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    • July 18, 2019 8:24 AM EDT
    • Michael Kirrene said:

       Too bad the TCS WOW isn't loud, though, like the Phoenix. 

       
       

      I don't run my Phoenix anywhere near max volume.   It gets annoying really quick being that loud.

    • July 18, 2019 6:55 AM EDT
    • Remember to look closely at the sound specs.  Many units state 1, 2, 0r  3 watts but that is to a 4 ohm speaker.  when using an 8 ohm speaker you will never get 3 watts audio.  ASlso baffle the speaker to prevent the sound from the rear mixing to the front.  I use yogurt cups lined with foam glued to the back of the speaker and the improvement is awesome!!

      Also make sure the speaker can drive the sound out with little or no interference.  I hollow out the grill of the Davenports , glue matching ribbon to the backside, then add the baffled speaker which is just foam glued around the rear of the speaker.

    • July 17, 2019 11:39 PM EDT
    • todd whittier said:

      Michael,   If you go with Airwire,you could go with a Tsunami sound decoder or TCS WOW sound board. I run Airwire and that’s the route I have gone. I feel some of the other sound system companies are offering more than the Phoenix systems do. I can get a Wow sound or Tsunami sound decoder for around $100. It comes already loaded With options Phoenix doesn’t offer. The only down fall is they aren’t as loud as the Phoenix can get. That works for me.I have Phoenix systems in several locos with Airwire also. They work well together.

       

       

      Todd I just checked out the TCS WOW, and you're right - Phoenix isn't the only game in town. Their EMD 567 and 645 16-bit diesel sounds are right up my alley for my Geeps, FA/B and NW-2 engines. Seems like their products cater more to the HO guys, which is understandable. Too bad the TCS WOW isn't loud, though, like the Phoenix. 

    • July 17, 2019 10:57 PM EDT
    • Thank you, Colin. Another good post with useful content. 

    • July 17, 2019 9:11 PM EDT
    • FWIW, I use the revo system.  I have it in 8 loco's (3 steam and 5 diesel) all on one transmitter.  I can run 1,2, and 3 trains all on the same track at the same time by switching from cab to cab.  I can also run consists using more than one locomotive.  Yes the sound system sucks, but you can add other sound systems.  I am currently looking at adding a Phoenix sound card in one to see how it works.  However other than satisfying me most people at our open houses or module meets do not know the difference.  When I run my trains at our module events, I do hand the controls over to some children (with their parents approval) to run the trains and blow the whistle.  The revo gives you the options to set the max speed and increase or decrease the amount of throttle.  If I did not have that programed in then I would not trust the kids with the controls.  For a child that does not have a train but is interested it is usually the highlight of the day for them.  I have not used the other system so I cannot chime in on it.

    • July 17, 2019 2:52 PM EDT
    • Michael Kirrene said:

      Greg, to be clear, sound is of utmost importance to me. I have to make a decision between the following (assuming I buy a Train Engineer 2.4 transmitter). I already have an Airwire transmitter. So in each loco, I would have either:

       

      1. Airwire Drop-in decoder, Phoenix sound card, and battery. Expensive.

      2. Revolution 2.4 receiver (w/built-in sound), and battery. Relatively inexpensive compared to #1.

      3. Revolution 2.4 receiver (built-in sound disconnected), Phoenix sound card, battery. A little less expensive than #1 but still expensive. 

       

      Phoenix currently has a much larger diesel/steam sound library specific to each type locomotive. Revo only has a couple of generic ones, and Navin at Revolution can't guarantee any new diesel sounds in the near future. Knob/push buttons vs. push buttons for forward and reverse. Understanding the "pay for whatcha get" philosophy, those are my options.

       

      Maybe I'm just too damn picky and should just go "Eenie meenie miney mo" between the two, select one and call it a day, eh?

       

      Well, I've not been successful to get this point across, but with your response above, I want to be sure that you "get" what I am telling you.

       

      First, sound quality is of top priority to me too.

       

      So I just want you to be aware that your "top" solution is NOT the "top" solution in terms of sound quality.

       

      Using a system where the motor controls come from one board and the sound from another will NEVER (there is a technical exception, but you SUSI guys please keep your mouths shut for now), repeat NEVER be as good as a solution where the motor controls and the sound controls are from the SAME board, i.e. the same microprocessor controls both.

       

      The most realistic sound systems are where the sound system tracks the motor speed tightly, but where the load on the locomotive ALSO modifies the sound output.

       

      You can only do this with a single "decoder" that controls both motor and sound, thus my continued suggestion that you either use the Airwire system + Convrtr + DCC decoder OR Revolution DCC system + DCC decoder.

       

      In terms of sound quality, you cannot match that level of realism with the Airwire with the G2/3 motor driver and a sound card OR an add on sound unit to the "standard" Revolution system.

       

      In terms of cost, these 2 alternatives cost pretty close to your 2 first suggestions.

       

      Greg (trying to help)

    • July 17, 2019 2:19 PM EDT
    • I have a USAT GP9 with an Airwire G3 Dropin, and no sound.  I use an older throttle.  My only complaint is that the system loses synch every now and again.

       

      I have a Dash 9, and 2 SD45s with REVO II, and I sometimes use the sound, but on the lowest level.  It seems that I can control them from the next county.  My complaint with this setup stems from the cheap speakers spec'd  by Aristo. After awhile, the sound degenerates to white noise.  Someday, I'll survey the speakers, but, today is not that day.

       

      I like both.

    • July 17, 2019 2:00 PM EDT
    • Michael,   If you go with Airwire,you could go with a Tsunami sound decoder or TCS WOW sound board. I run Airwire and that’s the route I have gone. I feel some of the other sound system companies are offering more than the Phoenix systems do. I can get a Wow sound or Tsunami sound decoder for around $100. It comes already loaded With options Phoenix doesn’t offer. The only down fall is they aren’t as loud as the Phoenix can get. That works for me.I have Phoenix systems in several locos with Airwire also. They work well together.

    • July 17, 2019 1:58 PM EDT
    • John, a lotta you guys that have been around a long time use the same thing you started out with. What are you using to run your trains out there amongst the Rattlesnakes?

    • July 17, 2019 1:06 PM EDT
    • Michael Kirrene said:
      Chris Kieffer said:

      Michael,

        If you like the Airwire / Phoenix combo but the cost is an issue; one option would be to install the Airwire and battery now, then and add the Phoenix at a later date.   It won't get you sound right away, but you will have it in the long run.   None of it is complicated to hook up, especially if you are using a drop in board.

       

      Chris

       

       

       

       

       

      Chris, I've thought of that, and you're probably right. While I would like to have each engine completely retrofitted one by one, I think I have no recourse but to do a little at a time. This ain't a poor man's hobby by no means.

       

      Welcome to G $cale!

    • July 17, 2019 12:20 PM EDT
    • Chris Kieffer said:

      Michael,

        If you like the Airwire / Phoenix combo but the cost is an issue; one option would be to install the Airwire and battery now, then and add the Phoenix at a later date.   It won't get you sound right away, but you will have it in the long run.   None of it is complicated to hook up, especially if you are using a drop in board.

       

      Chris

       

       

       

       

       

      Chris, I've thought of that, and you're probably right. While I would like to have each engine completely retrofitted one by one, I think I have no recourse but to do a little at a time. This ain't a poor man's hobby by no means.

       

    • July 17, 2019 8:23 AM EDT
    • Michael,

        If you like the Airwire / Phoenix combo but the cost is an issue; one option would be to install the Airwire and battery now, then and add the Phoenix at a later date.   It won't get you sound right away, but you will have it in the long run.   None of it is complicated to hook up, especially if you are using a drop in board.

       

      Chris

    • July 17, 2019 5:56 PM EDT
    • Steve Featherkile said:

      Well, we COULD get a DC plug, and pound it in with a 6 pound finishing tool.  

      Wait...what happened to the stick that we could root around with???

    • July 17, 2019 5:33 PM EDT
    • Steve Featherkile said:

      Well, we COULD get a DC plug, and pound it in with a 6 pound finishing tool.  

      Or spray him with FlexSeal. He can make his own bubble!

    • July 17, 2019 1:57 PM EDT
    • Well, we COULD get a DC plug, and pound it in with a 6 pound finishing tool.  

    • July 17, 2019 3:40 PM EDT
    • Ya know, you don't have to cross over or fool with a helix. Down in the SW you have another solution:

      The Ophir Loop;

      See, you don't even need a box canyon, throw up a couple of spectacular trestles and touch a foreign wall....

    • July 17, 2019 2:38 PM EDT
    • John Passaro said:

        ...I could turn one entire loop (of the two loops on the ground) into what would amount to a very long helix, kind of like the Georgetown Loop up there in Idaho Springs. Again, it would be quite an undertaking.

       

       

      yes! that's the right spirit!

      that will be a mountain of work, (pun intended) but in the end you will not only have your levels connected, but a lot of additional points of interest for viewing.

      Landscape, viaducts, bridges, trestles...  you name it.

       

      i have two grades of about 13 or 14 yards, that connect two levels.(about 2 ft height difference)

    • July 17, 2019 7:47 AM EDT
    • No double track shown, John; so there would not be any "Overtaking"....as in overtaking a train on the parallel track....!!

        Fred Mills

    • July 17, 2019 11:29 AM EDT
    • Norman, what are you thinking of doing, I'm working on getting a body of one and thinking about putting it on a big hauler chassis, I've got 1 section of the three section water tank that I could use to lengthen the body, just curious, Bill