
      • South Surrey, BC Canada
         
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      I have never understood why people act like this.  It seems that once a forum gets going someone starts general incivility toward other members and then to the forum itself.  It happened to the G1MRA forum, they had to shut it down, it even happened to our little local club's forum, we had to shut it down.  I'm not on here often but I lurk almost every day, I have gained lots of information and had questions answered.  I know nothing about running a forum but I guess it is hard if not impossible to lock a person out.  If the site goes down I will be angry then sad.  Angry at the little people who feel they can be bullies without having to face anyone and sad that this is what the internet has become.  I am not on any social media sites because of this.

       

    • September 28, 2019 12:32 PM EDT
      • Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
         
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      I too would be sad to see this site go dark. I have made friends through this site, and its a great source of helpful information and inspiration.

      ____________________________________

      Shannon car Shops
      Home of the infamous leg lamp

      I.A.R.R.R. Member #12

      and King Butt Modeler

    • September 28, 2019 12:51 PM EDT
      • Pleasanton, CA
         
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      I get an enormous amount of pleasure and knowledge out of this forum. I'm here daily and try to post everything I do, partly for the joy of sharing and partly because the helpful folks here give me lots and lots of encouragement and tips, tricks, and ideas. Without LSC, the hobby will be a lot less enjoyable for me.

       

      Can any of us help? Citizen policing somehow? Share some godlike powers to let some trusted folks police for you? Send complaints to someone else so you don't have to deal with it?

       

      just balling spit here...

    • September 28, 2019 1:01 PM EDT
      • Curmudgeon at Large, Insurance Warrior
         
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      I became a member of LSC in 2008, and have enjoyed my time here, even through the times prior where Bob threatened to 'pull the plug'. Those previous times I can account to migrations from other sites that have closed down and those new members were not attuned to the few rules LSC has. This time, not so much. This time it is members who have been here a long time and know the rules.

      I have been relatively quiet on this subject in the past, but this time I am going to voice my feelings and opinions. First, I find no reason to bring personal animosities to this forum. Leave them at the login. If you can't find something positive to say, 'shut your pie hole'. This is pointed as every member of this forum, new members or founding, makes no difference. Over the years I have watched some very adept modelers stop or reduce postings for this reason. Second, there is no reason at all for vulgarities or sexual innuendos on LSC. This forum is open to folks of all ages and no minor should be subject to that kind of material. I am not abject to vulgarity in humor, it can be humorous.... ONCE, and at a private gathering, not in Bob's living room.

      I will not pretend to tell Bob how to run his 'Benevolent Dictator' moniker, but I would drop the 'Benevolent' and lean hard on the 'Dictator'. Having been down this road twice before, I would not threaten or give second chances. It is time to simply ban the perpetrators....both of them. These animosities are rooted deep and will not go away just because someone says "play nice'. I would not attempt to determine who threw the first punch, ban both. No warning, no nicety. Let them attempt to log in and find out they no longer can. I am certain a few 'hangings' will get the attention of the rest. Once you have their attention, don't stop. When the rules are broken, ban the offenders. Yes the membership will dwindle for a bit, but the forum will be better for it.

      I would like to see less of the horse manure posts that add no intelligent content to the thread. Some are cute, but most are not. If you can't add meaningful content, leave the server space for those who can.

      Lastly I would ask Bob to consider not punishing the innocent for the transgressions of the guilty. There are way too many good folks who follow the rules. For me, since Hurricane Michael devastated the Florida Gulf Coast, LSC has been my primary Large Scale hobby connection.

      ____________________________________

      We don't stop playing with trains because we grow old, we grow old because we stop playing with trains.....

       

    • September 28, 2019 1:16 PM EDT
      • Be Nice or STFU
         
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      I agree, there is a simple set of rules posted by Bob, and they are not being followed. Simple as that, his site his rules. I suffered ALL FIVE in my heavyweight post. They are posted as a sticky for all to see: (I apologize for finally losing my cool and responding in kind when I believed nothing was going to ever improve) Below are the rules as posted by Bob - verbatim:

       

      It seems it's time for a much simpler, and much more strictly enforced site policy.  Violations will get a warning with an explanation, second violation will earn a 30 day suspension, third will earn a lifetime ban.

       -----

      Be Nice.

      You've been invited into my living room to talk trains.  Whether you've come to ask questions, or to generously share what you know or what you've done, remember that we’re all here to learn, and have fun, together. Be welcoming and patient, especially with those who may not know everything you do. Oh, and bring your sense of humor. Just in case.  



      That basically covers it. But these guidelines may help:

      1. Rudeness and belittling language are not okay. Your tone should match the way you'd talk in person with someone you respect and whom you want to respect you. If you don't have time to say something politely, just leave it for someone who does.

      2. Be welcoming, be patient, and assume good intentions. Don't expect new users to know all the rules - they don't. And be patient while they learn. If you're here for help, make it as easy as possible for others to help you. Everyone here is volunteering, and no one responds well to demands for help.

      3. Avoid off-topic, and filler posts.  Stay on topic within the thread, and contribute to it.  Don't post just to increase your post count..

      4. Don't be a jerk. These are just a few examples. If you see them, report them:

        • Name-calling. Focus on the post, not the person. That includes terms that feel personal even when they're applied to posts (like "lazy", "ignorant", or "whiny").

        • Bigotry of any kind. Language likely to offend or alienate individuals or groups based on race, gender, sexual orientation, religion, etc. will not be tolerated. At all. (Those are just a few examples; when in doubt, just don't.)

        • Inappropriate language or attention. Avoid vulgar terms and anything sexually suggestive.

        • Harassment and bullying. If you see a hostile interaction, report it. If it keeps up, disengage - we'll handle it. If something needs our attention, you can use the contact us link at the bottom of every page.

      5. Use the Report feature. The forums have a method to report offensive, annoying, or any other inappropriate content.  This is the easiest way to let me know something is up.  Don't respond to anything you don't like, EVEN IF IT IS DIRECTED AT YOU.  If you do, you become part of the problem.  Report it instead.  If I get a number of reports about the same content, I will take action, most likely suspending the offending account.

      In summary, have fun, and be good to each other.

       

       

      This post was edited by Greg Elmassian at September 29, 2019 11:43 AM EDT
      ____________________________________

      Be sure­ to visit ­my site, l­ots of tec­hnical tip­s and modi­fications,­ and you c­an search ­for topics­ and key w­ords.


      ­Click HERE for Greg­'s web sit­e
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    • September 28, 2019 1:28 PM EDT
      • San Mateo, California
         
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      Should the same rules apply for "chat"?

      -Ted

    • September 28, 2019 1:47 PM EDT
      • Marysville, Kansas
         
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      I hate to say it Bob but if you want to get your point across you are going to have to send "those people" special love notes.   People that continue to cause problems never think you are talking to them if you don't tell them directly.  Doesn't matter how many times they've been warned, doesn't matter how many times a moderator or owner has told them, doesn't even matter if they get kicked off a site, they just don't learn.

       

      It's the same issues, from the same people, just a different location.

    • September 28, 2019 2:32 PM EDT
      • Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
         
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      Chris, sadly you are correct. Immature people think that they are "special" and that they don't have to follow the rules everyone else has to follow.

       

      Bob, Bob has banned a few folks in the past. When those folks were banned, some of the current offenders were on the site at the time. Did the offenders learn? Maybe, but they have since forgotten.

       

       

      Perusing LSC is also a daily activity for me, and a constant source of entertainment, information and inspiration. So I hope that Bob decides against pulling the plug. But if the site does go dark, I want to thank those who have contributed to the site, and especially to those who have improved the large scale hobby for me.

       

      Edit to add Bob's "You have been banned" avatar

      This post was edited by David Maynard at September 28, 2019 2:44 PM EDT
      ____________________________________

      Shannon car Shops
      Home of the infamous leg lamp

      I.A.R.R.R. Member #12

      and King Butt Modeler

    • September 28, 2019 2:44 PM EDT
      • Ottawa/Nepean, Ontario, Canada
         
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      Ted Doskaris said:

      Should the same rules apply for "chat"?

      -Ted

      YES....

    • September 28, 2019 3:22 PM EDT
      • Curmudgeon at Large, Insurance Warrior
         
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      @Ted - My post was intended to mean every aspect of this site. This is Bob's living room, no one should disrespect it in any manner.

       

      @Maynard - No doubt. My feelings are 'just ban them' and be done with it. I don't care how much they might have donated to the forum, or how long they have been a member.

      This post was edited by Bob Cope at September 28, 2019 3:23 PM EDT
      ____________________________________

      We don't stop playing with trains because we grow old, we grow old because we stop playing with trains.....

       

    • September 28, 2019 3:25 PM EDT
      • Milpitas, California
         
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      Bob Cope: A very well articulated post that covered all the bases. Thanks.

    • September 28, 2019 3:58 PM EDT
      • Be Nice or STFU
         
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      Wow, to think that chat could turn into a friendly place without foul language?  That would indeed be a welcome change.

       

      Greg

      ____________________________________

      Be sure­ to visit ­my site, l­ots of tec­hnical tip­s and modi­fications,­ and you c­an search ­for topics­ and key w­ords.


      ­Click HERE for Greg­'s web sit­e
      PLEASE NOT­E: Please do NOT use private messaging, i­f you have­ a questio­n, feel fr­ee to emai­l me priva­tely, u­se regular­ email onl­y: greg@el­massian.co­m

    • September 28, 2019 4:19 PM EDT
      • San Mateo, California
         
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      Forum Cause for Expulsion, including Chat

      Bob Cope said:

      @Ted - My post was intended to mean every aspect of this site. This is Bob's living room, no one should disrespect it in any manner.

       

      @Maynard - No doubt. My feelings are 'just ban them' and be done with it. I don't care how much they might have donated to the forum, or how long they have been a member.

      Then, I take it, the same disciplines, including excommunication / expulsion is to be rendered to someone committing offensive indiscretions on chat?

      -Ted

      This post was edited by Ted Doskaris at September 28, 2019 4:28 PM EDT
    • September 28, 2019 4:25 PM EDT
      • Maryville, Tennessee
         
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      I have been a member of this forum since July 2000, one of the first members to join LSC. Also joined the other LS forums but saw them die for the same problems.

      I have always liked this forum and try to check the posts everyday. 

      Would be sad and understand if Bob decided to let it go.

      Dennis

       

      This post was edited by Dennis Cherry at September 29, 2019 8:00 AM EDT
      ____________________________________

      Dennis in East Tennessee

       

    • September 28, 2019 4:47 PM EDT
      • Fort Myers Beach & Annapolis, Florida & Maryland
         
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      Until that recent stupidity on the Aristo hvywt thread, I thought we were all getting along nicely.

      ____________________________________

       

        Pete

    • September 28, 2019 5:16 PM EDT
      • East Brunswick, N J RRR#22
         
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      Without using "back in the day we were civil and polite", I would like to say that this is a place I enjoy visiting, and would miss it very much if it were gone. I have been instructed, encouraged, and questioned about techniques. I do try to check it every day to observe all of the creativity. If I can't get out to do anything on my railroad, I certainly enjoy watching everyone else. 

      Keep up the good work. I am among those who enjoy seeing a project well done. It gives a warm feeling to the creator and the observer.

      That being said, if you can't get along here, firmly grip a 2X4, take a hefty backswing, and knock yourself in the head. Rinse. Repeat.

      ____________________________________

      "If I ever go looking for my heart's desire again, I won't look any further than my own backyard. Because if it isn't there, I never really lost it to begin with." - L. Frank Baum

    • September 28, 2019 6:41 PM EDT
      • Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
         
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      That being said, if you can't get along here, firmly grip a 2X4, take a hefty backswing, and knock yourself in the head. Rinse. Repeat.

      Yea, except, the people who are most at fault, blame other people for the "situation". So the offender(s) will not take any action to reign themselves in, or in any way follow your instructions. But they would be unhappy if someone else acted toward then the way they are acting toward others. And that is the yardstick we all should be using, myself included.

       

       

      ____________________________________

      Shannon car Shops
      Home of the infamous leg lamp

      I.A.R.R.R. Member #12

      and King Butt Modeler

    • September 28, 2019 6:42 PM EDT
      • Port Orchard, Washington
         
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      I've been posting less and less over the years because I'm sick of the immature posts by a few individuals. I don't know them personally, but I find it very interesting that the number of "attacking" type treads happen in the evening East Coast time, and often time on Fridays and Saturdays. 

      People can do whatever they want, but I don't find it fun interacting with a few drunks that keep coming back to the bar... I'd rather stay home than go out if I know the loud drunks are hanging out.

       

      Will I be sad if Bob closes the door? Maybe. But there are other forums (non large scale) that seem to be more encouraging to modeling. And not ironically, most of those posts are actually informative and helpful. 

       

      If anyone wants my contact info, feel free to message me.

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