A similar topic to this went around a few months ago and disintegrated into “all the Daddy’s like my Mommy the best” crap. Lets avoid that and keep the comments based on fact.

Over the past few years the discussion about customizing the sounds for various boards has gone around the hobby. How cool it would be to choose the chuff, bell, whistle, crew chatter, etc… rather than a prepackaged sound suite.

Order your sound a la carte. The dream would be to buy a board then using software provided go to the manufacturer’s website (or a pay per use third party supplier) and choose the desired sounds to be loaded into each CV. This would not have to be limited to proto-sound. A garden railroader running Casey Jones Jr could, instead of a chuff, have his train play “Its a Small World After All”, (and hopefully he does not blow his brains out after listening to that all afternoon) or perhaps Ozzy’s “Going off the rails on this Crazy Train”. Instead of “All Aboard” you could have Mickey Mouse say, “Well Hello Everybody”. You get the idea.

Don Sweet alluded to this from REVO in another thread: “There are plans for more sound files and the ability to change them. I do not know the specifics but will ask Navin at the show.” http://www.largescalecentral.com/forums/topic/26678/making-the-jump-to-airwire/view/post_id/334394

Please keep comments limited to known facts pertaining to one of these three questions:

• Are there any sound board manufacturers currently working on this type of product/service?

• What are the software / technical requirements to do this and are any of the current sound boards able to support it?

• Opinion: If you want this feature, what would it be worth $ (unlimited access or pay per use)?

Here is all I know about it.

REVO is only looking at expanding their library of sound suites…not individual sounds.

As a Phoenix user I asked this question of them in July of 2016. I was told they had looked into it but it was considered an inactive program since they did not feel it would be profitable.

• The PB-11 has plenty of capability but would need new software.
• A dongle for programming already exists but new software would be needed for downloading files.
• Their website has downloadable sound suites but would need to be expanded for individual sounds.
• They have concerns about copyright/acquisition of sound files.

Hi Boomer!

First, confirmation of the statements you made:

1. REVO is hoping that after 6 months they will have enough money to try to expand their library, but you are spot on about it being just a single sound file applied to the board. Furthermore they do not have BEMF, and thus sounds that reflect the actual load on the locomotive and precise locking to the actual loco speed is, in my opinion, impossible. Also it takes a powerful processor, normally purpose built to handle more sophisticated sounds and controls. I don’t think the Revo has this, and this is not a knock at the Revo, it’s not it’s “niche”

2. On the phoenix: I think you are seeing a old hardware design at the end of it’s useful life, adding a lot of capability is probably not in the silicon. The second comment is interesting, if you provide sounds for yourself to use, no issues at all. Completely on the user.

OK, on to your 3 questions.

From it’s very early days, the QSI has allowed the downloading of an arbitrary sound file that you can play from a function key you program. It’s only one sound but RJ and I did the “All Aboard” from Tom Hanks in Polar Express.

Most of the European decoders allow you to create any sound files you wish and load them into the loco, i.e. the chuffing, bell, whistle, blow down, etc. In fact this is how they operate, they put together a “group” of sounds and those sounds are played at a certain “band” of speed.

Last time I drilled down, the Zimo allowed 10 such groups, but there are limits of storage and the compression you use on your sound files will also affect memory usage.

But you can do this today, and many many of the sound “projects” available for Zimo (for example again) are contributed by just normal people, not businesses.

There are some “premium” files available where you pay a one time fee of $25 or so.

This technique of groups of sounds related to the loco speed has been around for a long time, years.

Other boards, again using the QSI for example, do indeed use sound files, but they use sophisticated digital sound processing to simulate speed and load, rather than a bunch of files for different speeds. This takes more complex programming on the manufacturer side and more sophisticated electronics, but you need fewer sound files.

This might not have answered all of your questions, but what you are asking for is definitely available.

Regards, Greg

I just want to throw this out,I thought about 10 years ago MTH was able to do this in o gage and was wondering if there not doing it in G scale?

cheers richard

Greg or Boomer does the Airwire/Phoenix have the BEMF capability to match sound to loco load. That seems to be one thing I would want , as when I visit open houses most of the sounds I hear are a flat, no change in them sound , even when you can see the train slowing as it climbs a mountain, or speeding up going down the other side. Thanks for a great thread, lots of information I need to read it again to fully digest it all

Pete, you can tweak the “Johnson Bar” effect (steam sound files) on the Phoenix so that it varies the volume of the chuff as the loco speeds up and slows down, but it’s not based on BEMF at all. It’s based at least partially on the rate of change between chuff triggers, with (I’m presuming) a voltage component as well. I’ve run Phoenix-equipped tenders just by themselves (no motor voltage) and have heard the effect kick in, but then the Phoenix also has voltage-controlled chuff rates as well, so I’m presuming that it would look at changes in voltage if that option was chosen instead of chuff triggers.

You do need the programming interface to do that, and it’s finicky. Most of mine are set between 80 and 90 on the slider. Much lower than 80, and there’s no discernible change in the chuff. Too much, and the chuff goes away when slowing down (as it should) then begins to sound, well, flatulent as it continues to slow down and stop.

For the Phoenix diesel boards, I think that’s the “Rev Wander” feature. It’s been a while since I customized a Phoenix diesel board.

With respect to user-definable sounds, it can be done (see Greg’s comments about the Zimo boards), but the “by mere mortals” part of the equation is a bit suspect, I think. You would need the Zimo or ESU boards which allow you to upload software to the decoder via your computer. Dan Pierce would be a good one to ask about that. He works with TrainLi loading the various sound files from their libraries onto customers’ Zimo decoders before shipping them out to the customers. I’m not that familiar with ESU decoders, except to know they follow a similar model–sound files are assembled on the PC, then loaded to the decoder. (That, and they sound really good.)

The trend with US manufacturers (TCS, Soundtraxx) seems to be putting a whole bunch of sounds on the board, then letting the user select from that broad array of sounds via CVs or directories . There’s no option there for user-defined sounds since everything’s loaded at the factory. On the flip side, you’ve got 60 whistles, 10 chuffs, 30 bells, etc. to choose from on the decoder itself without needing a PC programming interface.

In terms of the functionality of loading your own sounds, I’m not sure how many folks would be into that beyond one or two fun things similar to what Greg described. I wonder if that might be just as easily handled by something like an MP3 player type thing, where you can trigger 3 or 4 sounds via some kind of trigger output like the accessory outputs on a Revolution or a lighting function output on a DCC decoder.

Later,

K

Pete

I am a user and can install the Phoenix boards. I am not a technician of Kevin or Greg’s caliber so let me give you the caveman version of what they said regarding chuff.

I use both PB-8 and PB-11 Phoenix boards so this may not apply to any of their older boards. All of my engines are set up using a reed switch mounted to the frame with magnets on the driver to trigger the beats of the chuff. These boards can also be set for voltage to trigger the chuff. It is either / or but not both. My friend “Ski” uses the voltage method preferring it since it requires no wiring. Adjusting the CV values in either mode requires a dongle and the software from Phoenix which is for sale on their website or from RLD. By adjusting those values you can dial in the synchronization pretty good. This is not complicated as the controls are visually similar to those provided for picture quality / features on your TV.

Both methods have a hesitancy at the beginning and end of their speed curve. It is much less noticeable with the reed switch. As you would expect the chuff rate increases and decreases with the engine speed. I cannot tell if their is any difference in the labor of the engine regarding grade or load but I do not think so. I have noticed the sound wave is elongated at slow speeds rather than just the timing of the chuff and it stumbles at high speeds. Both of these are caused by the fact that I have never adjusted their CV values. I am not sure I could do any better than the factory settings.

On a side note there is plenty of watts in the Phoenix systems and I am often asked by the other club members to turn my volume down. This is a benefit as I don’t hear so well (by choice according to Mrs Boomer) and my layout is in an open area with no enclosing walls or fences to amplify the sound.

There are some videos with sound on this page of both sound cards on level and up to 3% grades pulling various loads. #34 is a PB-8 and #51 is a PB-11.

ttps://cibolalmrr.wordpress.com/about/trains-running-on-the-layout/

I have no experience with diesel sounds

Actually putting the one wav file in the QSI is extremely simple.

For the Zimo to make a custom sound, it’s not so tough, but you normally have to edit sounds into a “loop” to get them to repeat seamlessly.

The product to download these sounds is the normal Zimo programmer, nothing else.

I’ll look to see if there is some document that spells out the steps to do this to put it into perspective.

Greg

There are several people doing sounds for the Zimo decoders and are in different countries.

Of course they do charge a fee (called a lode code).

Newest projects for American diesels even have notch speed steps via function keys.